The Double Breasted Silhouette

[DerMann]

This has been pestering me for quite some time now.

Reading various sources and posts here, I seem to be at a crossroads with what the double breasted silhouette is meant to accomplish.

If I recall correctly, Alan Flusser states in Dressing the Man that double breasted jackets and coats accentuate vertical lines and are great for minimalising bulk in the midsection. This is the perception that I hold.

Most pictures from the 30s and 40s seem to confirm this. This image (taken from Mr. Magnoli's website) seems to illustrate the same thing:

However, I've read in various places (Wikipedia being one) that double breasted jackets and coats add extra bulk to the midsection and are best suited for skinny, short people. This just seems wrong to me.

Any thoughts?

 

[Queue]

From askmen.com:

Like the three-button single-breasted suit, a double-breasted suit looks best on a man of medium or tall build. However, any man can wear the double-breasted provided the jacket is tailored at the waist. This is the one suit jacket that every man should have tailored to his torso. By bringing in the waistline, the wearer’s shoulders become more prominent. Smaller men can actually benefit from the double-breasted profile. And even if your waistline is wider than your shoulder width, the overlapping lapels can help to hide that waistline spread.

This seems to suggest the more classical interpretation as does GQ's Style Guy

Double-breasted isn’t that appealing on portly men, either.

I also don't see that quote in wikipedia any more (I was looking at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double-breasted) so it may have been someone at less than their brightest.

 

[Carlisle Blues]

I have wrestled with this very issue for a while. I am a size 48-50 in the shoulder and 36 waist when I am training which is most of the year.

Logically, the double breast form is boxy; off the rack. Tailored properly it forms a beautiful "vee" shape that truly accentuates the my body's form.

That being said, I may read what those in the "know" say about style; I view it as anecdotal perspective. I know what looks good on me and what makes me look good.

After all, I am the one who has to live with my decisions[huh]

 

[Big Man]

I'm 360 lbs, 6' - 6" tall, 60" in the chest and 52" in the waist. I'm too big to "hide" or "accentuate" anything. I don't know what kind of silhouette the double breasted suit forms on me, but when I wear one everyone sure seems to get out of my way.

 

[crazydaisy]

I am a big fan of suits for men and of the double breasted silhouette in particular, either boxy or taken in a bit at the waist like in that drawing. It is a classic elegant shape that works for both work and party ensembles, so to speak.
Having said that I have seen men disadvantaged by it, but I think it was more to do with wearing a disproportionately long jacket in terms of that person's height.
As for maximizing bulk, my understanding too is that it does indeed do that, that's why double breasted jacket are not suitable for very well endowed women, while those less busty look great in them. As far as women go, my observations confirm the theory. But I am no expert in men fashion.

For our wedding I am on the look for a double breasted suit for my husband. He already has a double breasted coat and looks great in it. I am thinking on the lines of a navy suit, maybe with metal buttons, so it has a slight military feel about it without looking costume, as we'll have a vintage inspired wedding affair.
So if any of you gentlemen know where I could purchase something like that in the UK please let me know. I'd be grateful to get some tips.

 

[Orgetorix]

Take a look at this photo of a single-breasted suit. The principle lines of emphasis are marked in red: the lapels and the single buttoning line along the front of the jacket. This is simple, and all the lines go basically in one direction. That's why many people say they're more flattering to those whose body shape is less than ideal.

Now, compare to this double-breasted suit: there are actually more vertical lines emphasized here than on the single-breasted jacket. Moreover, when they're placed properly, the two lower vertical lines formed by the buttons suggest a trim torso, while the lines of the lapels (and the upper buttons, if this suit had 'em) sweep up and out to make the shoulders appear broader. IMO, the DB jacket does a better job of emphasizing the ideal male figure. But notice the blue lines: there are horizontal lines present, too, because of the button configuration. I suspect this is what people are referring to when they warn against them for people who aren't slim.

The key for a flattering DB jacket is that it be cut and fit well, and especially that the placement of the front buttons be proportional to the size of the body. Short men look look best with a narrow "wrap," that is, with the lower pairs of buttons spaced more closely together. See Humphrey Bogart, who wore beautifully fitted DB suits with a narrow wrap. Big men, on the other hand, benefit from a wider wrap and more widely spaced out button stance. In my opinion, the wrap on Big Man's suit above is much too narrow for his frame. The front buttons sort of look like they're perched out on the middle of his belly, while a wider button stance would bring the whole front of the suit into proportion. See Sydney Greenstreet's for an example--he wore DBs sometimes, and when he did, they were cut as I've described.

 

[cookie]

DB = Humphrey Bogart or Fatty Boom Sticks?

I think that excellent post/thread about wraps up the subject!:eusa_clap :eusa_clap

 

[Forgotten Man]

DB's are my favorite and I find that the modern day DB's haven't the same shape as the vintage ones I own. Well, I have always felt that the DB coat can look great on most body shapes and sizes so long as the wearer is confident and knows how to wear one. Some of the largest men in the Golden era wore them due to the fact that they were very popular during those years. They also knew how to tailor in those days too.

 

[Schofields]

i guess it all depends on how you look at it. the way things fit from what i like (late 1910s-1920s) seemed to be more form fitting, so either it looked really good, or if the person was more overweight, yes the double breasted silhouette looked very odd; i dont know how the buttons didnt snap. nowadays fashion is more suited (no pun intended) towards comfort and less towards body shape.

 

[KILO NOVEMBER]

Good source for good suits, cheap

I am a big fan of suits for men and of the double breasted silhouette in particular, either boxy or taken in a bit at the waist like in that drawing. It is a classic elegant shape that works for both work and party ensembles, so to speak.
Having said that I have seen men disadvantaged by it, but I think it was more to do with wearing a disproportionately long jacket in terms of that person's height.
As for maximizing bulk, my understanding too is that it does indeed do that, that's why double breasted jacket are not suitable for very well endowed women, while those less busty look great in them. As far as women go, my observations confirm the theory. But I am no expert in men fashion.

For our wedding I am on the look for a double breasted suit for my husband. He already has a double breasted coat and looks great in it. I am thinking on the lines of a navy suit, maybe with metal buttons, so it has a slight military feel about it without looking costume, as we'll have a vintage inspired wedding affair.
So if any of you gentlemen know where I could purchase something like that in the UK please let me know. I'd be grateful to get some tips.

I have been buying suits for several years from a tailor in Bangkok. They make three tours annually to the US, UK, and Australia. They measure, take note of the particular things you want in the suit (number of rear pockets, buttons, trouser closure type, trouser pleats, jacket vent style -none, single, double- and ship them in about six weeks. The price difference between one suit and another is based on the cost of the fabric. Sunday I ordered three summer suits for a total of $805.00 US. Check the web site www.princehenry.biz to see if the UK trip includes a city near you. According to the web site, they will be in the UK in April.

 

[H.Johnson]

I think that (apart from the shoulder fit and upper arm articulation) the thing that distinguishes mens' tailoring from the so-called 'golden era' from that of today is the waist. This difference is most easily seen in the relative position of the trouser waist, but is (IMO) no less important in the cut of the jacket and this is (again IMO) more noticeable in double breasted jackets. I mean that the waist in earlier jackets shows more suppression AND the waist (just like the trouser waist) is higher than a tailor would try to place it today for a given male torso. As the placement of the waist usually involves the position of the upper fastening buttons, this gives the jacket a completely different character. Double breasted blazers and jackets produced 'off the peg' today seem to me to be 'hanging off' compared to their earlier forebears, and many recent bespoke DB jackets I have seen have nothing like the same profile. I guess, as in many things, the 'tailor's eye' is all important...

 

[Carlisle Blues]

Not too boxy

 

[John Ligonier]

Orgetorix's observations and photos are very instructive and to the point.

His observation re the positioning of buttons on a DB is critical.

I have had many MTM double-breasteds made by Brooks Brothers and by tailors and I have always insisted on the soft-shouldered silhouette so apparent in the exquisitely proportioned brown DB in Orgetorix's photo. Notice how the rounding of the shoulders gives a more subtle quality to the upper V.

Too many DBs have heavily padded shoulders -- a sort of Gangster look (which -- de gustibus non disputandem -- some people like). It is also essential that the hooked vent at the back be exactly right so that the lower silhouette from the front is straight down the hips -- a smooth line running on down the trouser. You do not want a skirt-like flare on the bottom of a DB coat.

The big guy in the photo looks absolutely great, although I would widen the horizontal space between those buttons a bit. The gray hat and navy blue suit are smashingly authoritative and he carries the whole thing well.

 

[Big Man]

... The big guy in the photo looks absolutely great, although I would widen the horizontal space between those buttons a bit. The gray hat and navy blue suit are smashingly authoritative and he carries the whole thing well.

Thanks. I've taken note of the comments/advice on the button placement and agree, they should be wider. I doubt there is anything that can be done on the suit I already have, but on any future DB I will be sure to see that the button spacing is at a maximum distance.

 

[skyvue]

I have been buying suits for several years from a tailor in Bangkok.

Kilo, they've only recently come and gone in NYC (darn the luck), but I see that they advertise a willingness to reproduce articles of clothing. I have some high-waisted trousers that I would like to have reproduced in summer-weight fabrics -- are you generally happy with the suits you've ordered? Do you think it reasonably likely that they could successfully copy some vintage trousers?

 

[Tomasso]

Do you think it reasonably likely that they could successfully copy some vintage trousers?

These folks have been at it since 1933.

 

[Son_of_Atropos]

off topic: Is there anything wrong with wearing a bowtie with a double breasted suit? I was thinking a dark red/wine color bowtie with a dark Brown suit.

Thoughts?

 

[Tomasso]

Thoughts?

Sounds good to me.



BTW, greens and yellows compliment brown as well.

 

[DerMann]

Suppose the distinction between modern and vintage (or just poorly and well cut) jackets makes the difference, not so much the clear cut 'x is good for y.'

Oddly enough, I just converted my 6x1 DB blazer, which is just a bit too big, to a 6x2. Now I have a very nicely fitting blazer.

I'll get some before/after pictures tonight.

 

[Orgetorix]

Oddly enough, I just converted my 6x1 DB blazer, which is just a bit too big, to a 6x2. Now I have a very nicely fitting blazer.

I'll get some before/after pictures tonight.

That's exactly what I did with my brown DB pictured above. Well, mine was 4x1 and I had my tailor add another buttonhole, converting it to 4x2.

Before:

After: