Bring back dating?

[Senator Jack]

Do I hear the jangle of bartender keys?

 

[beaucaillou]

The "hooking-up" generation/mentality is terrifying on a social and cultural level and I think the negative results are obvious, but I understand how it was borne and why, especially from a female perspective. It's almost a competitive mentality.

While I go about in the world thinking that actual dating is a realistic experience, I've noticed that - like many of you have said - one date or outing means I'm supposed to end up in bed with the person, which just isn't going to happen after I've known you for three hours... and for some reason, this makes me weird in the eyes of many of my peers. This is where I always get called "old-fashioned."

So it seems to be either: hooking up, or no dating at all, which seems like really extreme and silly terms.

I like to think I'm old enough/on the cusp of that mentality that there are still enough like-minded peers for me to encounter where we can spend time actually dating... going for a drink, to the movies, taking a walk, speaking to each other, but then I find that they are rarely occurring.


*disgruntled*

Excellent thread by the way... you all have interesting thoughts on this.

 

[Lady Day]

Okay, bkaking it down....

I guess I differ from many members here....While I love many aspects about the past, I dhave no use for many of the cultural norms of the era.

That is what this thread is about, an 'old fashioned' view on dating. If you dont share that astetic (as you do in the other items you mentioned), dont worry about it.

while I think for younger girls, having sex or physical intimacy is not always a good thing because they are often doing it to get intimacy and relationship, so they end up getting hurt. Older men and women are more straightforward and honest about it. I hope. So I think younger girls should be cautioned against hooking up for the wrong reasons.

I think this younger girl trend of 'hooking up' or 'party girl' is an extention of a warped since of equality. Men have been doing this for a long time, now i can too. What I dont get is equating this new since of 'equality' by an old mens standard. Whay cant a new equal tone be set by the young women of today? If you have a desire to go out and 'hook up', fine, but to do it (as I know some girls do, cause they are friends) because of the 'men do it Im going to do it to, record, is well just sheepish.

As far as dating, I would never expect to impress a woman by taking her out to dinner or a movie. If I ever actually have a regular date again, it will be doing something a little more exciting thatn that.

A first date is braking the ice, letting down your guard, being inviting, Im sure you know this What is so wrong with a classic first date? Oh, thats right, you dont share those sensibilities of that part of the golden era. My bad.

On a last note, we should be careful not to confuse the movies with reality. I suspect there wa a lot more of what we consider modern behavior going on. The movies never have been reality.

Besides, as mentioned, the true hearthrobs of the era usually ended up with a girl in their arms without the whole dating thing.

I think we all ahve a fair since of reality. And the fella DID end up with the lady after that charmed tension, mistaken words, and confession of love occurred. Ah, charm



p.s.
Scotrace, that type of date sounds charming....


LD

 

[LizzieMaine]

This is where I always get called "old-fashioned."

Yep, heard that one before. One of these days I'm just gonna say "Well LOOK AT ME -- you were expecting maybe Carrie Bradshaw??"

 

[beaucaillou]

I think this younger girl trend of 'hooking up' or 'party girl' is an extention of a warped since of equality. Men have been doing this for a long time, now i can too. What I dont get is equating this new since of 'equality' by an old mens standard. Whay cant a new equal tone be set by the young women of today? If you have a desire to go out and 'hook up', fine, but to do it (as I know some girls do, cause they are friends) because of the 'men do it Im going to do it to, record, is well just sheepish.

I absolutely agree, and there in is the problem: young women do not (largely) have instilled enough confidence, self-worth, or empowerment to change the terms. Until the mentality is solidified that, "We'd rather be alone than miserable on these terms," nothing will change. On the other hand, men could adopt the thinking that "This manner of relationship isn't enough." I think it will take both genders becoming tired with the hollow dynamics for it to change. I believe it will take a few generations to see the evidence of that ocurring, if it should.

 

[herringbonekid]

...Men have been doing this for a long time, now i can too.

if men were the only ones doing it, who were they doing it with ?

 

[Lady Day]

if men were the only ones doing it, who were they doing it with ?

Themselves, sometimes

What I mean is this overt hunting and getting. It use to be the charm and actual skil of it, now, form a lot of fellas I know (and some girlfriends), the women just 'give it away'.

LD

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Is there anything wrong with that? Just because one wouldn't do what someone else does, doesn't make it inherently wrong.*

We all have the ability to make our own choices. Only a pretentious person complains about being labeled while labeling others. (God, i can't believe how many times, in so many guises, i get to bring that one out)

bk

*I know the obfuscation will begin here, and am prepared. An afore-hand disclaimer: Sleeping with someone without "getting to know them" is not in the same league as murder, paedophilia, rape or any other of the serious crimes. These cannot be used as the standard Muddying of the waters situations re: this argument. Please, stay on topic.

 

[Senator Jack]

Posted by LadyDay:
Themselves, sometimes

Are bartenders allowed to be that cheeky? lol

 

[LizzieMaine]

I think the real issue here is less a judgement of what individuals choose to do or not do, and more a question of a culture which seems, more and more, to assume there's *something inherently wrong with* those of us who choose not to -- that somehow we're inhibited or maladjusted or whatever you want to throw in there. What, if anything, can we do about that?

 

[herringbonekid]

Is there anything wrong with that? Just because one wouldn't do what someone else does, doesn't make it inherently wrong.*

Baron, we generally see eye to eye but we're going to have to disagree on this one. if you can't see that young girls engaging in loveless sex with numerous equally uninterested males is in some way damaging then you're being too generous. at least prostitutes made money from engaging in empty sex with strangers. also, what would make you feel good about sleeping with someone who will sleep with anyone ?

 

[beaucaillou]

Is there anything wrong with that? Just because one wouldn't do what someone else does, doesn't make it inherently wrong.

I'm all for 'live & let live,' so long as you are not hurting others. Inherently wrong? Yes and no. I think the question is less an individual judgment and more of an assessment of 'hooking up' as a cultural/social phenomenon that leads to really negative results for the society at large.

 

[Senator Jack]

I think a 'hook up' between two rational thinking adults is being confused with 'free love'. Then again, I'm really out of touch with these young hippies with their long hair and kaftans.

 

[Lady Day]

I think this call back to dating is tha art of learning conversation with someone you are attracted to, and learning about them as a person, rather than a physical experience, which seems to be a goal among a lot of youngins'. To find the charm and appeal of someone past their looks is what makes that person so alluring.

So I say yes, bring back the soft and slow charm of dating, the process of introducing someone into your life that can be a great joy.

Yay dating! Yay staying on topic

LD

 

[Senator Jack]

Did I mention how much I like the new bartender here? She keeps the place open way past closing time.

 

[Rosie]

Dating in the old fashioned sense is great, I wish more men understood the art of dating.

However, there are some people who you want to get to know, spend time with, and develop a relationship with and then there are some people who you just ...

 

[TheKitschGoth]

I would love for dating not to be such an alien idea. I'm tired of men (boys is probably a more accurate description) thinking I'm going to jump into bed with them just because they've said hi/seen me around/complimented my chest (delete as necessary)

Or, at the other end of the spectrum, deciding it's a relationship the first time they meet me.

It would be really nice to actually get to know someone. To feel like I'm valued as a person, not just an object.

That's fine if people want to just "hook up", it doesn't affect me what they get up to. It does bug me that I'm seen as cold and weird because I wont.

 

[Senator Jack]

I'm tired of men (boys is probably a more accurate description)

The very crux of the problem, KG. The article concerns boys and girls and not men and women. The writer failed to mention that.

Regards,

Senator Jack

 

[Baron Kurtz]

if you can't see that young girls engaging in loveless sex with numerous equally uninterested males is in some way damaging then you're being too generous.

I didn't know we were only talking about young girls.

The point i was trying to make was pretty much the one made by Reetpleet: that "hooking up" (hate the term; sounds a bit too much like plugging into a socket . . . maybe it's supposed to) was not inherently worse than dating. Just a different way of interacting. Having sex doesn't mean you instantly feel the person is somehow lesser. In fact, i've heard that the modern dating can be just as harmful vis a vis young men - being used as a free meal ticket by unscrupulous young females going out with a different guy every night. Being "led on" is, i believe, the correct term. Add in some sex after the "date" and the two situations ("dating"/"hooking up") are indistinguishable . . .

I ain't no advocate for rampant free love. I just don't think someone's way of going about dealing with partners is a way in which we should be judging them.

bk

 

[Lady Day]

Just to clarify:

I'd try dating the old fashioned way. Call for a date, set the time, pick her up with maybe a small gift, dressed nicely, dinner, conversation, maybe a little window shopping. Then take her home and hope to get permission to call again (if all went well).

My question is, how would that be received? Would I be written off as a hopeless dullard? Or - worse! - as "too nice!"

Spread this knowledge in booklet form and give to all young men everywhere.

Being nice, and being strong are two different things.


LD