How many own a vintage suit?

[Jovan]

I've gotten two things done by an online tailor. That's a lot more risky, so I hope to invest in a better one (like Magnoli since he seems to get the fit right the first time) or a face-to-face bespoke tailor.

I've talked with Magnoli about doing the tweed suit seen to the left in my avatar, but with canvassing and all I'd have to save up quite a bit. As well, there's barely a season to wear it here. I am considering getting cotton trousers and a shirt from him though, just to test the waters.

 

[reetpleat]

Just to weigh in, I couldn't match any of the categories of the survey. I spent five great yeras dealing in, and wearing vintage 24/7 in the grand old days of the swing scene.

I have owned many many vintage suits, many of which I would be embarrased to wear today because in my early days zI did not know fit so well. I also got rid of a lot of the more boring suits, as I don't wear them daily.

I will soon put up some pics of me in my gear.

I don't even wear it that much now that I live in Seattle, but I still love my closet full of vintage.

I like the sportswear, and that is where the money is, but when I have five minutes, and I run into a thrift store, I check out the suits and overcoats. Slim pickins these days. But now that I have tapped into this site, I will pick up good stuff when I find it. stuff that isn't worth much, but would be appreciated here, iwill pick up and sell for cost plus shipping.

Anyway, glad to be here. Put me down as closet full of vintage, but not my only wardrobe.

There was a time that I thought I was the only guy in the world who was into vintage stuff. It is nice to find fellow travelers.

Oh, for the record, i won about ten suits, four need major tailoring, four need minor tailoring, and only two are wearable right now. gained weight and not a lot of money at the moment.

 

[dr greg]

In the swim

The main problem I have with vintage clothes is that as an Australian, I learnt to swim at an early age, and still bodysurf regularly, therefore I have the classic developed shoulders that brings. Clothes in the past were not cut to allow for this, and at the markets I sell most of my old shirts to Euro-tourists who don't have a beach culture because they fit them, unlike most locals. I have to hunt for a slightly larger size than I should do for my own garments to deal with it.

 

[Will]

Hmm. Interesting. 79 views and only 17 votes.

None of the poll categories quite apply.

I still have a couple that were made for me in the 70's that I haven't donated yet but they no longer fit.

I don't think they are any better than the suits I get today, though I agree that suits from the 50's and earlier were much better made than Men's Warehouse class fused suits today.

 

[manton]

Matt and I have been talking and we firmly believe that a man can't possibly understand how a suit should fit unless he owns a suit made before the 70s.

I disagree. A well fitted bespoke suit cannot be beat, or can only be beat by chance. For most of us, finding a vintage suit that took into account all of our little fit irregularites would be pure luck. I don't think it would be even remotely possible in my case.

 

[manton]

But if you want a heavyweight town fabric, you're probably going to be out of luck

Not necessarily. Lesser still makes a 16 ounce book with a pretty good selection. Dugdale and Bateman & Ogden may as well be vintage; the cloth hasn't changed at all in years. Smith Woolens is getting back into the heavyweight game with the Whole Fleece line: up tp 15 ounces. Minnis and Fox both make woolen flannels just like the West of Englands of old.

 

[Senator Jack]

Even if you do go bespoke, as related here at the lounge all too often, you still have to tell them how to make the suit. Unless you specify high armholes, and long rise trousers, you're not going to get them, and you're not going to think about those specifications unless you actually own (or at least once donned) a suit from the era when they knew how to make suits. Quite the conundrum, yes?

I'm guessing with the sort of jack these men have, their suits aren't off the peg. While they were both around in the 60s, it's obvious that both forgot how suits are supposed to be cut.

 

[manton]

Even if you do go bespoke, as related here at the lounge all too often, you still have to tell them how to make the suit. Unless you specify high armholes, and long rise trousers, you're not going to get them, and you're not going to think about those specifications unless you actually own (or at least once donned) a suit from the era when they knew how to make suits. Quite the conundrum, yes?

Oh, I don't think so. Not necessarily. I have never owned a vintage suit. I got into high-rise, brace-back trousers because a Savile Row tailor introduced them to me.

As for armholes, I don't have to specify that they be high. Every tailor I have ever used makes them that way as a matter of course. They consider it one of the hallmarks of bespoke. This is not to say that I don't provide a lot of input. I do. I am pickier than most clients and like to specify a lot of things. But a high armhole should be part of the deal whether you specify it or not. Or, to be a little more precise, an armhole that fits you. Higher is only better up to a point. Once it starts to bind, it's too high. The shape of the scye also matters.

There are tailors working today who know how to cut a suit and do it right. My favorite is a very "vintage" oriented guy, but he is still making modern clothes. Good tailors have learned from other good tailors, accumlating decades of passed-down knowledge, and also studied the classic pattern drafts. So the knowledge that made vintage suits great is at their fingertips.

 

[Matt Deckard]

I have seen bespoke suits being made and the tailor doesn't necessarily make the best armhole for the client because tailors today do not take armhole measurements nor do they know how.

When it comes to bespoke it's true, the armhole should be high enough to provide movement though low enough not to bind. It's acomplished best by using the anchoring measurement which comes from behind your neck and goes under your armpits and back up your back. it's an anchor measurement which keeps the collar and the armpits fitted a all times. Todays off the rack companies Go by a ratio when making their suit jackets and most custom tailors just no longer take the measurement.

As you can see on the presedent's suit the jacket juts away from his body as he raises his arm This wasn't a popular look in the old days.

The suit Mr. Grant is wearing in the photo below shows there is much less distance between his collar and his armpit which allows the shoulders to stay in place.

You can have built up shoulders though that doesn't change the distance from collar to armpit.

I believe custom is the way to go nowadays... i have had plenty of off the rack modern suits, though the biggest difference between what was made then and what is made now is balance. Too many times do i see the super narrow trousers paired with the bag jacket, or the supressed waist with the giant skirt and collar on the jacket. Yes they are style choices though they usually make the jacket look like it wasn't tailored and that the center button is the only thing suppressing the waist and not the tailoring of the garment.

It's like the modern three button suit which even if made to have all buttons functional, the jacket looks awkward in many cases where the wearer wants to button the top and middle button. Balance is needed in the lapelles to cary off this look and the correct chest fit. today this is rarely done correctly.

I prefer this look, though the problem today is that most people would think it looks dated or overdone. I don't. I've found it hard to find a tailor which is willing and able to copy this look and fit. We have seen a few on this board such as tadeki okasaki, and I'm still waiting for a few garments to come in... though The clothes that I have had made so far are still not up to par with many of the garments you find off the rack from the 30's 40's or 50's.

I'll need to post some pics of how one of my suits linings was finished at the bottom... that lining is never coming undone.

 

[vonwotan]

IMHO - where some of us differ in our experiences with tailors may be due to the difference between made-to-measure and a truly bespoke suit. A made to measure suit is based on a modified but somewhat standard pattern and proportions, and larger / lower armholes are used to accommodate the largest number of customers.

For a bespoke suit you should be measured more thoroughly and any idiosyncrasies assessed, and only a pattern created / cut for the first fitting. From there your tailor should make any necessary adjustments and create an unfinished garment for the second fitting; and, in a third fitting, confirm that the fit is correct.

There is a marked difference in price and quality between made-to-measure suits and bespoke suits reflecting the labor and skill required for each. Many tailors today do not clearly distinguish and describe their suits as "custom." Frequently these are made to measure suits, and in some cases made-to-measure suits offering some of the details you might find in a bespoke suit - working hand stitched button holes, etc.

 

[Matt Deckard]

i tend to think of modern made to measure as ready made. Made to measure never tends to measure up to vintage off the rack or bespoke of today.

 

[GoneSolo]

With Luck there will be plenty to go around.......

I am getting a new digital camera this weekend.......when we get this mess together and I know what's what I'll let you all know.......

36S over here! Please and thank you!

 

[happyfilmluvguy]

Funny how some of us are discussing and some of us are shopping.

Oh well, fun is the word for it.

We all might as well walk around naked if it makes us feel any better.

 

[Mr. Rover]

I believe that the suits from Road to Perdition were made by a Chicago tailor of some renown, although customers from the Fedora Lounge weren't as satisfied. Somone posted his name a while back.

 

[reetpleat]

I disagree. A well fitted bespoke suit cannot be beat, or can only be beat by chance. For most of us, finding a vintage suit that took into account all of our little fit irregularites would be pure luck. I don't think it would be even remotely possible in my case.

There are two things to diferentiate between. One is fit, and the other is quality. A bespoke suit, if done as it should is bound to be a perfect fit to your body. But that does not mean it is as good or better quality in terms of fabric, stitching, materials etc. It may be, I wouldn't know. but you can't compare apples to oranges. Custom for fit, and quality may be a toos up.

 

[reetpleat]

Oh, I don't think so. Not necessarily. I have never owned a vintage suit. I got into high-rise, brace-back trousers because a Savile Row tailor introduced them to me.

As for armholes, I don't have to specify that they be high. Every tailor I have ever used makes them that way as a matter of course. They consider it one of the hallmarks of bespoke. This is not to say that I don't provide a lot of input. I do. I am pickier than most clients and like to specify a lot of things. But a high armhole should be part of the deal whether you specify it or not. Or, to be a little more precise, an armhole that fits you. Higher is only better up to a point. Once it starts to bind, it's too high. The shape of the scye also matters.

There are tailors working today who know how to cut a suit and do it right. My favorite is a very "vintage" oriented guy, but he is still making modern clothes. Good tailors have learned from other good tailors, accumlating decades of passed-down knowledge, and also studied the classic pattern drafts. So the knowledge that made vintage suits great is at their fingertips.

I don't know, but my guess would be that european and british tailors tend to do more traditional cuts and style, and custom tailors that do work for americans do more loose modern cuts.

I do find it interesting to find sixties and seventies suits tailored in asia and usually made for asian men (name on tag or size) are cut much tighter in the back and higher in the arms than a comparable american suit. Even today when i find a modern or eighties nineties german suit in a thrift store, they are cut much tighter. I just assumed european preferences are still more traditional.

 

[Jovan]

We all might as well walk around naked if it makes us feel any better.

That would be perfectly logical when not working, in the cold, etc. but unfortunately society as a whole doesn't want that to happen anytime soon. :eusa_doh: Unfortunate.

 

[reetpleat]

I believe that the suits from Road to Perdition were made by a Chicago tailor of some renown, although customers from the Fedora Lounge weren't as satisfied. Somone posted his name a while back.

Does anyone here know a guy from mybe the DC area who was doing vintage suits. Maybe hi name was Calvin. He was a very sophisticated african american guy. I didn't see his stuff, but he had a lot of esquire vintge catalogs stuff and was talking about making a lot of custom vintage styles. That was about ten years ago.

 

[Matt Deckard]

I think i know who you are talking about. though there have been a few stories floating around about a tailor who was making the vintage style suits and creating fresh styles up to par with what was around in the golden era. I don't quite remember his name though Marc Chevalier refreshed my memory when last I spoke with him... then I forgot again.

If you have more info please post it.

As with my post above detailing the vintage suits in the photos, the vintage suits still have an edge over the bespoke I have seen... primarily its that anchor measurement and the way the suits would create a shape for the wearer rather than just drape over the wearer. Yes tailors ad shape to those who have the very good figure, though heavier fabrics are needed to flatter the more corpulant form and I haven't seen a well done custom suit for a larger framed man in a long time. The larger the man the more the drapery is what i have seen. That's not how it used to be. Even when I was 60 pounds heavier i prefered to have something that geve me a bit of shape and the softer materials just added to the sausage wrap look if worn fitting. I'm having new trousers made from a 16 ounce Holland an Sherry fabric so I know the materials are still available... it's getting the tailors to use them and recomend them and then tailor them correctly that i want to see.

When recently watching a friend get his first bespoke suit made, the things I ended up pointing out to the tailor were fit details of the vintage jacket I had on at the time. Because the bespoke tailor did not take the measurements nececerry, If these details were forsaken as they could have been and as I fear are by other tailors (and i see it all the time)... well lets just say tailoring, even bespoke tailoring is subject to losing some of the finer points in fit.

Blech... baggy chest and the material flaps like tissue on both men. The three button here is just ill designed... modern styling.

All three buttons done and not a wrinkle to show... he looks smashing to me and hopefully not affected to you... It's the fit.

 

[Senator Jack]

Hate to be a jerk, but if one is a modern-bespoke-super-150-kind-of-cut-right-but-not-really style aficianado, there are a lot of other suit forums that may be more appropriate for posting. I found, and joined, the lounge because I read posts that made me say, 'Finally. a couple of guys who know what they're talking about.' (Matt D, Baron K, Marc C, to name a few). I'd hate to see the lounge become another repository for sartorial old wives' tales. It's because it isn't that people come here.

Regards,

Senator Jack