Why the South?

[Mr. Paladin]

For years, I've used a portion of the above quote as my "tag line" on this forum and elsewhere. I have always thought that it nicely reveals the complex dichotomy between Southern politeness and the often reserved or aloof---and occasionally hostile---true nature of many Southerners.

I think that, over the decades, a great many people have mistaken Sounthern politeness for stupidity or gentleness. I also think that most those people eventually came to regret their error.AF

Sir, I have always admired your tag line and I find your above explanation very true. I was raised on a ranch around only small towns. My maternal grandmother was the product of fairly prosperous parents who owned a traveling sawmill business which moved all over Alabama, Mississippi, and Louisiana. She was a very proper lady and taught my mom, who in turn taught us. In my line of work I have dealt with many people who mistook Southern politeness for stupidity or softness. I doubt they ever make that mistake again. Having been in large cities for nearly thirty years, I also agree that the politeness is near defunct here, possibly because of demographics and possibly because of the beehive syndrome where people feel they can behave poorly surrounded by a mass of strangers whom they will most likely never see again. It is a shame.

 

[jwalls]

Southern Manners

Like most southerners of a certain age my mother taught me that everyone is due respect, until they prove other wise. Mother called it 'grace'. Your manners are a reflection of your upbring and character.

 

[dhermann1]

I think in rural areas and smaller towns of the North and Midwest you'd find just as much kindness and hospitality, with just less formality and riitual.
As a dyed in the wool Yankee, I've always felt that Southern formality was based in considerable part to the myth of the "Aristocratic Society". (Think "Thomas Jefferson", and all the paradoxes implied by that name.) This was of course founded on the brutality and utlimate incivility of slavery. I don't want to sidetrack this discussion into a more contentious topic, but I think this is a dimension that bears consideration.
In a place like New York, where the stereotype is brusqueness and rudeness, it's really that the rules of etiquette are very different. People are much more wary of each other here, but underneath it all just as anxious to be friendly. And with so many different cultures encountering each other all the time, it is very difficult to develop a specific standard set of manners that will apply to all situations. Nevertheless there is an attempt at rudimentary politeness often enough. (But not always!)

 

[Geronimo]

NO ONE is reserved with a Texan, and they expect you in turn to be both loud, engaging and friendlier then all get out.

lol
So true, so true. And don't forget the brotherhood (or sisterhood) of Texicans. If you happen to be out of state and another Texan (or ex-Texan) spots your plates, he'll strike up a conversation about how much he wishes he was back there.
And that was in rural Colorado, of all places.

I also agree that the politeness is near defunct here, possibly because of demographics and possibly because of the beehive syndrome where people feel they can behave poorly surrounded by a mass of strangers whom they will most likely never see again.

There's not enough time to be all that polite in a city of millions. Hold open the door for a lady, and five hundred more will come streaming in behind her. By the time they're all through, you've missed your lunch break.

 

[Feraud]

There's not enough time to be all that polite in a city of millions. Hold open the door for a lady, and five hundred more will come streaming in behind her. By the time they're all through, you've missed your lunch break.

Exactly! lol
The same holds true for getting on a bus and train.

 

[Cigarband]

Judith Martin said in Star Spangled Manners, I think it was, that southern manners came from Africa, not England.

In English Colonial Society worldwide, the separation
of Master and Subject was rigidly maintained. Especially in the South where African slaves were considered lower than the animals they cared for. Courtly manners were ingrained in the English Gentry whose descendants subjugated their fellow human beings.

 

[zombi]

NO ONE is reserved with a Texan, and they expect you in turn to be both loud, engaging and friendlier then all get out.

Hahaha -- we can't help it!

I was born & raised in a small town in East Texas, and I'm to this day shocked to see or hear, for instance, how some people talk to their parents, or a man who doesn't hold a door for a lady, or a grocery cashier who doesn't say two words more'n the total of your purchase to you at the store.

Now I live in Oklahoma, and people are still quite friendly here -- it's not quite like home, but it's not like the times I've been up North, either. I always notice how, hhmmm. I don't really know how to say it. It isn't that people aren't friendly, that's not it, not really. I think it's just a huge difference in custom, or maybe it comes down to "politeness".

 

[Viola]

In a place like New York, where the stereotype is brusqueness and rudeness, it's really that the rules of etiquette are very different. People are much more wary of each other here, but underneath it all just as anxious to be friendly.

This, a thousand times this. I'm not a New Yorker but if there's one place with a similar rep. for manners, it's Philly. People still want to be nice. People still ARE nice, out and about. You don't want to get in drama, though. You don't want to be misintepreted. And you don't want pleasantness mistaken for something else.

 

[LizzieMaine]

I think in rural areas and smaller towns of the North and Midwest you'd find just as much kindness and hospitality, with just less formality and riitual.

Exactly. Up here, the stereotype of the "taciturn New Englander" is every bit as based in reality as it ever was. We don't gush, we don't bow and scrape and carry on, but if your car breaks down, we'll pull over and help you without giving it a second thought. Just don't try to hug us afterward.

 

[Viola]

Why do rural towns get the full rights to hospitality and friendliness? We are very ****ing hospitable I've known *****ers who would give you the ****ing shirt off their backs!

We're just loud and passionate. lol

 

[davestlouis]

I know a woman who went to college in Tennessee, and her take on the whole southern thing is that they'll be syrupy sweet to your face while they stab you in the back. My darling wife has a kiddo in her 2nd grade class who is "yes ma'am" ing her to death, he's polite to a fault, but a little hellion nonetheless.

I grew up in Cincinnati, which is right across the river from Northern KY, so we were right on the Mason Dixon line, and if you really look at it, Cincy is more like Louisville or Lexington than other Ohio cities, but we surely weren't deep south.

In short, I agree that there is a huge difference between being outwardly polite and actually being nice.

 

[TallulahDahling]

I was born in Buffalo and moved to the south at the age of 16 and it was quite the culture shock.
I kept finding reasons to dislike the south.........racism, slow talking and even slower driving, referring to all sodas as "Cokes" and the idea of revering anything remotely resembling a collard green!
Now I am so happy to have embraced southern living and am proud to refer to myself as a reformed Yankee!
I eat my collards, think Lynyrd Skynyrd was the greatest band ever and am proud to own a 3-legged dog! lol

 

[SayCici]

I wonder how much of it has to do with rural vs. urban, though?

That was my thought process. I have a friend who lives in New York, and anytime she has visited me where I live, she makes a lot of comments about how much friendlier people are here, more manners, etc., and I don't even live very deep in the South (Northern Virginia).

I think it has a lot to do with population, though I can't speak toward the past. People who live in big cities see so many faces just walking a block that they don't think they have the time to be nice to every stranger they share a square foot with.

When you live in a smaller area, maybe it's easier to be nice to strangers because you're not surrounded by them all the time - you don't share transportation, public places, or even a building with as many people as you would in a big city.

 

[NicknNora]

I was born in Buffalo and moved to the south at the age of 16 and it was quite the culture shock.
I kept finding reasons to dislike the south.........racism, slow talking and even slower driving, referring to all sodas as "Cokes" and the idea of revering anything remotely resembling a collard green!
Now I am so happy to have embraced southern living and am proud to refer to myself as a reformed Yankee!
I eat my collards, think Lynyrd Skynyrd was the greatest band ever and am proud to own a 3-legged dog! lol

lol lol I moved from Pittsburgh, PA to Louisville, KY at the age of 13. The kids I went to school with made fun of my accent. I said - my accent?, what about yours? lol I figured if they could say "Y'all" there was no reason why I couldn't say "You guys". lol

Here in Louisville we don't have very many slow drivers (Nick is one of them but then he was born in Pikeville, KY and is much more of a true Southerner than I am). They all think they are in a NASCAR race (me too ). Far from being a reformed Yankee, I refer to myself as a displaced Northerner even though I've lived my entire adult life as a Southerner. lol I've also never requested that a local band play the song "Free Bird" much to their relief. lol

I agree with those who commented about manners not being the same as "nice." There are some wonderful people in the South and some real knot heads, just like anywhere else.

 

[NicknNora]

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As I didn't want throw off the other thread I want to start a new one.
I think just like this and am in the South. Why is the South or why was the South so different in thinking then in the North?
I really want to know. Like Scarlett in Gone With the Wind. Was it done before the movie and the Southern women prided themselves they were like Scarlett or way before the movie.
Is it inate in the South for women to completely understand catching flies with honey?
I don't think it is slyness as much as an innocence. Not as prevelant for sure as it used to be but definitely still understood.
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http://org.elon.edu/pendulum/Issues/2002/041102/Features/Belle.html
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=southern belle
http://littlerock.about.com/library/howto/htbelle.htm

Trust me it isn't innocence, my dear. They know exactly what they're doing.lol

 

[Feraud]

I think it has a lot to do with population, though I can't speak toward the past. People who live in big cities see so many faces just walking a block that they don't think they have the time to be nice to every stranger they share a square foot with.

That is a very good point. One square block of midtown Manhattan can hold a small town's worth of people.

 

[Foofoogal]

Trust me it isn't innocence, my dear. They know exactly what they're doing.

quite successful also. lol

 

[NicknNora]

quite successful also. lol

Yup.lol

 

[jwalls]

I was born in Buffalo and moved to the south at the age of 16 and it was quite the culture shock.
I kept finding reasons to dislike the south.........racism, slow talking and even slower driving, referring to all sodas as "Cokes" and the idea of revering anything remotely resembling a collard green!
Now I am so happy to have embraced southern living and am proud to refer to myself as a reformed Yankee!
I eat my collards, think Lynyrd Skynyrd was the greatest band ever and am proud to own a 3-legged dog! lol

I left the South almost 30 years ago, but I still get "You must be from Texas" when I speak to strangers. Some of the most southern people I know are yankees who have seen the 'LIGHT'.

 

[ClothesHorse]

I agree that is is both southern and rural. I have been in cities in the south, and find them less polite/slow/genteel than the rural counter parts. I've found northern cities to be worse -- except Milwaukee ?! I for one like the laconic pace of rural life. If we don't get it done today, we'll do it tomorrow. Not the best business model, but it does allow for lots of fishing and Iced tea and conversation among friends.

Mom and Dad raised us to be polite always. In the high plains we've learned to be plain spoken and polite. We'll tell you to go to Hell, then pack you a lunch, give you a cup of coffee, directions and send you on your way.

All the best,

CH