Mrs. Hitler in London?

[BinkieBaumont]

[YOUTUBE]tDbzyFZyDVM&feature=related[/YOUTUBE]

 

[dhermann1]

Fascinating. Well done. Tom Oswald was lucky enough to get arrested BEFORE war broke out, so he was never convicted of treason. John Amery, the mentally ill son of MP Leo Avery, was not so lucky. He went to Germany and made propaganda broadcasts fopr the Nazis throughout the war. He was hanged for treason afterwards.
The Mitfords are a gaggle of fascinating gals. I believe all of them were pretty reactionary, to one degree or another.
There were, of course, many people around the world, in every country, who were infatuated with Nazism. Many French fought for Hitler in Russia. And there have been many threads here on the subject of everybody's favorite fashion plate, the Duke of Windsor, and his Hitler loving wife.

 

[lolly_loisides]

The Mitfords are a gaggle of fascinating gals. I believe all of them were pretty reactionary, to one degree or another.

Not all of them, Jessica Mitford (the sixth daughter) was by no means a reactionary. She emigrated to the States in the late 30's & was an active civil rights campaigner. She was a member of the Communist party in the 50's & was called to the house of Un American activities. She refused to testify.

So fascinating yes, but reactionary? Oh no.

 

[dhermann1]

Sorry, you're right. I've wanted to learn more about them for a long time.

 

[lolly_loisides]

The last Mitford girl turned 90 in March. Here's an interesting little article about her
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...rl-bemoans-demise-of-the-stiff-upper-lip.html

 

[Tiller]

I don't know if fascism and Nazism should really be called reactionary, a police state is hardly monarchical. I'd simply call it another form of Statism, which also includes communism . All the Mitford Sister's (except for the two who kept their head down) were Statist they just cheered for different reasons for a large state to exist.

As far as the Mitford Sister go, they all knew how to get publicity, and all are interesting characters. Then again it's always interesting to see what the young of the idle rich do with their time .

 

[lolly_loisides]

I don't know if fascism and Nazism should really be called reactionary, a police state is hardly monarchical.

Of course Fascists & Nazis should be called reactionaries. The common usage of the word refers to opponents of socialism & communism. I think it's fair enough to say that Unity & Diana opposed the Communists.

Oh & I think you'll find it's idle rich, not ideal rich

 

[Chas]

Strictly speaking, they weren't reactionairies. They were revolutionaries.

How they hell would one live with that name? Imagine, if you will, the maitre 'd at a restaurant.... talking on a phone where everyone could hear....
"So that will be a table for two, dinner at eight. Under the name of Hitler. Fine, we'll see you then, Mr. Hitler."

Question: "What was it like living next door to the Hitlers?"
answer: "Ask the Polish..."

 

[lolly_loisides]

Mr Hitler, paging Mr Hitler.............

Communists were revolutionaries too and I just can't put Communists & Nazis together in the same basket. Sorry. They certainly weren't during WW2.

 

[Tiller]

Of course Fascists & Nazis should be called reactionaries. The common usage of the word refers to opponents of socialism & communism. I think it's fair enough to say that Unity & Diana opposed the Communists.

The world of political science doesn't start and end with socialism . Technically speaking reactionaries are those who want to turn back the Enlightenment, and specifically the rise of classic liberalism and capitalism, and return to the Monarchy (or landed gentry at the very least) or a state even before the Monarchy. Monarchist are reactionary, neo-feudalist are reactionary, primativist are reactionary. Luddites are reactionary, Theocracies are reactionary. They are reacting against the Age of Enlightenment.

Fascism and Nazism on the other hand started out as the right side of socialism (Mussolini himself starting as a run of the mill left wing socialist). Some fascist were sympathetic to monarchies, others worked with them when they had to, and others like Hitler despised monarchy (Hitler blamed the Kaiser for the losing the Great War). The single party police state is a generally new form of government.

Most modern totalitarianism, has risen out of belief in Statism. A belief that a large bureaucratic state, and politics, could correct the "errors" of human nature and the systems already in place. The true difference between a Communist and a Fascist is the ends they desire to achieve with the State, the means are identical, especially for those poor people who have had to live under it.

Oh & I think you'll find it's idle rich, not ideal rich

Thank you and edited. Sometimes I don't type what I'm thinking, especially when its 3:30 in the morning lol.

 

[lolly_loisides]

Gosh, thanks for the politics lesson. Guess I didn't need that degree I wasted 3 years on:eusa_doh:

 

[Tiller]

Gosh, thanks for the politics lesson. Guess I didn't need that degree I wasted 3 years on:eusa_doh:

I wasted my minor on PoliSci (as we always wrote it out as). Once upon a time I loved politics, but then I grew out of it and I changed my life's goals. Like most of the social sciences though their are disagreements , but I was taught what I was taught and I'm to uninterested in politics now a days to learn any new theories lol. The Marxist school, Feminist school (divided even further into what was it 6 "branches"), Austrian School (who's theories I always believed in most and outlined above), German Historical school, Chicago School, honestly looking back now I'm not sure why I ever enjoyed it lol.

Truth be told I've lost a lot of interest in the soft sciences. Psychology, sociology, political science, and even history aren't what they once were to me. I used to care about the study of them once upon at time lol. Oddly enough though for some reason I do still enjoy economics (I know I'm very sick lol).

 

[LordBest]

Hm, I'm not sure I would consider Great Britain, Australia, Canada, New Zealand, Sweden, Spain, Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark and Japan to be anti-Enlightenment, yet they are all constitutional Monarchies.

It is interesting that Fascism and Communism were both considered 'left wing' when they existed in a meaningful fashion, yet Fascism is now widely regarded as 'right wing' despite the 'right wing' (Conservatives) being loathed by both Fascists and Communists.

Slightly more on-topic, Nancy Mitford wrote some rather good biographies of Louis XIV and Madame du Pompadour.

and return to the Monarchy (or landed gentry at the very least) or a state even before the Monarchy. Monarchist are reactionary, neo-feudalist are reactionary, primativist are reactionary. Luddites are reactionary, Theocracies are reactionary. They are reacting against the Age of Enlightenment.

 

[MissHannah]

I find the Mitfords utterly fascinating. I highly recommend this as an informative read:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Mitfords-Le...=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1276866907&sr=1-2

Their private slang and nicknames are very infectious!

 

[Edward]

I've not read it as of yet myself, but I bought that a few years ago for my mother as a Christmas present, and she loved it.

 

[MissHannah]

The only problem is that by the end you find yourself feeling rather sympathetic towards Diana Mosely when she is the last of the 6 siblings left alive and alone. As a rule I try not to sympathise with fascists :eusa_doh:

 

[Tomasso]

"Money and illness and sex were not talked about in those days and they are the only things people talk about these days, aren't they?

The last Mitford girl turned 90 in March. Here's an interesting little article about her
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...rl-bemoans-demise-of-the-stiff-upper-lip.html

 

[Puzzicato]

The only problem is that by the end you find yourself feeling rather sympathetic towards Diana Mosely when she is the last of the 6 siblings left alive and alone. As a rule I try not to sympathise with fascists :eusa_doh:

But Diana isn't the last - Debo, Dowager Duchess of Devonshire is.

I loved that book. It was interesting seeing their relationship from their earliest days and seeing how such dramatically different personalities and perspectives could come out of the same environment.

 

[lolly_loisides]

I find the Mitfords utterly fascinating. I highly recommend this as an informative read:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Mitfords-Le...=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1276866907&sr=1-2

Their private slang and nicknames are very infectious!

That's a good one, but I think the most comprehensive biography about the family is "The House of Mitford" by Jonathan Guinness http://www.amazon.co.uk/House-Mitford-Jonathan-Guinness/dp/0753818035

 

[MissHannah]

But Diana isn't the last - Debo, Dowager Duchess of Devonshire is.

I loved that book. It was interesting seeing their relationship from their earliest days and seeing how such dramatically different personalities and perspectives could come out of the same environment.

You're absolutely right. I think she made a reference to not wanting to be left alone and it affected me so much that I actually thought it happened! I did adore the book. Sibling relationships are fascinating at the best of times but they were all so extraordinary.As you say, the different perspectives were really interesting - seeing an argument or situation from at least 3 different angles!