The Adventurer's Gear Thread

[Alan Eardley]

I think they're almost identical, especially the officers one's. The Ratings seem to have had double front buckles, like the army.

So my trousers (which obviously lack a label or I wouldn't be asking) are probably either pre-war army officers or wartime RN officers?

The buttons are in a pale phenolic resin (early plastic) that looks like old ivory, BTW.

Alan

 

[Cobden]

Tricky, really, to tell the difference. I'd imagine that wartime RN ones don't have belt loops, or if they do, are the size for a money belt. Prewar army trousers, however, probably wouldn't either, as trousers were only worn with SD (the loops on mine are for a Sam Browne). Army one's would probably have a high back or at least brace buttons, as they were pretty much only worn with a jacket.

Of course, I hasten to add, that I'm pretty much only in the belief that mine are prewar officers on the belt loops and the general "skirt" shape!

 

[cookie]

UK Military Shorts

Can you still get these in big sizes? Officers or ORs same same

 

[Alan Eardley]

Cobden

I'm confused (again).

Even with the help of 'Khaki Drill and Jungle Green' by Brayley and Ingram I thought I had a handle on war-time KDs, but now I'm not so sure, particularly with regard to the post-war and pre-war periods.

Your shorts are very like the officers' long trousers I have (which in turn are, I think, like the ORs' but without the map pocket) that I believe to be post-war. You have almost convinced me that my 'longs' may be pre-war, but before I become completely convinced, do they have a single buttoned back pocket without a flap?

Alan

Here's a pair of prewar Army officers, or wartime RN, shorts:

 

[Doug C]

Dutch military shorts..

Hey guys since we're on the subject of military shorts, I just picked up a pair of vintage 1960's blue navy Dutch military shorts. I love these 'cause you rarely see anything besides khaki colored military short. They have a very cool loose cut to them with a waist band that overlaps itself sort of like the british one but much less severly. They also have introverted pleats on the front and no back pockets, an internal draw-string in a wide black herringbone fabric that also lines the button fly (metal buttons), the interior is lined in a thin black flannel. These are very cool but unfortunately they are too small for me - the auction said they measure 34 but they're closer to 32, length is somewhere around 20-21". PM me if anyone's interested in these as I'm gonna try to re-sale them eventually, btw they're not a repro.

Doug C

 

[nobodyspecial]

Anybody here like commando sweaters? I have a traditional, navy v-neck version that I think is great. Someday I may pick up a traditional OD, crew neck version as well.

I recently stumbled upon this sweater via an ebay auction, http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=230179857679&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=013 and just placed an order for one via the seller's web site in my size. I've not seen this particular style before. The sweater looks like a modified Dachstein sweater from years past. I'd post a picture of a Dachstein sweater from from a late 1970's Yak Works catalog if I could figure out how - momentary brain feeze. :eusa_doh: In any event, if the quality is good the price is a bargain.

I have a Dachstein cardigan that I found in a thrift store and I love the sweater, although even in Minnesota the temps rarely get low enough to wear the sweater much.

 

[cookie]

Dutch Duds

Hey guys since we're on the subject of military shorts, I just picked up a pair of vintage 1960's blue navy Dutch military shorts. I love these 'cause you rarely see anything besides khaki colored military short. They have a very cool loose cut to them with a waist band that overlaps itself sort of like the british one but much less severly. They also have introverted pleats on the front and no back pockets, an internal draw-string in a wide black herringbone fabric that also lines the button fly (metal buttons), the interior is lined in a thin black flannel. These are very cool but unfortunately they are too small for me - the auction said they measure 34 but they're closer to 32, length is somewhere around 20-21". PM me if anyone's interested in these as I'm gonna try to re-sale them eventually, btw they're not a repro.

Doug C

Photos please for the thread....

 

[Cobden]

Cobden

I'm confused (again).

Even with the help of 'Khaki Drill and Jungle Green' by Brayley and Ingram I thought I had a handle on war-time KDs, but now I'm not so sure, particularly with regard to the post-war and pre-war periods.

Your shorts are very like the officers' long trousers I have (which in turn are, I think, like the ORs' but without the map pocket) that I believe to be post-war. You have almost convinced me that my 'longs' may be pre-war, but before I become completely convinced, do they have a single buttoned back pocket without a flap?

Alan

Mine do have a pocket like you describe, the problem is with pre-war, and indeed post-war, officer's tropical kit (and, to some extent, OR's too) was made largely to personal or unit preference.

 

[benstephens]

I think Cobden is correct in his last statement -personal preference-. the biggest problem for any uniform researcher of tropical uniforms are the huge proportions which were made in theatre, often not following the official pattern.

Tailoring was very cheap throughout north Africa and India where many troops saw service, and they were able to get uniforms tailored to fit them, and quite often, slight variations from the official regulations were exhibited.

I have a pair of very high waisted shorts, large belt loops and worn by a serjeant just pre war. The buttons on the jacket are made of tortoise shell, and the pockets are very elaborate. It seems to follow a number of different pre-war uniform regulations, but not following any exactly.

To get the best idea of an actual garment that follows regulations, check that it is W/|D marked, or AM marked (For early war items, this was superseded later in the war by WD(These are the inspection stamps, often having a letter above and a number below, the letter above relates to the date it was inspected)). Anything with a C/| (Date or number)stamp is of Indian manufacture (not to be mistaken for the C with a broad arrow inside for the Canadians) and can often be of shoddy/incorrect pattern as specified by the War department, although mostly the major difference is the grade of material as well as having there own specified patterns. .

As for RN items, I think Cobden is the best man to answer that.

Kindest regards

Ben

 

[DnSchlng]

can anyone tell me where you could get good comfotable and useful, old fashioned tall safari boots. The ones that go up to about your knees.

 

[Mojave Jack]

can anyone tell me where you could get good comfotable and useful, old fashioned tall safari boots. The ones that go up to about your knees.

You must mean boots like these:

Sorry, Scotrace, had to roll out that pic, again!

Actually, What Price Glory had the M1931 boots (the full lace-up type boot) for $175. A really phenomenal price, though I've not talked to anyone about the quality. If I didn't already have the ones above I would have leapt on that deal.

Otherwise they are tough to find in brown, and when you do they can run into some pretty high figures. I've not even been able to find a pair like Lord Roxton's, the black ones with the brown tops.

 

[Fletch]

I looked into that type boot awhile back. The reason there are no brown ones is that high boots are used almost nowhere today except in show riding, where conformity to black leathers is almost universal. Brown is limited to a few ritual contexts, like the Mounties' ceremonial dress and Texas Aggie senior cadets. Both order custom-made boots at great expense, and consider them cherished emblems of esprit de corps which nobody else has any business wearing.

As for the 1931 boots, Jerry took only a trial run and ran out almost immediately. He does not welcome inquiries about when things will be back in stock, or even if.

The full laceups were considered the most practical type back in the day. Pilots most often wore this type with flight kit. Yours are field boots, which were more typical of horsey folk and dress uniform.

 

[Indy Magnoli]

Not sure if I've already posted these to this thread (at 65 pages, it's hard to keep track), but these are some full-lacers I made for someone tramping through the Amazon:

They were requested with lug soles, but could easily be made with flat soles for a more traditional look.

And, of course, there is always my version of the traditional field boot:

Kind regards,
Indy

 

[eightbore]

check out...

http://www.canadianmountie.com/uniforms/uni-RCMP-footwear.html

Then email... rob@canadianmountie.com for a set of standard issue mountie "High Browns" for only $350 plus shipping. Tough to beat that for authentic riding wear!

eightbore

 

[eightbore]

also found this link...

http://www.albertaboot.com/police_boots.htm

where they sell these...

 

[scotrace]

Curse you Red Baron!!!

 

[johnnycanuck]

I can vouch for the Alberta Boot Company Boots. I don't own a pair of the RCMP boots but I have a few pairs of their cowboy boots. With daily use the soles last about two to three years and can be resoled at the factory for about $75.
Johnny

 

[Mojave Jack]

I looked into that type boot awhile back. The reason there are no brown ones is that high boots are used almost nowhere today except in show riding, where conformity to black leathers is almost universal. Brown is limited to a few ritual contexts, like the Mounties' ceremonial dress and Texas Aggie senior cadets. Both order custom-made boots at great expense, and consider them cherished emblems of esprit de corps which nobody else has any business wearing.

As for the 1931 boots, Jerry took only a trial run and ran out almost immediately. He does not welcome inquiries about when things will be back in stock, or even if.

The full laceups were considered the most practical type back in the day. Pilots most often wore this type with flight kit. Yours are field boots, which were more typical of horsey folk and dress uniform.

Yes, Jerry is not one to spend time chatting on the phone about anything, really, let alone questions of "when?" Seems to be a pretty common trait amongst those is the business of replicating historical uniforms, i.e. the "khaki rant" at At The Front. Juan at WWII Impressions is pretty friendly, probably recognizing that yes, his stuff is expensive, but (hopefully) worth it, and an acidic and impatient tone doesn't really encourage repeat customers. Jerry is generally not rude, just...succinct.

Most accounts I have read on the full lace-ups is that they were disliked due to the time it took to put them on. Certainly that was the case with the boots issued early on to the German desert troops of the Afrika Korps. They were universally hated, both due to the time it took to lace them and the fact that they were hot. I could see where pilots would prefer them, though, since they fit closer than riding boots, and would thus make ingress and egress a little easier. In historic photos, though, I see a lot of both, including riding boots without the lacing found on field boots. Once the cockpits started becoming enclosed the pilots were the first to drop the boots in favor of trousers. They did retain them for ceremonial wear, and, apparently, just to impress chicks.

The Mountie Strathcona boot is nice, but is not very flexible if you want to use it for re-enacting, unless your doing a Mountie or a South African War impersonation.

 

[Fletch]

USAAC airmen ca. 1930

Wearing A-1 jackets and 2 kinds of boot: a full-laced and something with a whole buncha buckles or fast-closing clips. Sort of halfway between the laceup and the Patton type tri-buckles.

Note also that the Air Corps adopted trousers well before the rest of the Army did (not till 1937!). Some of them in the 30s even had cuffs.

 

[eightbore]

"unless your doing a Mountie or a South African War impersonation."

Precisely! There probably isn't adventure gear in Southern Africa more ubiquitous in the early 20th century than that previously used by resident military forces. I agree, not proper for WWII era adventure, but pretty darn good if you're doing an early 20th century African hunter.

eightbore