Is dressing vintage a purely modern day phenomenon?

[Puzzicato]

That sounds amazing. Are there pictures of her?

 

[LizzieMaine]

I've never seen an adult photo of her -- but here she is as a child:

This painting, done about 1850, still hangs in the parlor of her home. Some folks find it rather eerie. (She was 97 years old when she died in 1935.)

Here's the Museum's official page on the house -- home of our city's first known flush toilet! Who says vintage people can't be progressive?

 

[Bustercat]

Can't load the picture lizzie...

 

[LizzieMaine]

Dratted Life archives don't make it easy --

Try this link.

 

[Mojito]

I'm tremendously fond of the second wave French Romantic movement of the 1820s-30s. There was a subculture within the movement that thoroughly enjoyed anachronistic dressing. Some of the outfits - medieval doublets and the like - were probably within the realms of re-created costume replicas, but others were original pieces. There are accounts of men wearing outfits from the First Republic period of the 1790s, and inidividuals like Gautier rather enjoyed their tricorn hats. At the premiere of Victor Hugo's Hernani in 1830 there was a whole array of what would have been "vintage" outfits on display. Hope too many of them weren't destroyed when the "Battle of Hernani" (a stoush between the Romantics and Classicists) erupted!

 

[Puzzicato]

I've never seen an adult photo of her -- but here she is as a child:

This painting, done about 1850, still hangs in the parlor of her home. Some folks find it rather eerie. (She was 97 years old when she died in 1935.)

Here's the Museum's official page on the house -- home of our city's first known flush toilet! Who says vintage people can't be progressive?

I googled and saw that painting but I wasn't sure it was the right woman! It is slightly eerie. I bet she gets down and walks around when no one is looking.

I assume she never married? There seems to be much more scope for eccentricity if you avoid marriage.

 

[LizzieMaine]

Nope, Lucy never married -- and was utterly, absolutely devoted to preserving the memory of her father and his accomplishments, which I suspect is the reason she froze her own life at the point where he passed away. I think all the best eccentrics have, in their own mind, a perfectly sound and logical reason for doing what they do -- they aren't self-consciously trying to be unusual or outrageous like so many modern-type "eccentrics." True eccentricity is not ironic or self-conscious, it's absolutely and utterly sincere.

 

[Undertow]

I have had this conversation with my grandfather regarding old hats. He was born in the late 20's on an Iowa farm. They basically wore overalls, cotton shirts, straw hats, work boots; but nothing identifiably "vintage".

I asked him if he had any fedoras, seeing as he was a young GI returning home from the war in the 40's and was exposed to such fashions. His answer confused me at first: "No...my dad wore hats, but I never wore one - most guys my age were too poor to get nice hats." He then continued on to equate hats with "old times" (1910's and previous), and as there was little utility to a hat, he didn't see any necessity in wearing one.

I asked if he knew where his dad's suits and hats went off to, "We buried him in his nicest suit, but threw the rest away. It didn't fit anyone anyway." Which leads into Lizzie's statement:

Young people, however, didn't go in for wearing vintage clothes -- most likely because the older people were still wearing them!

He told me receiving a suit, or shoes, or a hat was a pretty big deal when he was young, and you wore those things until they quite literally fell apart and were unservicable. If mom or grandma (or later, your wife) couldn't sew it back together, patch it or glue it, then it was likely lost to the garbage. But if you were poor like everyone else, you probably still wore it anyway until you simply could no longer wear it at all. And depending on your employment, you may not have ever needed more than one suit and one pair of dress shoes. In fact, my grandfather gave me one of his only suits from his 20's (40's era); something he wore to dances, funerals, weddings, parties, etc. It's heavy wool, blue and white herringbone (looks atrocious) and it's in relatively good shape, aside from some heavy wear to the silk liner.

In other words, there weren't any "vintage" clothes to purchase or pass down because they were so worn thin or destroyed that you would be a fool to purchase them second-hand. Moreover, "old time" clothes seemed silly because they belonged to a previous generation. Sure, there was your old money that still wore heavy wool sport jackets, or top hats, but those were trappings of that social echelon or clothes saved for utility. As a depression era farmer, post war GI, and eventually a federal employee making his way through the 60's-80's with a large family, "vintage" didn't really exist and wasn't exactly necessary.

 

[JimWagner]

While there may be some examples of some quite well off people (with time and money on their hands) from earlier generations dressing differently than everyone else, most "normal" people were much too busy earning their existences to have either the time, money, or inclinations to do so.

I think this is more a phenomenon of today where there is more disposable income, more leisure time, and far more exposure to instant information in the form of tv and the internet.

Before WWII the US was primarily a rural culture focused on survival. After WWII the greatest generation was trying to forget the war and adapt to the suburbanization and new economy.

It's significant (to me) that both the generations of the roaring twenties and the 60's where you see the younger generations cutting loose were the children of the major war years. The great depression put an end to a lot of the foolishness of the 20's, but the economy hung together after WWII and now we've had an extended period of prosperity and "idleness". So, yes, I think that this interest in dressing vintage is recent and just another (harmless) example of what the mostly younger folks do when there isn't a major war or depression to monopolize their time and thoughts.

 

[HadleyH]

While there may be some examples of some quite well off people (with time and money on their hands) from earlier generations dressing differently than everyone else, most "normal" people were much too busy earning their existences to have either the time, money, or inclinations to do so.

And the same applies today. Internet or not internet.

 

[Puzzicato]

True eccentricity is not ironic or self-conscious, it's absolutely and utterly sincere.

:eusa_clap So true!

I get particularly irritated when people say "Oh don't worry about me, I'm just weird" - and it is always the most mediocre, banal things that get them saying it!

Back on topic, I always loved the Laura Ingalls Wilder books. The effort that all the women put into making those first broadcloth suits, the lengths they had to go to in order to get enough fabric etc. Can you imagine saying to your mother "I want a Little Lord Fauntleroy suit" when she was sewing you a suit for school that was going to have to last you 3 years?

 

[Miss Sis]

I asked if he knew where his dad's suits and hats went off to, "We buried him in his nicest suit, but threw the rest away. It didn't fit anyone anyway."

Slightly fftopic: A few years ago my Mother and I went to visit one of her cousins who is 17 years older than her. I asked him if he could tell us anything about my Grandfather, my Mum's Dad, as he died just after my Mother was born. He didn't know my Grandfather very well, but the one thing that stuck with me was when he said "When Uncle Frank died, I remember Auntie Grace (my Nana) sent me one of his suits and I was so greatful, since the War was on and clothes were hard to get."

My Grandfather was only 31 and fairly well dressed when he died so his clothes would have been quite up to date. However, I can't imagine most people (those here on the Lounge probably being the exception) being terribly happy in the overall scheme of things, being sent a suit from someone who just died!

 

[David Conwill]

Can you imagine what the charity shops had back then?

Charity shops, heck! My 70-year-old aunt recently told me about the summer of 1961, when she purchased a complete, dead-stock, 1920s boys outfit (breeches, shirt, cap, etc.) from a going-out-of-business sale in Northern Michigan. She got it as a Halloween costume.

The best part is, she held onto it all these years, and recently sold it to an antique store. I wish I’d seen it before she sold it, I’d have loved to have taken pictures.

-Dave

 

[littleblackcar]

I have a friend who is my mother's age, more or less (60 ish), who says that she and her friends used to look for deadstock clothing when they were young. That would have been in the mid- to late-1960's, and the clothing they wanted seems to have been mostly 1940's. It wouldn't have been very vintage at the time--roughly the equivalent of somebody today wearing Eighties or early Nineties stuff--but the idea seems to have been there. She always asks me about my latest sewing projects, which are usually 1940's patterns.

 

[benstephens]

Did David Tennant not run all weekend costume parties in the 1920s and 30s where people dressed in Georgian outfits etc? I also know the one country house where for parties the staff were dressed in Regency costume in the 1930s.

However, I think today we see more people dressing vintage, unlike earlier times where it was the leisured classes and often in a fancy dress context. With the increase disposable income and leisure time I think more people have the time and money to be interested in fashion, yet, although far more available the clothes are now quite generic on the high street. Vintage, vintage inspired, vintage hair styles etc are ways to express themselves much more individually?


Kindest Regards


Ben

 

[swinggal]

This clip is interesting. It's from 1949 and asks, "Are modern fashions going back to the 20s?"

http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=34929

And this one about modern hats with a Victorian and Edwardian styles
http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=34929