The Lost Art of Manliness

[Paisley]

Well, won't that scare off the predators? Especially if you're all in black and built like a gym rat?

It would scare me off, too.

 

[Guttersnipe]

'nuff said...

 

[Martinis at 8]

I spent a week in el Distrito Federal some years ago, and vividly recall the police and soldiers on patrol with M-16s...

Hmmm. I don't recall any M-16s. More likely they were G-3s. Que no? [huh]

 

[scotrace]

I am not quite sure if I would call Greek and Roman societies of old monogamous.

Ah yes. I haven't seen him in an age. 'Ow is Old Monogamous these days, anyway?

 

[PrettySquareGal]

OK, I need to jump in. I am a Rollins fan!

He entertains the troops in Iraq- THAT'S A MAN!

He reps the wimps of the world (listen to his spoken word stuff)- THAT'S A MAN!

He advocates being healthy and true to yourself- WHATTA MAN!

 

[reetpleat]

Like you and I discussed when CarlisleBlues visited, many people have the wrong impression of the "Eastside." Sure, to the uninitiated, it can look a bit scary (just like South-Central), but the way you react to any surroundings is a major key (even if you are not a member of the local race/ ethnic group). Yet, I would not suggest a midnight "sojourn" to Boyle Street, Lou Costello Park, or Whittier Blvd, but then I could say that about most everywhere else on the planet...

True. and while I would not accuse any members here of it, there are those who just get uneasy in an area that may well be very safe and fine, but is populated by a large proportion of Mexican americans or african americans. I myself, while having grown up in a very white community, am Mexican, and feel quite comfortable in a place like MExico or East Los Angeles. Although, to be honest, I had to get used to it, growing up in Seattle.

 

[reetpleat]

Contemporary esthetics will overlook that if there's a wide, lantern jaw and a neck at least as wide as the jaw.

The ultimate is to look like an industrially shaped human: one who embodies discipline and control, and appears able to discipline and control others.

If you can pull that off, you can get away with doing or saying just about anything.

But that is not hard and faxst, even in our culture. Recall the 60s when it was hip to have shaggy hair, be skinny like Mick Jagger, and drive a mini.

Likewise, the 80s saw a shift towards skinny rock stars with fancy hair, and now, the hottest hearthrobs are not exactly the traditional masculine ideal. Skinny emo boys in skinny jeans seem to be all the rage with the young girls, and John Mayer, the sensitive, self reflective whining singer song writer is dating a list celebrities.

 

[reetpleat]

I spent a week in el Distrito Federal some years ago, and vividly recall the police and soldiers on patrol with M-16s...However, the people whom I encountered and spoke with seemed far removed from the above catagories. On the outside, at least, Mexico City is a fairly safe, albeit frenetic city...

That struck me too. But I think the issue is that being a different country and a federal district, the streets are patrolled by soldiers, which is perfectly normal. But here in the states, it would mean we were under martial law. So it is likely that many americans see a soldier with a rifle on the corner and assume it is a dangerous place.

 

[Fletch]

But that is not hard and faxst, even in our culture. Recall the 60s when it was hip to have shaggy hair, be skinny like Mick Jagger, and drive a mini.

Likewise, the 80s saw a shift towards skinny rock stars with fancy hair, and now, the hottest hearthrobs are not exactly the traditional masculine ideal. Skinny emo boys in skinny jeans seem to be all the rage with the young girls, and John Mayer, the sensitive, self reflective whining singer song writer is dating a list celebrities.

All true. And if Rollins is preaching self-help and respect, and "repping wimps" in any way besides bench-pressing them over his head, then that's good. There are differing masculinities. That too is good.

But the hegemonic man, huge and hardened in appearance - or power, or skill - still confers more prestige and standing among one's fellow males AND females. It allows the meathead/tycoon/race driver more of a range of behaviors than the skinny emo dude, or indeed the average schmo. You rep the wimps best by not appearing to be one.

Non-heg males are allowed less latitude. Emo dudes mostly get over with emo chicks, and it's regularly speculated that John Mayer is some kind of "gay" that apparently doesn't require actual homosexual behavior to demonstrate.

Happily for my old beta-male role model David Letterman, he managed to pull his cigar out of the ashes after age, wealth and influence allowed the serial sex harasser in him to flourish. I thought he was less funny these past ten years or so, but that's the price you pay when you become a mogul.

 

[BellyTank]

I am not quite sure if I would call Greek and Roman societies of old monogamous.

Ah yes. I haven't seen him in an age. 'Ow is Old Monogamous these days, anyway?

No, don't call them, not under any circumstances,
they will reverse the charge.


B
T

 

[Edward]

He entertains the troops in Iraq- THAT'S A MAN!

I generally like Rollins - his self-deprecating side wins me over some great degree, plus the man is a significant intellect (nothing more tedious than ignorance). But is being pro-military really a measurement of manliness, as opposed to a political opinion that an individual may or may not share? Perhaps this is a cultural difference between the US and UK? [huh]

 

[Widebrim]

Hmmm. I don't recall any M-16s. More likely they were G-3s. Que no? [huh]

You know, you may be right, tal vez, tal vez...I will take a look at the photos that I took of them. My memory might be playing tricks on me[huh] ...

 

[Widebrim]

Skinny emo boys in skinny jeans seem to be all the rage with the young girls, and John Mayer, the sensitive, self reflective whining singer song writer is dating a list celebrities.

Take away the skinny jeans and you've got Frank Sinatra at the Paramount Theater, c.1941!

 

[PrettySquareGal]

I generally like Rollins - his self-deprecating side wins me over some great degree, plus the man is a significant intellect (nothing more tedious than ignorance). But is being pro-military really a measurement of manliness, as opposed to a political opinion that an individual may or may not share? Perhaps this is a cultural difference between the US and UK? [huh]

In the example I gave, I mean that he is pro putting himself in harm's way to boost the morale of American troops. I didn't mean to say that a real man must love guns and war.

 

[Edward]

In the example I gave, I mean that he is pro putting himself in harm's way to boost the morale of American troops. I didn't mean to say that a real man must love guns and war.

Ah, gotcha. I find there is a significant difference in the way military and military action are viewed in the US and the UK, hence curiosity.

 

[Lone_Ranger]

You can be, just a man. Or you can be a Gentleman.


The Compleat Gentleman: The Modern Man's Guide to Chivalry, by Brad Miner
http://www.amazon.com/Compleat-Gentleman-Modern-Guide-Chivalry/dp/189062652X


The compleat gentleman, according to Mr. Miner, strives for balance between the should be, and the can be. So, while he desires to meet the highest moral and spiritual standard, the true gentleman is not, as my father once said, "So heavenly minded that he is of no earthly good."

 

[Lefty]

Chuck Norris strives for balance.
He's got a gun in each hand.

 

[reetpleat]

I generally like Rollins - his self-deprecating side wins me over some great degree, plus the man is a significant intellect (nothing more tedious than ignorance). But is being pro-military really a measurement of manliness, as opposed to a political opinion that an individual may or may not share? Perhaps this is a cultural difference between the US and UK? [huh]

While Rollins entertains the troops, which is cool, he has never been pro war or pro military. Quite the opposite. But he seems to be quite pro troops in touring to entertain, but to also, in his words, give them alternative ppoints of view because they can get pretty disconnected out there. He has also been very supportive of veterens, especially those with problems from the war. But yyou likely, already knew that.

Personally, I would not at all see entertaining the troops as being manly or unmanly. it is more of a political choice.

But, to be against the war, and then be able to care about the soldiers and back that up by dooing something about it, i consider pretty manly indeed.

 

[Widebrim]

But, to be against the war, and then be able to care about the soldiers and back that up by dooing something about it, i consider pretty manly indeed.

I agree, and I was over there. We had no entertainers visit us, though, but we did have some Medal of Honor recipients come speak to us, against the advice of the U.S. government, which deemed the area as being too dangerous (ha, ha). That I consider an act of manliness...At any rate, my hat's off to Rollins.:eusa_clap As Jefferson said, "Dissent is the highest form of patriotism."

 

[reetpleat]

Actually, I should say that if an entertainer is actually putting himself in likely harms way to entertain the troops, then that is manly in and of itself. But I would assume ethat an entertainer that does uso shows or whatever is kept pretty well out of harms way.