Vintage Suitings: Discussions of, and sourcing modern equivalents, etc.

[Qirrel]

That flannel is excellent., and one of the best deals out there regarding quality/price. I have a few metres of it waiting to be made up into a suit.

 

[Barmey]

Funnily enough I bought some of the Mid-grey yesterday. I'm looking forward to its arrival. I have too many ideas for it at the moment.

 

[GBR]

My tailor in Sheffield has recently been offered quite a few bolts of vintage cloth, going back to the late '40s as far as we can tell. Simply from the feel of the fabric compared to that in the swatch books, it's possible to tell that the quality of modern cloth, even the low-end stuff, is miles ahead of what it once was, manufacturing-wise. Perhaps the most telling point is that the low end cloths were sometimes recycled wool, hence the 'Pure New Wool' labelling we have today.

The availability of heavier weight fabric is another matter entirely but purely from a manufacturing standpoint, the quality of fabric is astonishing these days.

Who is this fortunate tailor - Sheffield has so few these days.

 

[Matt_the_chap]

Ted Williams, down on London Road, GBR. They're fantastic, completely fantastic and very skilled. Their website is http://www.tedthetailor.co.uk/ . If you're ever down that way it's worth going to take a look. About the only thing they won't do is specialist riding stuff, but I'm damned if I can find anybody who'll do that who's even remotely affordable for anybody without a private income. They're wonderfully accommodating for vintage styles too; they're putting a jacket together to match some Oxford Bags I've got with belt back and the works. The only thing I would advise if you do get anything made there is to specify tight armholes, but otherwise I can't recommend them highly enough.

 

[esteban68]

I have a 1947? Ted Williams blue worsted suit in the British suit section, it caused some discussion but is definitely dated 3/47...very nicely made and in almost pristine condition.
The date seems incongruous since Williams allegedly didn't start up until 48?

 

[Rudie]

I found a shop where they sell traditional guild clothing to carpenters and such. They have 800 grams all cotton cord, moleskin (Pilot) and a German variant of moleskin, Deutschleder (German leather), which comes in 800 grams also. They have the fabric made specifically for them. I asked them if they can sell me some fabric or point me to the manufacturers.

http://www.original-veddel.de/html_new/herkules.htm
http://www.original-veddel.de/html_new/deutschleder.htm

I now have the address of the mill. They specialize in workwear fabrics. Their standard cord is 85/15% cotton and polyester. This cord is 900g/31,75oz. and costs 13.95 EUR. I'll inquire if they would also sell me the 100% cotton cord they make for Veddel. Their Zwirn-Doppelpilot (which is Moleskin) is all cotton and weighs 520g/18oz., price 9.20 EUR. Deutschleder ("German leather") is 100% cotton but tough as leather. It weighs 930g/32.80oz, costs only 10.95 EUR and is nearly indestructible. If they don't sell me all cotton cord I'll probably get the Deutschleder.

H. E. Box also sent me their prices. 23oz. cord is £21.80, 17oz. cord is £16.05. All wool Cavalry Twill is £51.30 for 32oz. and £38.80 for 22oz. 32oz. Bedford Cords cost £40.40, 19oz. Moleskins cost £21.80.

 

[herringbonekid]

new 'covert' cloth by Fox in 18/19 0z weight:

i'm not really a covert coat fan, but i'm sure this could be used for something else.
it has a very U.S. chambray - workwear look about it, but is wool rather than cotton.

 

[Simonds]

:eusa_clap Nice! Thanks for sharing, HBK!

 

[herringbonekid]

Fox have also added this 18 oz classic navy serge to their range:

i have a swatch. it has a very slight two tone effect; the ridges appearing lighter than the spaces between.
it's nice, but i'm still unconvinced if serge is interesting enough to warrant making a suit from.

 

[Guttersnipe]

Fox have also added this 18 oz classic navy serge to their range:

i have a swatch. it has a very slight two tone effect; the ridges appearing lighter than the spaces between.
it's nice, but i'm still unconvinced if serge is interesting enough to warrant making a suit from.

Personally, I'd love low key three-piece blue serge suit inspired by the blade suits of the 30s. Do you know what that 18 oz blue runs per yard / meter?

 

[herringbonekid]

here's the page:

http://www.themerchantfox.co.uk/prod/301/suiting-and-jacketing-lengths/fox-navy-serge-jacketing

the photo makes it look a bit harder and shiny that it actually is.

 

[Guttersnipe]

Thanks for the tip about the finish being softer and duller in person. In the zoomed in pictures, it definitely looks very shiny and hard, which I don't usually associate with vintage suiting.

It's definitely heavier than a 430 gram Harrisons' serge I'm considering, but I'm not sure the additional weight is worth the extra 70 quid per meter (to me). Any thoughts?

 

[herringbonekid]

Guttersnipe, i would always recommend heavier -18oz- over lighter for a better drape, but their prices are eye watering. i would order a swatch and see if you're swayed by it.

 

[Tomasso]

Serge is a great choice for a travel suit as it's very wrinkle resistant. Even the lighter stuff drapes well due to the weave. But if you love a nice handle it's probably not for you. You know how women get touchy feely when you wear lux cloth; well you won't have to worry about that with serge.

 

[Rudie]

Serge is a great choice for a travel suit as it's very wrinkle resistant.

That explains why it was so ubiquitous back in the day when most men had only one or two suits.

 

[Guttersnipe]

That explains why it was so ubiquitous back in the day when most men had only one or two suits.

I wouldn't argue with that at all. The flannel serge used so often to make the ubiquitous blue suit thats were so popular, at least in the U.S., is also very, very hard wearing and exceedingly easy to care.

 

[Rudie]

Th downside is the shine it seems to be prone to develop over time.

 

[Guttersnipe]

Guttersnipe, i would always recommend heavier -18oz- over lighter for a better drape, but their prices are eye watering. i would order a swatch and see if you're swayed by it.

Thanks for the tips. I ordered the Harrisons in gray, since I need a new suit for work. I'll report report on the drape once the suit is done.

Do you think there is any point at which cloth becomes too heavy and doesn't drape well?

The tailor I go to (a transplanted Hong Kong bespoke tailor who's nephews opened a shop in S.F.) is always game for interesting projects, but my choices in heavier fabrics does meet with comment. I suspect the nephews think the fabrics I choose are too heavy to drape well, but they are of the generation that is only used to lighter "luxury" supers.

 

[herringbonekid]

Do you think there is any point at which cloth becomes too heavy and doesn't drape well?

this coat is made from flannel that is about 24 oz:

you can see that the lapel edge is pretty thick; fine for something like a mackinaw / peacoat, but it would look too fat on a suit or sports jacket.
i'd think the absolute upper limit for suiting fabric would be 22 oz, and that would be for a heavy tweed or flannel jacket with a rugged finish (e.g. a heavy tweed Norfolk).


edit: for me, 18 oz is the perfect weight for good 'drape' especially if doing a wide trouser. there is no reason to go higher. 18 oz is perfect.

 

[Tomasso]

The tailor I go to (a transplanted Hong Kong bespoke tailor who's nephews opened a shop in S.F.) is always game for interesting projects, but my choices in heavier fabrics does meet with comment. I suspect the nephews think the fabrics I choose are too heavy to drape well, but they are of the generation that is only used to lighter "luxury" supers.

Are the nephews actually tailors or do the run the front of the shop? I've never met a tailor who loves working with the supers as they can be very persnickety.