Legendary USA Black Stallion is Back

[Aloysius]

Yeah it’s genuinely weird how they set up orders without even a sample in hand.

 

[MattieXMoto]

Wow. How sad. I purchased twice from Lengendary with zero issues. Looks like something has changed there. How can you sell a jacket without a sample in hand for real photos. They must have a prototype?

D-pockets are cool. But this process sounds like a massive headache. Now I know to just go buco on the classifieds and hunt pre owned.

 

[tek8080]

A sample and images of the actual item would have prevented all of this. Whether it be through preventing the orders to begin with, or by preventing cancellations once it was revealed Schott wasn't the maker.

I still hope they knock it out of the park as I said earlier, but I honestly agree with Ton that it's probably not going to be nearly as good as the prior black stallions. EDSIM doesn't have a track record of anything but fashion pieces and the owner comes from the fashion industry, as does his ex wife. But hey if they have good leather, great machinists, and make it to Legendary's specifications it could still be great. Hopefully people unhappy with the purchase can get a refund and not just an exchange. It'll probably be difficult to flip these without a big loss given the lack of notoriety of the maker.

 

[Guppy]

It'll probably be difficult to flip these without a big loss given the lack of notoriety of the maker.

The bigger issue will be when people do go to look at a used Black Stallion in the future, there's going to be questions as to which version it is, the Schott or the EDSIM. And that will cause confusion that will make them harder to sell to buyers who know what they're looking for enough to be willing to pay the better price for it. Just imagine having the $1299 Schott version from the run 10 years ago, and trying to sell it now, when they have a (for all we currently know, likely inferior) $918 version that was just available at 15-20% off.

 

[Aloysius]

The bigger issue will be when people do go to look at a used Black Stallion in the future, there's going to be questions as to which version it is, the Schott or the EDSIM. And that will cause confusion that will make them harder to sell to buyers who know what they're looking for enough to be willing to pay the better price for it. Just imagine having the $1299 Schott version from the run 10 years ago, and trying to sell it now, when they have a (for all we currently know, likely inferior) $918 version that was just available at 15-20% off.

Well, if they end up being so (even just visually) similar that it's hard to tell, that would be great!

 

[JMax]

Now watch, it will be stitched like a LW, a hide like Thedi and fit like Vanson.

 

[CaughtBetweenWorlds]

Hello!

I’m an occasional lurker and new member who signed up specifically to read up on the drama surrounding this jacket.

Like many of you, for years I’ve coveted the Black Stallion. When I received the email about the jacket relaunching, I was pretty excited. I hesitated for a few days on ordering because I didn’t need another leather jacket, but the 20% code got me to pull the trigger.

It wasn’t until I came across their IG post yesterday showing a completely different jacket, that I went down the rabbit hole and ended up here.

As someone who has purchased from Legendary in the past, including multiple Schott jackets and even used their trade-in program, I’ve always had a good experience with them.

But the botched rollout of this jacket along with the anecdotes on here about their CS definitely leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

That said, I do feel there are reasons to be cautiously optimistic about Black Stallion '23:


- While EDSIM does appear to deal primarily with fashion leathers, they’ve been around since 1980 (per LinkedIn) so I’m willing to bet they have the contacts to procure high-quality HH.

And when it comes to the cut and sew process, I do think Legendary took care in who they contracted with and it is ultimately their design, their specs, and their pattern that is being used. Limited run also makes it easier to spot QC issues, presumably.

Others ITT mentioning the HH Beck vest from Legendary being great makes me think the overall quality in terms of materials and craftsmanship will be up to par.

- The “weird Fedora forum” may make up a minority of their pre-orders, though chances are a good chunk of purchases were from a different, but equally discerning, audience— those who ride.

Of course these demos are not mutually exclusive, but when it comes to riders who want a durable and functional jacket and don’t necessarily care about tannery sourcing and all that other nerdy goodness, I don't think Legendary would be able to sell a nearly $1000 jacket under their own brand and have it be subpar.

This is a company that cut their teeth on selling top-quality riding gear, and I don't think they'd hurt their credibility, or that of the legendary Black Stallion, to make a quick buck.


Ultimately, I guess a bunch of us will find out where the dust settles in the next few weeks.

Worst case scenario, I’ll just return it. I did see people mentioning their return policy changed, but their money back guarantee for Legendary products is still active on their site, FWIW.

 

[AHP91]

Hello!

I’m an occasional lurker and new member who signed up specifically to read up on the drama surrounding this jacket.

Like many of you, for years I’ve coveted the Black Stallion. When I received the email about the jacket relaunching, I was pretty excited. I hesitated for a few days on ordering because I didn’t need another leather jacket, but the 20% code got me to pull the trigger.

It wasn’t until I came across their IG post yesterday showing a completely different jacket, that I went down the rabbit hole and ended up here.

As someone who has purchased from Legendary in the past, including multiple Schott jackets and even used their trade-in program, I’ve always had a good experience with them.

But the botched rollout of this jacket along with the anecdotes on here about their CS definitely leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

That said, I do feel there are reasons to be cautiously optimistic about Black Stallion '23:


- While EDSIM does appear to deal primarily with fashion leathers, they’ve been around since 1980 (per LinkedIn) so I’m willing to bet they have the contacts to procure high-quality HH.

And when it comes to the cut and sew process, I do think Legendary took care in who they contracted with and it is ultimately their design, their specs, and their pattern that is being used. Limited run also makes it easier to spot QC issues, presumably.

Others ITT mentioning the HH Beck vest from Legendary being great makes me think the overall quality in terms of materials and craftsmanship will be up to par.

- The “weird Fedora forum” may make up a minority of their pre-orders, though chances are a good chunk of purchases were from a different, but equally discerning, audience— those who ride.

Of course these demos are not mutually exclusive, but when it comes to riders who want a durable and functional jacket and don’t necessarily care about tannery sourcing and all that other nerdy goodness, I don't think Legendary would be able to sell a nearly $1000 jacket under their own brand and have it be subpar.

This is a company that cut their teeth on selling top-quality riding gear, and I don't think they'd hurt their credibility, or that of the legendary Black Stallion, to make a quick buck.


Ultimately, I guess a bunch of us will find out where the dust settles in the next few weeks.

Worst case scenario, I’ll just return it. I did see people mentioning their return policy changed, but their money back guarantee for Legendary products is still active on their site, FWIW.

Blink twice if Legendary proofread your post before submitting

 

[Aloysius]

Worst case scenario, I’ll just return it. I did see people mentioning their return policy changed, but their money back guarantee for Legendary products is still active on their site, FWIW.

The reason we think the return policy on Legendary branded products changed is that the reps explicitly said so, when asked.

 

[CaughtBetweenWorlds]

The reason we think the return policy on Legendary branded products changed is that the reps explicitly said so, when asked.

I get that, but the policy on their site remains the same, so I would just be holding them to their own policy as publicly listed.

 

[Aloysius]

I get that, but the policy on their site remains the same, so I would just be holding them to their own policy as publicly listed.

Policies are all in flux now. They were initially refusing to refund someone’s preorder a few days ago until he brought up the fact that it was potentially a legal issue.

 

[CaughtBetweenWorlds]

I'm pretty sure they are based in Jersey (as am I), so if it came down to it, I would not hesitate in name-dropping the NJ Consumer Fraud Act if that is what it would take to get them to adhere to their own listed policy.

TBH the whole using two different jackets from two different brands to advertise the jacket they are selling while not disclosing neither is representative of the final product itself is problematic

 

[Guppy]

Hello!

I’m an occasional lurker and new member who signed up specifically to read up on the drama surrounding this jacket.

Like many of you, for years I’ve coveted the Black Stallion. When I received the email about the jacket relaunching, I was pretty excited. I hesitated for a few days on ordering because I didn’t need another leather jacket, but the 20% code got me to pull the trigger.

It wasn’t until I came across their IG post yesterday showing a completely different jacket, that I went down the rabbit hole and ended up here.

As someone who has purchased from Legendary in the past, including multiple Schott jackets and even used their trade-in program, I’ve always had a good experience with them.

But the botched rollout of this jacket along with the anecdotes on here about their CS definitely leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

That said, I do feel there are reasons to be cautiously optimistic about Black Stallion '23:


- While EDSIM does appear to deal primarily with fashion leathers, they’ve been around since 1980 (per LinkedIn) so I’m willing to bet they have the contacts to procure high-quality HH.

And when it comes to the cut and sew process, I do think Legendary took care in who they contracted with and it is ultimately their design, their specs, and their pattern that is being used. Limited run also makes it easier to spot QC issues, presumably.

Others ITT mentioning the HH Beck vest from Legendary being great makes me think the overall quality in terms of materials and craftsmanship will be up to par.

- The “weird Fedora forum” may make up a minority of their pre-orders, though chances are a good chunk of purchases were from a different, but equally discerning, audience— those who ride.

Of course these demos are not mutually exclusive, but when it comes to riders who want a durable and functional jacket and don’t necessarily care about tannery sourcing and all that other nerdy goodness, I don't think Legendary would be able to sell a nearly $1000 jacket under their own brand and have it be subpar.

This is a company that cut their teeth on selling top-quality riding gear, and I don't think they'd hurt their credibility, or that of the legendary Black Stallion, to make a quick buck.


Ultimately, I guess a bunch of us will find out where the dust settles in the next few weeks.

Worst case scenario, I’ll just return it. I did see people mentioning their return policy changed, but their money back guarantee for Legendary products is still active on their site, FWIW.

I hope you'll be back to report on how you like it when you receive it.

Despite the poor customer service experiences reported by some who canceled their orders, I think Legendary has had a good reputation as a merchant for many years, and I would like to see them continue to succeed.

I want this jacket to be every bit as good as the previous ones.

I too was willing to take a wait and see approach, keep my order, and return if I wasn't satisfied. But when I reached out to their customer service to ask them to confirm the (at the time, now confirmed) rumor about this batch not being produced by Schott, and confirm my understanding of the return policy as it applied to my pre-order, I didn't feel comfortable with keeping my order open, so I canceled it.

I have dozens of jackets including a Black Stallion that I had just acquired the week before these were announced, and I don't need this one, although I was certainly interested in it, given the prospect of having 1.4mm FQHH. But if I can only return for exchange or store credit, that's a no-go for me.

The website can say what it says, but if the CSR can't echo what it says, it means when comes time to test the policy, I could be in for a difficult time, and I don't have time to have a fight over something like this.

But I'm glad someone who posts here is willing to take a chance on it, and I hope you're truly satisfied with what you receive. It would be wonderful if the new run measures up to what Schott were producing for them in the past.

(I do also have some concern about what this change in sourcing implies for Legendary's future relationship with Schott, but as long as the quality is what it should be, I believe in the long run they'll be fine. Labels change sources as a common thing, and it's often not a big deal.

In this case, it was a big deal, to me, because the pre-sale indications all looked like it was a Schott made jacket -- old pictures, old model number following Schott's model number convention -- and the return policy being iffy was the final straw for me.)

 

[Aloysius]

In this case, it was a big deal, to me, because the pre-sale indications all looked like it was a Schott made jacket -- old pictures, old model number following Schott's model number convention -- and the return policy being iffy was the final straw for me.)

New model number following Schott’s convention, which is what made it worse.

 

[Guppy]

New model number following Schott’s convention, which is what made it worse.

I must have missed that... what was it, did the old one use 696H and the new one 696HH?

 

[Will Zach]

Blink twice if Legendary proofread your post before submitting

Sounded like that, didn't it?

 

[CaughtBetweenWorlds]

I must have missed that... what was it, did the old one use 696H and the new one 696HH

Product SKU is 696HH.

This, along with a line about their partner being an experienced maker of motorcycle jackets out of Jersey, is what led to the original belief it was Schott.

The line was removed, but the SKU is the same.

 

[Aloysius]

I must have missed that... what was it, did the old one use 696H and the new one 696HH?

Yep. I know that sounds like a tiny thing to notice but I looked back and the Schott model seemed to always be designated with a single H. The double H means they didn't just copy-paste the old listing, either; it means they deliberately put in a new Schott-style model number.

 

[Guppy]

Yep. I know that sounds like a tiny thing to notice but I looked back and the Schott model seemed to always be designated with a single H. The double H means they didn't just copy-paste the old listing, either; it means they deliberately put in a new Schott-style model number.

There are some Schott models that have used a HH suffix, such as the 641HH. I don't know why Schott uses one or the other, it seems to be random. They currently offer the 641HH and the 689H, so it's not a matter of era. I suppose it could be a matter of era when it was originally introduced, and then they keep the model name constant over the years; I really couldn't say.

Product SKU is 696HH.

This, along with a line about their partner being an experienced maker of motorcycle jackets out of Jersey, is what led to the original belief it was Schott.

The line was removed, but the SKU is the same.

That is a good point about the "experienced maker of motorcycle jackets out of Jersey"... that also seemed to be a strong hint that it was Schott, when I read it. I actually was disbelieving the rumor at first because of that line, particularly when we were briefly thinking it was Hillside USA, who are in Florida...

 

[Aloysius]

There are some Schott models that have used a HH suffix, such as the 641HH. I don't know why Schott uses one or the other, it seems to be random. They currently offer the 641HH and the 689H, so it's not a matter of era. I suppose it could be a matter of era when it was originally introduced, and then they keep the model name constant over the years; I really couldn't say.

Yes, Schott uses both but their version of this jacket was always single-H.