Optimo and Art

[gtdean48]

Definitely NOT say anything against Graham...

This is more of me stating MY tendancy toward nit-picky-ness. I am more than certain he would've made it right at your request. You're better man than I, Gunga Din...or something like that...

 

[Andykev]

Graham vs. Art

Let me add a comment here regarding Art and Graham. Both outstanding hatters. There is a difference between the two operations however. Art is a "sole artist", while Graham is running a business with several employees. Big difference. Art's hats are purely "hand made" in every step..he sands, blocks and finishes the hat body, sews in by hand the sweat and the ribbon, and the liner. Graham does use his ladies to trim the hats. They do excellent work. Graham is set up for cleaning and refurbishing hats. I believe Art prefers to make hats, rather than be a "clean and block". Graham has solvent tanks and spinners...and "clean and block" used to be done I think at his shop on Thursdays. If anyone has cleaned a hat properly, you know it takes a LOT of time, chemicals, and deconstruction/reassembly PER HAT. That is not cost effective for a solo artist.

I have over 15 Optimo's (straw and felts), and about the same number (including straws) of Art's.

My personal preference now is Art's wonderful creations. The felt is superior to what Graham has used in the past. I have not ordered from Optimo in a couple years, so if Art is correct and Graham has switched to pure beaver, then the quality will be much more desirable. Remember, when I bought hats from Optimo, years ago, he was the ONLY GAME IN TOWN. He personally called me to ask how I liked the hat. Graham is a true gentleman...and he will always make things right if there is any problems with the hat, shape, brim, or whatever. Graham really knows his hat's, ESPECIALLY STRAW. If you want the best Panama/Montecristi, look no further than Graham. Now I do have some Panama Bob hats..and they are very good..and a bargain. But, my Super Fino Montecristi from Optimo are spectacular.

The nice thing about the FEDORA LOUNGE is that many "reviews" have been posted....from all our good hat makers. Do your homework, call that person, and select what is best for you and your budget.

I have been delighted with both Art and Graham's work, and I consider each to be a very good friend......I can call either hatter and they recognize my voice....I like to think that I am a "star customer". Alas, I have slowed down on my hat purchases....adding my vintage hats to my "hat tally"...I think I will never run out of hats for the rest of my life!

 

[Art Fawcett]

If I see anymore back and forth nonsense that doesn't belong in this thread, it gets deleted.

With all due respect Matt, I need to respond to Tomasso's last post because to NOT respond would be to imply he was correct.
For the record, I, along with Gary White, Gus Miller, and others DO block hats for PanamaBob. I do NOT accept that this makes either myself or the other Gents I mention responsible for Robert's words or actions as "business associates" any more than I am responsible for Tomasso's words & actions.
To paint myself or any others in that box is wrong.
As for Brent Black being my whipping boy? Are you kidding?

 

[David Conwill]

I don't see Graham & Art in an adversarial position. I think their different styles co-exist harmoniously...

I wondered about this - what are their differences? If I had to guess, I'd say that Art's hats are crafted in a more vintage style and that the Optimo hats are styled in a more contemporary manner, is that correct?

-Dave

 

[Subvet642]

Back to beautiful hats...

Art, I'm kinda new around here, so I just discovered your hats a few weeks ago, but I gotta say that your Trackside is the prettiest damned hat I've ever seen (at least so far )!

 

[Delthayre]

Invocations from without mean hollowness within

As a more technical matter of comparison, would be interested in knowing if there is difference, particular in weight, between Mister Fawcett's 'artlite' felt and Optimo's lightweight felt. I would also like to know what Optimo's featherweight felt is like. My guess is that featherweight is even lighter and thinner than lightweight felt, but that isn't really very much information.

 

[jamespowers]

As a more technical matter of comparison, would be interested in knowing if there was difference, particular in weight, between Mister Fawcett's 'artlite' felt and Optimo's lightweight felt. I would also like to know what Optimo's featherweight felt is like. My guess is that featherweight is even lighter and thinner than lightweight felt, but that isn't really very much information.

That sounds more like an insinuation rather than a question. [huh]
The true featherweight that most modern felts would be measured would be something like the Champ Featherweight. That is a very light weight hat.

 

[gtdean48]

As a more technical matter of comparison, would be interested in knowing if there was difference, particular in weight, between Mister Fawcett's 'artlite' felt and Optimo's lightweight felt. I would also like to know what Optimo's featherweight felt is like. My guess is that featherweight is even lighter and thinner than lightweight felt, but that isn't really very much information.

That is a good question. I know Major Moore buys from Winchester like Art, so his MooreLite is comparable to an ArtLite. How are those compared to a Optimo Lightweight & Featherweight? Anybody own 1 of each that can write it up?

 

[Delthayre]

'Tis poison~!

Mister Fawcett mentioned elsewhere that he collaborated with Gary White on the lightweight felt, so I thus assume that Misters Fawcett, Moore and White use the same felt.

That sounds more like an insinuation rather than a question. [huh] .

Well, let me buy your imagination a drink, tell it that there's nothing to worry about and explain that I am insinuating nothing, but making certain inquiries as I intend to buy two lightweight felt hats some time in the future and want to know more about the choices that I can make. I also wanted to try to draw more practical information out of this thread and urge it toward drier, technical matters.

 

[gtdean48]

I'm going to buy a MooreLite & for the benefit of the Lounge, I'll let y'all do a collection & buy me an Optimo Featherlite inorder to write up a concise comparison....the least I could do, right?

 

[Feraud]

As a more technical matter of comparison, would be interested in knowing if there is difference, particular in weight, between Mister Fawcett's 'artlite' felt and Optimo's lightweight felt. I would also like to know what Optimo's featherweight felt is like. My guess is that featherweight is even lighter and thinner than lightweight felt, but that isn't really very much information.

I too am interested in the technical information.
The best way to do this is for anyone who owns a lightweight hat (vintage and modern) to put 'em on the scale. Let's collect the data and present the straight facts on felt weight.

 

[carouselvic]

Champ Featherweight claims 2 1/2 oz.



on a weight watcher scale it weighed 3-3 1/4 oz.
truth in advertising has come a long way

 

[Panamabob]

You've sat by for years letting your business associate, Panama Bob, disparage just about every one of his/your competitors without as much as a peep.

Since I've started peeping, some people have actually started to help the artisans in Ecuador instead of lie about the help and support that they were or weren't giving. When the indentured servitude changes into something else, I'll let you know, but for now the help is nothing more than indentured servitude. Care to go with me to Pile and see?

We'll soon be priced out of the market, as some as yet unnamed American is paying $500.00 over cost for each Montecristi superfino, so noone will have to worry about us selling them once we're sold out.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again, Graham makes a honey of a Montecristi and I often suggest him to Midwesterners. In fact, just did that yesterday to a man who lives within 15 minutes of another hatter I deal with regularly in the South.

 

[jamespowers]

2 1/2 ounces sounds right for a featherweight. Lighter than that and you are going to have a tissue paper felt.

 

[carouselvic]

Back in the 70's all lids were 1 oz. ....or so I'm told.

 

[jamespowers]

Back in the 70's all lids were 1 oz. ....or so I'm told.

Nothing good came from back then.

 

[jimmy the lid]

Nothing good came from back then.

Except Victor's album, which I'm listening to right now. Dude, it's awesome...

Cheers,
JtL

 

[carouselvic]

The present isn't all it's cracked-up to be either!

 

[Brad Bowers]

Crofut & Knapp's lightweights in the '20s, like their Cross Country, were 2.5 ounces, without liners.

Their standard hats weighed in around 4 ounces.

Brad

 

[jamespowers]

The present isn't all it's cracked-up to be either!

Two words---Leisure suit.