Bad Table Manners

[Lady Jessica]

Thanks Sally and Cecil. I was pretty sure... but not a hundred percent.

 

[donCarlos]

I hope I didn't come off in my previous post sounding like you should only hold your knife and fork a certain way. Thats the way I was taught, but different cultures have different manners.

Its kind of like hearing English people complain about Americans not speaking the Queens English. Why should you, she's not your Queen.

I say if you want to use your fork as a spoon, its OK with me. When I'm in the States, I do too. When in Rome.

Well, that way of holding a fork is the only right way

One question: I heard scary stories about american way of eating. I heard that they somewhere eat with fork only in right hand. They cut the meal with the fork in their left hand, then they put it in their right hand and put it in their mouth. Has anyone ever seen such a barbarity?

 

[jayem]

I wouldn't say my manners are even close to beautiful, but I try. My napkin always goes on my lap when the meal is served and on the plate when the meal is done. I have a habit, even in incredibly casual settings, or taking my free hand and holding it over my mouth when I chew. My friends rag on me for it, but I just hate how when people chew they look like either a cow or a rabbit.

One think I am absolutely terrible at is cutting food. That was never enforced in our household since we rarely had cutable food growing up (I grew up on Campbell's soup and Mac n Cheese). Honest to god, I'd rather just pick the meat or whatever apart with my fork but, oh well...

 

[Foofoogal]

You Did WHAT?lol

In TEXAS as in other "STEAK" States, the use of "ANY" sort of condiment on your steak is a Cardinal SIN !

as a former Texan and maybe always one (if it doesn't quit raining in AR) it was not the way you put the mustard. It was the mustard.
Now I will put steak sauce and sometimes if it is dry I will ask for catsup I have never, ever seen anyone ever eat any steak in Texas or anywhere else eat mustard with it.

 

[BinkieBaumont]

"I remember having a Luncheon at a Lyons Corner House as a child with a very "Glamorous" Aunty, when we had finished she said "Now lets go and explore the toy Department at Griffin And Spaldings" and with, a toss of her Veronica Lake fringe, she stubbed her cigarette out in the sugar bowl!!!, needless to say after that little display, she was never much in favour by me

 

[LizzieMaine]

I assume it means reaching in front of someone for a serving dish, rather than asking others to pass it?

Exactly. So called because it was the usual way of dining at the communal table in boarding houses. We sat at a very small table, so everything was within arm's-reach of everyone. Usually it was salt, butter, or ketchup we were reaching for -- when there was a serving dish, my grandmother usually went around with it and dished out the food like the lunchroom waitress she had once been. And you better eat every bit of it, beause you're not leaving the table till you do.

 

[Feng_Li]

When I scooped a small amount of mustard onto the plate next to the steak, people's eyes at the table nearly popped out of thier head. Stunned. Awkward. Silence.

If there had been a piano player, he would have stopped playing, too.

Dear Agony Aunt, What was my gaffe?

I have rarely observed an American who put mustard on his meat, unless it was in a sandwich. I find this odd, because it can be very tasty - just ask all those Southerners who make barbeque sauce with a mustard base.

Cody Pendant is entirely correct in his other two statements. Steak should never be ordered well-done. And no condiment should be applied to the food without tasting it first (unless the food is intended for dipping, like chips or carrot sticks). If you're dining in someone's home, you don't apply a condiment at all unless the host/ess does so first, because doing so signals that you don't think your host seasoned the food properly.

But Cody Pendant: Completely bare? Do you mean grilled meat, with absolutely nothing on it, or bare as it comes from the grill, where it has presumably at least received some salt?

 

[scotrace]

Note that Talbot later said that everyone else buttered their steak with the mustard, so it wasn't the use of it that was the problem. Talbot did it correctly.

Table manners are important! I have numerous times eaten with people I greatly admired and was disappointed to find they gobbled like a field hand. BUT I also catch myself wolfing my food at times when I get really hungry so I have to watch it and remind myself.
Even alone, the napkin goes on my lap first thing (who wants to deal with a laundry problem later? I'm too lazy to make work like that). I loathe a cluttered table, so it's always cleared and ready to be set.
It can be very frustrating for a parent. Marc, I know first hand that your manners and poise are always (dining or not) admirable. I want to know in twelve years or so how your daughter's schooling in such things is progressing. Despite hammering it into my 12 year old, she still has some of the most atrocious table manners going! But she'll come around.

I was allowed to drink wine and beer at the meals and though not advocating it of course I learned it could be done with certain guidelines. I found it quite a valuable lesson later when friends went nuts in high school.

If it was a valuable lesson, why would you not advocate it??? Your friends who went wild would have had a better understanding of the need for moderation had they had your valuable experience.

 

[JohnnyGringo]

My father always hammered proper table behavior/manners into my head as a youngster, and although I didn't always appreciate his seemingly never ending "instruction", I have found myself time and again thankful that he prepared me to appear less than heathen-like as an adult. Appropriate table manners and polishing my shoes-Dad, I can never thank you enough for passing both of these along to me. :eusa_clap

 

[Paisley]

Exactly. So called because it was the usual way of dining at the communal table in boarding houses. We sat at a very small table, so everything was within arm's-reach of everyone. Usually it was salt, butter, or ketchup we were reaching for -- when there was a serving dish, my grandmother usually went around with it and dished out the food like the lunchroom waitress she had once been. And you better eat every bit of it, beause you're not leaving the table till you do.

I'm not sure if my comment belongs here or in the annoying phrase thread, but it annoys me when my mother says, "Pardon my boardinghouse reach." If you know it's bad manners, why not say, "Pass the salt."

 

[LizzieMaine]

I used to know a guy who habitually said "Shoot the Sodium Chloride," and then chuckled at his own cleverness.

 

[Sefton]

Well, that way of holding a fork is the only right way

One question: I heard scary stories about american way of eating. I heard that they somewhere eat with fork only in right hand. They cut the meal with the fork in their left hand, then they put it in their right hand and put it in their mouth. Has anyone ever seen such a barbarity?

I cut my food with the knife in my left hand, but I don't switch the knife and fork afterwards. My excuse? I'm left handed. Those pesky cutting rules obviously being written by a righteous righty.

 

["Skeet" McD]

One question: I heard scary stories about american way of eating. I heard that they somewhere eat with fork only in right hand. They cut the meal with the fork in their left hand, then they put it in their right hand and put it in their mouth. Has anyone ever seen such a barbarity?

Dear dC, Well: that might have ONCE been the case...but, at least in these parts, you'd be hard-pressed to find anyone who handled their silverware with any rhyme or reason. I expect they still teach such things at finishing schools...if anyone still goes to such a thing...but elegant dining manners seem quite moribund. I can, however, tell a story concerning a time, not so long ago, when things were quite different:

I have a very good friend both of whose parents were raised near Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania...at the time (the 1930s) very much heavy-industry. Both of these folks were regularly clobbered by their parents for "eating like truck-drivers!" when they "mis-used" their knives and forks.

The truck-drivers in question, it hardly merits saying, were all (as they would have said) Bohunks, Polacks, Square-heads, Hunkies, and such...and their "horrible" table manners were extremely well-mannered European table manners. And I wouldn't doubt a bit that--if you were able to go home with some of those truck-drivers--you would have seen them cuffing their kids about THEIR horrible (American) table manners!

I would be inclined to end this with some flip comment about "just imagine how very local, indeed parochial, we all were back them;" and then I think back to the whole mustard-and-steak thing. Hmmmm...

Oh well, having gone there: here's a two-fer: the only people exhibiting TRULY bad manners at that table were the people who openly expressed surprise at a guest's actions. The elegant response, of course, would have been for the host to take some mustard and place it on the side of his or her plate, as well. Just one man's opinion...

"Skeet"

 

[Lily Powers]

I had a friend who thought nothing of dining out and letting her 3-year old run from table to table in the restaurant and engaging other diners in the middle of their conversations, yelling, just generally being a little kid, but in an environment where it wasn't appropriate. It was very embarrassing and obviously irritating to the other people.

And I don't know if this is considered manners or just an odd quirk, but I absolutely cannot leave my cloth napkin piled in a wad on the table after I've finished eating. I fold it neatly into a rectangle and place it alongside the dinner plate.

 

["Skeet" McD]

I And I don't know if this is considered manners or just an odd quirk, but I absolutely cannot leave my cloth napkin piled in a wad on the table after I've finished eating. I fold it neatly into a rectangle and place it alongside the dinner plate.

At least by the old rules, it would be proper to leave your napkin unfolded...yes, even in a wad. I expect that the reasoning behind this otherwise somewhat odd prescription is to ensure that a lightly soiled napkin not be confused for an unused one and re-used...which I expect made more sense in a world where servants or employees were doing the clean-up.

For my money, as long as you make it clear at a glance that you have, in fact, used your napkin...I'd say you've fulfilled the requirements of the law!

"Skeet"

 

[Cody Pendant]

Mustard! NEVER!!!!

Note that Talbot later said that everyone else buttered their steak with the mustard, so it wasn't the use of it that was the problem. Talbot did it correctly.

Scotrace, I'll disagree on that point with you.I have never seen anyone use mustard on a steak!
As a marinade ingreadiant....YES! , but actually put mustard ON a steak, nope. The steak sandwich is of course an acceptable exception to the rule.

As for the rest of the party using the mustard, I can only surmise that they did it to be polite as: [QUOTE="Skeet" McD] ...The elegant response, of course, would have been for the host to take some mustard and place it on the side of his or her plate, as well. Just one man's opinion..."Skeet"[/QUOTE] Skeet has said most eloquently. I can think of no other reason for their behavior. I would say you found extremely polite, gracious, and adventurous partners and friends. I'd keep 'um if I was you. :eusa_clap

If'n one WAS to do such a thing, I agree that a dab on the side would be most correct.

...But Cody Pendant: Completely bare? Do you mean grilled meat, with absolutely nothing on it, or bare as it comes from the grill, where it has presumably at least received some salt?

After grillin' sir. The cooks would most assuredly have "marinaded" and "rubbed" (with spices) the meat, this is wear the "flavor art" would come in. Otherwise it would simply be roasted.

My comments were meant to be somewhat "tongue in cheek". Remember we Texans tend to exaggerate! God forbid you take me literally and you hear one of my other favorite lines!

 

[Viola]

I had a friend who thought nothing of dining out and letting her 3-year old run from table to table in the restaurant and engaging other diners in the middle of their conversations, yelling, just generally being a little kid, but in an environment where it wasn't appropriate. It was very embarrassing and obviously irritating to the other people.

My mother went the other way with my younger siblings and I: our manners had to be a lot nicer than the McDonald's we were at actually required, but she figured we couldn't go to anyplace other than McDonald's until we learned and how would we learn if we didn't practice?

I think that way had merit, actually. Better to be thought slightly odd (we did get looks sometimes) for being "too good" in a fast-food joint than to go the other way, I think.

 

[Undertow]

In the event that the restaurant includes cloth napkins, it is always placed in my lap. If no cloth, no lap. I refuse to place paper there.

I've learned most "proper" manners on my own, but the most obvious things, like eating with closed mouth, no throwing, etc. from the family.

I'm not a tyrant regarding manners, but I do expect people to be polite at the very least, i.e. cell phones turned off, calm/collected, etc.

 

[Vintage Betty]

What is really inexplicable is flossing in public. Has anybody else seen this?

...You obviously have not met my husband. *sigh* shakeshead

 

[Vintage Betty]

I cut my food with the knife in my left hand, but I don't switch the knife and fork afterwards. My excuse? I'm left handed. Those pesky cutting rules obviously being written by a righteous righty.

Ditto, but I was taught to eat by my left-handed mother. So it's a fork in my right hand, knife in my left. I've gotten some strange looks over the years, because I'm right handed.