New Star Trek

[Matt Deckard]

SPOILERS>>> DON'T READ IF YOU HAVE NOT SEEN THE MOVIE, OR IF YOU DON'T YET WANT TO KNOW MORE!


Highlight to read \/


Saw it. I have a lot to say. It's the best movie of the year so far. Will a sci fi be recognized for awards... Maybe.

Is it Star Trek? Well it's more trek than I thought next gen was for the sake of being edgy and not fearing the PC monster. It's Star Trek injected with a dose of Star Wars and Melrose Place. Took the logic out of Vulcan. Added aliens to the mix that have been missing since the 60's (aliens that look alien). The crew was actually worried and scared like they should have been in Voyager, Next gen, DS9 and Enterprise. There are a few detail problems. I explained how JJ explained continuity earlier in the thread, yet they didn't otally go that route in the movie, they pushed it as a change in history alone.

I have a lot more in a bit. Lke how the Kelvin uniforms... well stupid canon stuff (Time changes from when the Romulan ship shows up... so why does the Kelvin crew have the Enterprise mission emblem on their uniforms?). And why did the engine room on the Enterprise look like a brewery. And How it's set up, Enterprise the series in valid historically to this version, yet Next gen is not... No Vulcan.

It's letting down to know that all the members of the crew are now top of their classes and on the flagship of Starfleet when in the original show they were just a crew assigned to a regular ship of the line that had a long history. In a way, born into royalty rather than earning their crowns. Not even the real Navy hands you a ship your first day out of the academy... but hey, it's the standard or all shows today.

All the ships leaving Starfleet Command then warping to Vulcan... Very Starship Troopers.
I can't wait to see the next one.

But that giant Nokia reference placement?/?/? That just didn't belong!

 

[JennyLou]

But that giant Nokia reference placement?/?/? That just didn't belong![/COLOR]

There was also the Budweiser logo in the bar.

Love the photos of the original Spock/Kirk and the new guys.

 

[John in Covina]

I liked it a lot and had to suspend disbelief here and there, but I liked the story.


FoOr those that have seen it if not don't read this:
It reminds me of the line from Spock in the City on the Edge of Forever about eddies in time and how they could swirl to bring the componants of history together in spite of alterations.

 

[MrBern]

The VIEW

BTW on THE VIEW today, Whoopi Goldberg (who was on TNG as well as trek movies Generations, and Nemesis)made a big deal about the new movie today. AND Nimoy was interviewed.

Some of it might be on youtube, but the whole episode is on online here:
http://abc.go.com/

enjoy

 

[MrBern]

There was also the Budweiser logo in the bar.

Love the photos of the original Spock/Kirk and the new guys.

Oh yeah, didnt they actually mention Budweiser while ordering?

 

[JennyLou]

BTW on THE VIEW today, Whoopi Goldberg (who was on TNG as well as trek movies Generations, and Nemesis)made a big deal about the new movie today. AND Nimoy was interviewed.

Some of it might be on youtube, but the whole episode is on online here:
http://abc.go.com/

enjoy

Ha, silly Whoopi. It was very amusing. I liked how she wore a Trek shirt. I love Nemoy!!!

 

[Crumblecrumb]

I know Leonard Nimoy is old so this shouldn't be surprising, but did anyone else think he looked particularly ancient in the movie? I found it a bit of a shock as the last thing I’d watched him in was Invasion of the Body Snatchers (from 1978) on telly. I felt his appearance in this reboot was largely symbolic - he was great though. I sat in a preview audience and even a bunch of sour-faced journos got excited.

 

[Lone_Ranger]

SPOILERS>>> DON'T READ IF YOU HAVE NOT SEEN THE MOVIE, OR IF YOU DON'T YET WANT TO KNOW MORE!


Highlight to read \/


There are a few detail problems. I explained how JJ explained continuity earlier in the thread, yet they didn't toally go that route in the movie, they pushed it as a change in history alone.

And why did the engine room on the Enterprise look like a brewery.

It's letting down to know that all the members of the crew are now top of their classes and on the flagship of Starfleet when in the original show they were just a crew assigned to a regular ship of the line that had a long history. In a way, born into royalty rather than earning their crowns. Not even the real Navy hands you a ship your first day out of the academy... but hey, it's the standard or all shows today.

All the ships leaving Starfleet Command then warping to Vulcan... Very Starship Troopers.
I can't wait to see the next one.

But that giant Nokia reference placement?/?/? That just didn't belong!

Highlight to read (my $0.02) \/

Matt, I'm in agreement with you on most of your points. The whole, 'instant gratification' thing rubbed me the wrong way. Kirk going from Juvenile Delinquent, to Star Fleet Academy & arriving after most of the other cast members, and getting essentially a 'battle field' promotion straight to, Captain of the Enterprise. You loose the whole back story of Kirk:

* Granted a field commission as an ensign and posted to advanced training aboard the USS Republic.

*Promoted to lieutenant junior grade and returned to Starfleet Academy as a student instructor.

*Promoted to lieutenant and served aboard the USS Farragut, under Captain Garrovick.

~ While assigned to the Farragut, Kirk commanded his first planetary survey and survived a deadly attack that killed a large portion of the Farragut's crew.

*Received his first command, the equivalent of a destroyer-class spaceship, while still quite young.

*Promoted to Captain of the Enterprise, as youngest Constitution Class Starship Captain, when there were only 12 of them, was quite an accomplishment.

Gene Roddenberry was in the military, and the LAPD, so he had a good idea how 'military type' organizations worked.

In the movie, Captain Pike tells the young Kirk, in what was the best line of the whole movie. "Your father was captain of a starship for twelve minutes. He saved 800 lives, including yours. I dare you to do better. Enlist in Starfleet." That's Beautiful! It gave me chills.

Then in the next breath says, "you can be an officer in four years, and command your own ship in eight." If it's that easy, where do the other 400 crew members come from? Does the temp agency send them over?

Good call on the brewery look. Though, speaking of brews. I kind of liked the product placement. It's comforting to know that some companies will survive to the 23 Century. I guess there's no chance of seeing a Chrysler logo? Maybe, Loral, General Dynamics, or Garmin, would show up in some of the Enterprise hardware? No? How about, Martin Baker, or Dräger?

Maybe Bones, has a bottle of Jim Beam, in his desk, for those medicinal Mint Juleps? Personally, I would have slipped a Red "HK," Heckler & Koch logo, on a Type II Phaser.

 

[carter]

From an original ST fan (when it was original)

I saw this with my daughter last evening. It was extremely entertaining (I did not doze off) and I'd see it again.

 

[MrBern]

I know Leonard Nimoy is old so this shouldn't be surprising, but did anyone else think he looked particularly ancient in the movie? I found it a bit of a shock as the last thing I’d watched him in was Invasion of the Body Snatchers (from 1978) on telly. I felt his appearance in this reboot was largely symbolic - he was great though. I sat in a preview audience and even a bunch of sour-faced journos got excited.

Nimoy does look older in the movie than in recent interviews. I believe he was made to appear more grey haired to add to the dsepiction that Spock is 129 years old.
Nimoy & Shater are both 78, born a few days apart.

Mr & Mrs Nimoy in 2008

with chris pine

nimoy in new movie

 

[MrBern]

raw nerve

from earlier this year, Shatner interviewing Nimoy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwjIQuGGV7M

 

[anon`]

Highlight to read (my $0.02) \/

Matt, I'm in agreement with you on most of your points. The whole, 'instant gratification' thing rubbed me the wrong way. Kirk going from Juvenile Delinquent, to Star Fleet Academy & arriving after most of the other cast members, and getting essentially a 'battle field' promotion straight to, Captain of the Enterprise. You loose the whole back story of Kirk:

* Granted a field commission as an ensign and posted to advanced training aboard the USS Republic.

*Promoted to lieutenant junior grade and returned to Starfleet Academy as a student instructor.

*Promoted to lieutenant and served aboard the USS Farragut, under Captain Garrovick.

~ While assigned to the Farragut, Kirk commanded his first planetary survey and survived a deadly attack that killed a large portion of the Farragut's crew.

*Received his first command, the equivalent of a destroyer-class spaceship, while still quite young.

*Promoted to Captain of the Enterprise, as youngest Constitution Class Starship Captain, when there were only 12 of them, was quite an accomplishment.

Gene Roddenberry was in the military, and the LAPD, so he had a good idea how 'military type' organizations worked.

In the movie, Captain Pike tells the young Kirk, in what was the best line of the whole movie. "Your father was captain of a starship for twelve minutes. He saved 800 lives, including yours. I dare you to do better. Enlist in Starfleet." That's Beautiful! It gave me chills.

Then in the next breath says, "you can be an officer in four years, and command your own ship in eight." If it's that easy, where do the other 400 crew members come from? Does the temp agency send them over?

Good call on the brewery look. Though, speaking of brews. I kind of liked the product placement. It's comforting to know that some companies will survive to the 23 Century. I guess there's no chance of seeing a Chrysler logo? Maybe, Loral, General Dynamics, or Garmin, would show up in some of the Enterprise hardware? No? How about, Martin Baker, or Dräger?

Maybe Bones, has a bottle of Jim Beam, in his desk, for those medicinal Mint Juleps? Personally, I would have slipped a Red "HK," Heckler & Koch logo, on a Type II Phaser.

This. And then some. Spoilers herein:

It doesn't stop with the Wiki entry on Kirk. While I appreciate Abram's attempt to explain this movie as an "alternate history" (a subject that Roddenberry seemed to like: it shows up in several episodes of both TOS and TNG, and plays a major role in at least two episodes of "Andromeda"), that presents one major problem: if this is an alternate universe from the one that we know and love from the TOS, forked at the instant Nero's ship emerged from the [white?] hole, then this crew, these characters... they're not the ones whose lives we dutifully followed for three seasons, seven movies, two episodes of TNG and one of DS9. They're just not, and that ruins the connection for me, as a hardcore Trekkie and Trekker. Then again, I wouldn't have minded one bit if the forked reality became the universe from "Mirror, Mirror"

There were, thankfully, nowhere near as many continuity/canon issues as I'd expected, but those that were there were huge, and dealt almost exclusively with the cast:
-Bones: assigned to Enterprise in 2266 as ship's surgeon. He was also attending medical school while Kirk and Spock were at the Academy; he wouldn't have been a doctor at the time Kirk enrolled.
-Chekov: born 2245 and not assigned to Enterprise until 2267 at age 22. He was twelve years Kirk's junior.
-Enterprise was launched in 2245 and captained on her first mission by Robert April. Christopher Pike assumed command in 2250 and served two complete mission and part of a third. Kirk did not assume command until 2263, when Pike was promoted to fleet captain.
-Spock: perhaps the most consistent of characters. Born in 2230, he only graduated from the Academy a year ahead of Kirk, in 2253. However, he spent the next ten years serving on Enterprise under Pike. At least it's likely that he knew of Kirk while at the Academy.
-Sulu: born in 2237 and assigned to Enterprise in 2265, but as a physicist, not helmsman. He was transferred to the latter position in 2266.
-Uhura: born in 2239 and assigned as comm officer to Enterprise by 2267.

Those are the big ones, and collectively they really keep my from enjoying this as a canonical film. Interestingly, both Scotty and Bones are portrayed as somewhat older than Kirk and Spock (as it should be: they were born in 2222 and 2227, respectively). And by the way, Karl Urban put everyone else to shame and was, IMNSHO, the only actor in this film who lived up to the standard set by the actor who originally portrayed the character. Zoë Saldana came close, though.

Now then, what I did like:
-Sound design. Beautifully done. They did an excellent job updating the sounds from TOS to sound, well, better, all while still paying homage to the original effects.
-Art design. By and large, as above. I wish they'd kept the original black/red/grey colour scheme of the ship's interior (it looks too much like the refitted Enterprise from ST:TMP as is), but I can live with it. I hated two aspect, however: the interior of the Romulan vessel, and the enigneering deck on board Enterprise. I think Matt called it a brewery. I kept thinking Axis Chemicals. Oddly, for being as inflexible about this sort of stuff as I am, I still loved the "re-imagined" exterior, for all the same reasons as before.
-Karl Urban as Bones. I mentioned it above. He was perfect for the part.
-The "Easter eggs": both Bones and Scotty got signature lines, graphics were recycled, the reference to Bones' fear of death while traveling, obvious reference to the Menkaran Ceti eel, Captain Pike's appearance in a wheelchair (despite the apocryphal nature of it), the very faithfully-reproduced shuttles from the introductory sequence, Nero's reprisal of Kirk's rage from ST2, Spock's word-for-word quote from the end to ST3, Spock's reprisal of Scotty's technological tinkering from ST4, the reversed Enterprise mission emblems (even if they were used for all Starfleet personnel, a convention not enacted until 2278), and so on. Oh yeah, and REDSHIRTS!

Good God that's a lot of blacked out text. For those who aren't interested in totally geeking out on the subject, final verdict:

As a science-fantasy film: solid B, maybe B+ or even A-. Probably the best in the genre, IMNSHO, since "Serenity". The plot seems to just kinda collapse at the end, when I was expecting the film to carry on for another 30 minutes or so. This is, really, a testament to good storytelling on the part of Abrams and crew.
As a Star Trek film: C at best, but more like D, really. I just couldn't buy into the "alternate timeline" thing (see above). As noted, sound and art design were extraordinary, for the most part, but the story itself was lacking. It didn't have that "Roddenberry style" that is next to impossible to explain, but ever so obvious in those works that he influenced.
As an apocryphal Star Trek film: B- to B. I admit, I did enjoy it if I stopped thinking about "canonical vs. not". I can't help but feel, however, that it would've done even better had Moore still been involved. It'll never hope to live up to "The Wrath of Khan", "The Search for Spock" or "The Undiscovered Country", but it sure as heck was better than "The Final Frontier" or "Nemesis". Even with the canonical problems.

Ok, that's enough geeking out for me for one night. I need more alcohol if I'm going to keep this up...

 

[MrBern]

Context

warning: theres a spoiler or two in this assessment of trek's context in history politics

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/10/weekinreview/10itzkoff.html

 

[Lone_Ranger]

I did like the new look of the Enterprise exterior, and the uniform makeover. They were able to give Uhura, her short skirt and boots back, without making her look like an extra from an "Austin Powers" movie. Didn't really care for the interior shots.

One word, MARPAT....The US Marine Corps, new MARPAT (short for MARine PATtern) is a pixelated camouflage pattern.

Authentic MARPAT material is distinguishable by an Eagle, Globe, and Anchor emblem incorporated into the pattern, in both the Woodland and Desert patterns.


(look closely) Wonder if that's where the idea came from?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:MARPAT_woodland_pattern.jpg

 

[TopGumby]

Thumbs up from the whole family. This is an entertaining movie, and it's closer to the TOS spirit than anything that Trek has done in years.

 

[MrBern]

reality

the space shuttle liftoff this morning

No sign of romulans

 

[MrBern]

SNL

Weekend Update rips StarTrek fans upset with canon issues

http://www.nbc.com/Saturday_Night_Live/video/clips/update-feature-star-trek/1099561/?dst=nbc|widget|NBC%20Video&__source=nbc|widget|NBC%20Video

 

[MrBern]

jimmy fallon

I really dont think much of Jimmy Fallon's interview style, but heres nimoy & quinto together

http://www.hulu.com/watch/72415/late-night-with-jimmy-fallon-the-two-spocks-quinto-and-nimoy

 

[Solid Citizen]

new TREK

"Captain Kirk will always be William Shatner, and William Shatner will always be Captain Kirk."
– Star Trek's new Captain Kirk Chris Pine, giving props to the original leader of the starship Enterprise, to PEOPLE

SPOCK will ALWAYS be Leonard Nimoy & Leonard Nimoy will ALWAYS be SPOCK. Agree the same with William Shatner! Solid Citizen

 

[Solid Citizen]

Ben Cross in STAR TREK

Could someone post side by side photos Chariots of Fire star Ben Cross in that flic & as SPOCK"s Father in the current Trek? Thanks! Solid Citizen