Show us your British suits

[Baron Kurtz]

unusual peaks; they appear to be slightly downsloping.

You're right. They do have a very, very slight downward slope.

This (below) is the first British vintage suit I bought. It was eBay suit that was marketed in the children's category with the statement "it might fit a small girl". So, you can guess how small I am.

Wonderful fabric on this one. I've never been able to decide on a date range for it, but I think it might be middle 1930s. No rear pocket flap and as always, no "watch" pocket.

 

[herringbonekid]

Sorry, I meant to say: "waistcoat buckles found on French suits", not that the waistcoat buckles marked "British" were in fact French.

do you mean that the French were importing British cinch buckles ? and we were importing French ones ? seems silly.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

I know it does. But those "For Gentlemen" suspender buttons are very very common on European suits, and I've seen a lot of "British" buckles as well. It may be a false impression I've developed.

Here's another one, and last for now. This one I swapped for with benstephens. No labels or dates. A "watch" pocket, at last! No back pocket though. Another one with the side trousers pocket sloping in from the side seam. Strange double button feature on the front closure. Good for "fat" days.

 

[Qirrel]

A "watch" pocket, at last!

I would call that a coin pocket; that is what they are called in 30s tailoring books as well. (I.e. the large flapped ones; the watch pocket is described as small and worked like a welt or a slit.

 

[herringbonekid]

I would call that a coin pocket; that is what they are called in 30s tailoring books as well.

early 30s Burtons catalogues call it a 'fob' i.e watch pocket:

 

[Baron Kurtz]

I was looking just now for that quote in my Burton's catalogues (had a vague memory of reading it). Couldn't find it, but maybe I didn't read the formal wear section as closely as I might.

cheers,

bk

 

[Qirrel]

And here is an example of the fob pocket (complete with fob) on a pair of 30s Burton trousers:

 

[Salieri]

Etymologically speaking, I believe word 'fob' historically meant the pocket itself - that was not necessarily used for a watch . Hence 'fob watch' a watch you can put in a pocket, 'fob chain' etc. etc.

I have always thought for that reason that a fob was a pocket of the kind described above regardless of intended use or presence of flap.

BTW, amazing suits BK!

 

[Baron Kurtz]

I would agree. "Watch pocket" or "fob pocket" is what has been passed down in common parlance, though, with no differentiation between types. (Hence my dilemma and my opting for "watch" pocket). These very wide flapped waist pockets are quite ugly and inelegant, IMO, and on a normal suit really rather un-necessary. This is probably the reason that my collection contains only one of them.

I make such a point of the presence/absence because I know that most vintage folks I know consider this wide, flapped, "watch" pocket to be one of the hallmarks of a British vintage (pre- mid 1950s) suit. I realised when going through my trousers a few years ago that the opposite seemed to be true, and that certainly before WWII they are the exception, not the rule. Indeed in the Burton's catalogue hbk has a pic from, waistband pockets of any kind are only mentioned in the formal wear section. There is no mention of them anywhere else in any of the large number of catalogues I have looked through. That catalogue also includes a section on instructions to branch managers, which is quite fascinating.

I would call that a coin pocket; that is what they are called in 30s tailoring books as well. (I.e. the large flapped ones; the watch pocket is described as small and worked like a welt or a slit.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

I believe "fob" is anything attached to something else to make it more manageable - watch fob, key fob, etc. I always wondered where "being fobbed off" came from. Maybe people would have a fob hanging out of a pocket, pretending they had a watch, giving a false impression of success or wealth? Maybe it's got something to do with the fob you get at racecourses for your lapel, having the connection to dodgy geezers and spivs out to rip you off?

Etymologically speaking, I believe word 'fob' historically meant the pocket itself - that was not necessarily used for a watch . Hence 'fob watch' a watch you can put in a pocket, 'fob chain' etc. etc.

I have always thought for that reason that a fob was a pocket of the kind described above regardless of intended use or presence of flap.

BTW, amazing suits BK!

 

[Nick D]

Only one of mine does (not that I have that many comparatively).

 

[Qirrel]

True that fob once meant simply "a pocket", but I think you would have to go quite far back in time for that. My dictionaries define fob as either a watch pocket, a ribbon (such as the one above) for easy access to the pocket watch, or an ornament attached to the watch chain. Which is quite confusing.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Only one of mine does (not that I have that many comparatively).

Very interesting indeed. Who produced it? And which year? And for what "type" of trousers?

True that fob once meant simply "a pocket", but I think you would have to go quite far back in time for that. My dictionaries define fob as either a watch pocket, a ribbon (such as the one above) for easy access to the pocket watch, or an ornament attached to the watch chain. Which is quite confusing.

Very confusing! English is great.

bk

 

[Qirrel]

I always wondered where "being fobbed off" came from. Maybe people would have a fob hanging out of a pocket, pretending they had a watch, giving a false impression of success or wealth? Maybe it's got something to do with the fob you get at racecourses for your lapel, having the connection to dodgy geezers and spivs out to rip you off?

According to wiktionary they have different etymologies: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/fob

Apparently the noun fob comes from fuppen: a pocket, and the verb from foppen: to mock.

 

[Nick D]

The first entry in the full OED for fob (noun) is "A small pocket formerly made in the waistband of the breeches and used for carrying a watch, money, or other valuables". Other definitions are a watch chain or ribbon and a trim resembling said ribbon.

 

[Nick D]

Very interesting indeed. Who produced it? And which year? And for what "type" of trousers?

They're mid-50s gray flannels from a suit by Burtons. I tried using it to put my keys in once, but haven't ever used it since.

 

[Qirrel]

I find the pocket quite useful for coins, but only when not wearing a vest or jacket. On a three piece suit I don't think it adds any value at all, I agree with BK that it doesn't look that good, especially when there is a vest involved. Besides, I would have had trouble filling all the pockets even if I tried: Two trouser hip pockets, two trouser side pockets, one fob/watch/whatever pocket, four vest pockets, one internal vest pocket, three external and two internal jacket pockets. And then maybe a pen pocket, a mobile phone pocket, an internal trouser waistband pocket, and separate coin pockets inside the jacket pockets, and a ticket pocket.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Ah, sorry. I thought you meant you had a catalogue making reference to this type of pocket. My bad.

bk

They're mid-50s gray flannels from a suit by Burtons. I tried using it to put my keys in once, but haven't ever used it since.

 

[herringbonekid]

i'm a big fan of the large Brit style fob pocket. while we may never be able to prove what its original purpose was i don't think that it is useful for coins (it's not easy at all to get your hand in and out) and suspect it was for a watch. i aslo disagree that it is ugly. i think it's charming.

 

[herringbonekid]

more fobs: