WARNING! Controversial poll ahead,...

[Mr Nick]

Creation is what I believe

Many folks have referenced the Answers in Genesis website. Take an objective look and analyze the facts. Seek truth and you'll find it. Look for ways to support your own ideas, you'll find that too. I know that I personally have experienced changes in my life that prove the existence of God. I don't have to change your mind. Couldn't if I wanted to. Would like for everyone to discover truth though. Isn't that what Pilate asked Jesus? "What is truth?"

 

[MudInYerEye]

All this blasphemous evolution talk is pure poppycock! We were all created by Odin the Mighty.
God willing, I'll see you in Valhalla!

 

[WEEGEE]

EVERY DAY PUNCH THE CLOCK...IN A POSITIVE WAY

PUNCH WITH A SMILE


WILLIAM SHATNER
You'll Have Time
(William Shatner/Ben Folds)

Live life
Live life like you're gonna die
Becasue you're gonna
I hate to be the bearer of bad news
But you're gonna die

Maybe not today or even next year
But before you know it you'll be saying
"Is this all there was?
What was all the fuss?
Why did I bother?"

Now, maybe you won't suffer maybe it's quick
But you'll have time to think
Why did I waste it?
Why didn't I taste it?
You'll have time
Because you're gonna die.

Yes it's gonna happen because it's happened to a lot of people I know
My mother, my father, my loves
The president, the kings and the pope
They all had hope

And they muttered just before they went
Maybe, I won't let go
Live life like you're gonna die
Because you are

Maybe you won't suffer maybe it's quick
But you'll have time to think
Why did I waste it?
Why didn't I taste it?
You'll have time
'Cause you're gonna die

I tell you who else left us
Passed on down to heaven no longer with us
Johnny Cash, JFK, that guy in the Stones
Lou Gehrig, Einstein, and Joey Ramone
Have I convinced you?
Do you read my lips?
This may come as news but it's time
You're gonna die
You're gonna die

By the time you hear this I may well be dead
And you my friend might be next
'Cause we're all gonna die

Yeah, oh maybe you won't suffer and maybe it's quick
But you'll have time to think
Why did I waste it?
Why didn't I taste it?
You'll have time
You'll have time cause you're gonna die
Yes, you're gonna die
You're gonna die, I tell you
You're gonna die
You are gonna die

'Cause maybe you won't suffer maybe it's quick
But you have time to think
Why did I waste it?
Why didn't I taste it?
You'll have time 'cause you're gonna die

Live Life
Life life like you're gonna die
Because you're going to
Oh yes
I hate to be the beater of bad news
But you're gonna die

Maybe not today or even next year
But before you know it you'll be saying
"Is this all there was?
What was all the fuss?
Why did I bother?
Why did I waste it?
Why didn't I taste it?"
You'll have time, baby
You'll have time
'Cause you're gonna die
You are gonna die
Oh yeah

CHEERS...

 

[Mike K.]

 

[LizzieMaine]

The Monkey’s Disgrace

Three monkeys sat in a coconut tree,
Discussing things as they’re said to be.

Said one to the others, “Now listen, you two,
There’s a rumor around that can’t be true.

“That man descended from our noble race,
The very idea is a great disgrace.

“No monkey has ever deserted his wife,
Starved her babies and ruined her life.

“And you’ve never known a mother monk,
To leave her babies with others to bunk,

“Or to pass from one to another,
Till they scarcely know who is their mother.

“And another thing you’ll never see,
A monk build a fence around a coconut tree,

“And let the coconuts go to waste,
Forbidding all other monks a taste.

“Why if I’d build a fence around this tree,
starvation would force you to steal from me.

“Here’s another thing a monkey won’t do,
Go out at night and get on a stew,

“Or use a gun or club or knife,
To take some other monkey’s life.

“Yes, man descended, the ornery cuss,
But, brother, he didn’t descend from us!”

[The late L. L. Miller]

 

[LaMedicine]

The Monkey’s Disgrace
[The late L. L. Miller]

Mizaru, Kikazaru, Iwazaru...See No Evil, Hear No Evil, Say No Evil.

 

[Maj.Nick Danger]

I know those guys!

Mizaru, Kikazaru, Iwazaru...See No Evil, Hear No Evil, Say No Evil.

Are they originally from Japan?

 

[airfrogusmc]

In my opinion they are one in the same. Evolution wasn't an accident it was Gods plan. To me they are one in the same. Whats a day to God could be millions of years to us.

 

[Maj.Nick Danger]

I really don't know any scientists that are in it for the money. Maybe I'm in the wrong field, but every last one I know is pretty broke, and the ones who aren't have wives that are doctors and lawyers. With all of the money spent on schooling and training, it doesn't seem like a career path chosen for profit at all. All are deeply passionate about what they do, however. Egotism, maybe, but really. For a scientist to be accepted, they've got to publish in peer-reviewed journals, where other scientists in their field do their damnedest to rip apart the assertions. They'd have to diliberately fool a huge amount of people, and even then, to just be smug and at the same time know that they are false? I haven't met a single biologist with those motivations yet.

To believe in Intelligent Design is a dead end, scientifically. Science isn't about dead ends. Evolution opens up whole new perspectives that can be independantly tested using NATURAL observations. ID, what else is there to say but 'God did it' and then start thinking about God's motivations. There is no way to use natural observations to assert a supernatural presence without a leap of faith. Again, power to you, but it's a leap of faith, not logic. Just because you can't picture a Godless existance doesn't mean that its not possible, and not probable.

1. I must clarify my point. I was reffering specifically to some in the scientific community that study the history of mankind. Paleontologists that expect others to accept their assertians that a jumble of bazillion year old bones from who knows how many different creatures could possibly be what they claim them to be. It takes a huge leap of faith on my part to believe their claims. Also some archaeologists claims become more and more implausable, the further back in time they attempt to go. In Egyptology for instance, the accepted belief is that the ancient Egyptians built the Great Pyramid at Giza, and the Egyptologists love to praise themselves as to how much they "know" about it. lol Geological evidence at Giza points to a far earlier date for the construction of the monuments, yet they ignore this evidence in order to bolster their own beliefs.
2. On the contrary, the more we delve into all of the sciences, the more questions it raises. The universe appears to be infinitely huge, and yet at the same time it goes to the infinitely small.

 

[LaMedicine]

Are they originally from Japan?

These particular guys are. They are part of a decoration of the Nikko Toshogu Shrine. The proverb itself is from China, and came to Japan in the 8th century, and originally have nothing to do with monkeys. Monkeys came into play because of the double innuendo that can be put into the Japanese translation from the original Chinese. "Zaru" is a negative verb form, "not to", but as pronunciation, is the liaisoned form of "saru" while monkey in Japanese is also "Saru." Hence the three monkeys.

 

[Maj.Nick Danger]

These particular guys are. They are part of a decoration of the Nikko Toshogu Shrine. The proverb itself is from China, and came to Japan in the 8th century, and originally have nothing to do with monkeys. Monkeys came into play because of the double innuendo that can be put into the Japanese translation from the original Chinese. "Zaru" is a negative verb form, "not to", but as pronunciation, is the liaisoned form of "saru" while monkey in Japanese is also "Saru." Hence the three monkeys.

Thanks for the info.

 

[Briscoeteque]

1. On the contrary, the more we delve into all of the sciences, the more questions it raises. The universe appears to be infinitely huge, and yet at the same time it goes to the infinitely small.

I agree with this, and that's why ID is an inferior theory (doesn't mean less true) to Evolution. It doesn't raise enough new questions, and it instead closes them off. Evolutionary theory has completely redefined biology, and provides new reasoning for phenomona all of the time. For example, anti-biotics becoming less useful. By saying that anti-biotics in the past killed all bacteria most vulnerable to them, and today's bacteria, bred predominately from more immune strains, are far more resistant than those in the past. This is happening, and that's why they don't give out penicillin like water anymore. Intelligent Design doesn't offer much to this. Whereas evolutionary theory could be used to examine the how and the why, Intelligent Design puts the entire matter in the hands of a being we have no control over. Again, still could be true, but just a less helpful theory when trying to experiment. And of course, NOT science.

Those logical proofs of God seem interesting, I've had them told to me before, but in far simpler terms that pretty much amounted to 'Too much for men to understand, must be the Divine'. In my opinion, the Divine should never be a cop out. Those proofs make alot of sense.

 

[Etienne]

An interesting thread, to be sure!

I was struck today by the contrast in something LizzieMaine said and an email I received from a friend. (Sorry, I don't know exactly how to bring up the quote in a box, so I am re-writing it):

"Given the fact that I'm nearsighted, pot-bellied, flat-footed and suffer from excruciating sciata, there's no way I could be anything by an accident. An intelligent designer couldn't possibly do such a slipshod job."

My friend is a 32 year old woman who has had very severe cerebral palsy since birth. She has never crawled, stood, walked or been able to speak so she can be understood by anyone except the few who can interpret her sounds. She has extremely limited use of her arms and hands and can only use 2 digits to do anything--and those things are done exceedingly slowly as her arms and hands (and legs and feet) are terribly spastic. She is bright, she uses her 2 fingers to stab at the computer to write, and she takes classes online.

Her email to me said, "Daily I thank God for the wonderful gift of life He has given me!! His Word tells me I am 'fearfully and wonderfully made' and I know that I am His child. Life has given me so many opportunities to share His love in my own way. I am SO blessed!!"

Now THERE'S two different perspectives for you! Both give me lots to think about. This is a really interesting, provacative thread! Thanks for the food for thought!

 

[Maj.Nick Danger]

An interesting thread, to be sure!

I was struck today by the contrast in something LizzieMaine said and an email I received from a friend. (Sorry, I don't know exactly how to bring up the quote in a box, so I am re-writing it):

"Given the fact that I'm nearsighted, pot-bellied, flat-footed and suffer from excruciating sciata, there's no way I could be anything by an accident. An intelligent designer couldn't possibly do such a slipshod job."

My friend is a 32 year old woman who has had very severe cerebral palsy since birth. She has never crawled, stood, walked or been able to speak so she can be understood by anyone except the few who can interpret her sounds. She has extremely limited use of her arms and hands and can only use 2 digits to do anything--and those things are done exceedingly slowly as her arms and hands (and legs and feet) are terribly spastic. She is bright, she uses her 2 fingers to stab at the computer to write, and she takes classes online.

Her email to me said, "Daily I thank God for the wonderful gift of life He has given me!! His Word tells me I am 'fearfully and wonderfully made' and I know that I am His child. Life has given me so many opportunities to share His love in my own way. I am SO blessed!!"

Now THERE'S two different perspectives for you! Both give me lots to think about. This is a really interesting, provacative thread! Thanks for the food for thought!

And thank you. No matter what we may choose to believe, we can all learn from your friend.

 

[jake_fink]

Evolutionists have a lead, but what surprises me are the number of ID people (combination). For such a new idea, it has so many adherents. Interesting.

bk

Explanations?:

It's a theory that plays tennis on both sides of the fence. It's safer. It allows reason in the door then beats it down with fear of the big guy. It's just trendy.

 

[jake_fink]

All this blasphemous evolution talk is pure poppycock! We were all created by Odin the Mighty.
God willing, I'll see you in Valhalla!

Right on brother!

 

[Benny Holiday]

My own personal faith is quite simple. I think that there is a divine. But I also think that a supreme being is secure enough to not demand people worship and think about him all of the time. Cause, it's kind of supreme. If I was a supreme being, I would want everyone to enjoy the life and universe that I gave to them

When God created mankind, it was very much a Father-child relationship, one of immense love. He gave us everything we needed to enjoy life and the universe He gave us, but He also gave us freedom of choice, and Adam chose to know sin and live his own way.

God doesn't demand worship because He's a tryrant (although this is Satan's argument); He wants a personal relationship with people because He loves them, just as we who have children want strong and loving relationships with them. Which is why Jesus taught the people that God was not a dictator trying to catch them out all the time (again that's Satan's job, the 'accuser of the people') but taught them to call Him 'Abba', or 'Father', Someone who loves them and cares for them infinitely more than flawed human parents ever could.

 

[Briscoeteque]

When God created mankind, it was very much a Father-child relationship, one of immense love. He gave us everything we needed to enjoy life and the universe He gave us, but He also gave us freedom of choice, and Adam chose to know sin and live his own way.

God doesn't demand worship because He's a tryrant (although this is Satan's argument); He wants a personal relationship with people because He loves them, just as we who have children want strong and loving relationships with them. Which is why Jesus taught the people that God was not a dictator trying to catch them out all the time (again that's Satan's job, the 'accuser of the people') but taught them to call Him 'Abba', or 'Father', Someone who loves them and cares for them infinitely more than flawed human parents ever could.

So what's the point of worship? Let's say my own father was perfect, without flaws, and full of infinate love for my bum of a self. I still wouldn't worship him. I'd love and respect him to the extreame, but that is still not worship. I can have beautiful personal relationships without worship, without praying and saying how great someone is all of the time, even if they are.

Plus, I'm quite glad I know sin. Don't want to go way too off topic, so I'll leave it at that.

 

[Benny Holiday]

Well, I don't think the person whose spouse has cheated on them, or the parents whose child's been killed by a drunk driver, or the woman who's been raped is glad to know sin . . .

Whether you like it or not Briscoteque, everybody worships. Many people believe that the God Who created all things is worthy of worship and praise, but for others it can be money, power, drugs, movie stars, singers (the name Elvis Presley springs to mind as the best example there), material goods, the list goes on. If we don't recognise God as worthy of worship, we'll look for something else to bow down to.

The need to worship is a natural part of human nature. The New Testament shows Jesus and His followers walking and talking and eating together, in a relationship that was part friendship and part teacher/student. There were times, though, when His divinity shone through His human disguise, and his followers automatically felt at His feet in awe and respect (worship). He didn't have to command them to do it; it was their natural reaction to His divine majesty.

 

[Briscoeteque]

Well, I don't think the person whose spouse has cheated on them, or the parents whose child's been killed by a drunk driver, or the woman who's been raped is glad to know sin . . .

Whether you like it or not Briscoteque, everybody worships. Many people believe that the God Who created all things is worthy of worship and praise, but for others it can be money, power, drugs, movie stars, singers (the name Elvis Presley springs to mind as the best example there), material goods, the list goes on. If we don't recognise God as worthy of worship, we'll look for something else to bow down to.

The need to worship is a natural part of human nature. The New Testament shows Jesus and His followers walking and talking and eating together, in a relationship that was part friendship and part teacher/student. There were times, though, when His divinity shone through His human disguise, and his followers automatically felt at His feet in awe and respect (worship). He didn't have to command them to do it; it was their natural reaction to His divine majesty.

Then how come I don't have it? I don't worship anyone, or anything, and never felt the need to do so. Maybe you do, maybe other people do, but I don't and have never felt the urge to. Sure, I love reading about certain people, respect their accomplishments and emulate their style, but worship? Hardly. I have been moved emotionally to the point of tears by something as simple as walking through a park followed by the moon and the sun. But never did I feel the need to bow down. As someone who loves a lot of things, among them money, power, drugs, artists, nature, I can claim with some certainty that I have never wanted to outright worship any of it. I can understand being so moved like you said by the Divine, although I feel personally doing so would be very unfair, but I don't believe it is a sentiment that demands a substitution by any means. Perhaps I have a sociopath-like condition here, but I really see that a blessing more than anything else.

I noticed that every sin you mentioned is a very particular sort, that between one and somebody else. Dozens of 'sins' are really just risky behaviors to oneself and it's up to one's self to decide if the risk is worth it.