Hat prices hurting hat comeback?

[T Jones]

That is the point I have been trying to make guys. Even for hat lovers like us the prices are becoming more and more difficult to stomach...at least for me. I find myself going from thrift shop to thrift shop just in the hopes of finding hats that fit me because turning to ebay has been a fruitless endeavor.

Couldn't agree more here. I know that if ebay sellers like Timothy's Closet and the outdoorteam can actually get $400 and $500 for some of their less than excellent condition hats, I should be able to get double their asking prices out of the ones I have! I also love how some of those ebay sellers will take a dirty, nasty, moth-eaten and torn up Open Road then try to sell it as a "Johnny Depp" hat for $250!

 

[hatophile]

There are still some bargains to be had on Ebay, if you're not looking for the highly sought Whippets and STrats, especially in the smaller sizes. ORs tend to be all over the map, but I've gotten some NOS condtion
Open Roads for $100 or less.
I agree TJones, the Outdoor Team and Timothy's prices are pretty steep, esp compared to a custom hat. If you notice though, they don't sell that fast.
I'm on a buying hiatus right now, just because I've pretty much filled my allowed "hat closet", and I haven't seen anything latedly that strikes my fancy. I am planning on getting a "cash for clunker" from Art though.

 

[Lotsahats]

We're a bunch of people that cling to a hopelessly outdated fashion statement

Quite right, Ole. And even when trends come back, briefly, into fashion, they come back modified and only last a short time. I don't think that there is a hat comeback.

Let's also not forget that if hats were to make a comeback, prices like the ones asked for by Timothy and theoutdoorteam would become routine.

A

 

[T Jones]

There are still some bargains to be had on Ebay, if you're not looking for the highly sought Whippets and STrats, especially in the smaller sizes. ORs tend to be all over the map, but I've gotten some NOS condtion
Open Roads for $100 or less.
I agree TJones, the Outdoor Team and Timothy's prices are pretty steep, esp compared to a custom hat. If you notice though, they don't sell that fast.
I'm on a buying hiatus right now, just because I've pretty much filled my allowed "hat closet", and I haven't seen anything latedly that strikes my fancy. I am planning on getting a "cash for clunker" from Art though.

Yeah, I think a custom hat's the way to go. ORs are all I have so I'm a little sick of them now. Unfortunately, Whippets, Strats, and Playboys are what I'm looking for now but I can't afford the ridiculous asking prices for them. When I do see one on ebay someone who must have pockets full of money to spend drives the bidding prices way high. We need to BOYCOTT these hats until the prices come down! I've picked up a couple nice Western hats at reasonable prices. One's a 4X Resistol and the other's a 7X Bradford. If someone doesn't mind the heavier felt of a Western you could send it off to a hatter and have your own version of a Whippet, Strat or Playboy made. It's a lot cheaper to have it done that way, (even cheaper than a custom made one), and the felt is superior quality. I have my Resistol getting worked on now.

 

[CaramelSmoothie]

I think there may be something to this, Matt. I don't in ANY way want to offend anyone here, so PLEASE don't take what I'm about to say as anything other than an observation.
White people don't wear hats. I live in a city with a majority African American (or whatever term is correct) population. They wear hats. A lot of 'em. There's a church a few blocks from where I live and it's rare to see a man WITHOUT a hat on Sunday morning. There are several stores that sell fashions geared to the fashionable black man (think Stacy Adams) where decent looking hats can be had very reasonably. One store in particular, that I have purchased several from, carries the full lines from Dobbs and Stetson, and even had Beaver Brand a while back. Dobbs has some moderately priced very nice wool hats, as well as Stacy Adams and Kangol for anyone wishing to "test the waters" so to speak.
The only times I even get a second look wearing a hat are when I'm out in the suburbs where all the white people live. There's no places out there to even buy a hat, except maybe walmart or target. Go in the malls and you won't likely find one, expensive or otherwise, so maybe it's less a price issue as an availability one.
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I've been saying this myself. The only time I see men in hats is around in my neighborhood and other Black neighborhoods throughout the country. No one gives them a second look because it's so commonplace. For instance, when I was in Milwaukee a few years ago, I attending an Black American function and I would say that 90% of the men had on hats. And these were working class men. I am actually surprised that no one has whispered in Michelle Obama's ear that she, as well as Sasha and Malia, should be "hatted up" for her Sunday church outings. I've never seen President Obama in a hat but then again he was not raised in the Black American community so that explains that.

As a matter of fact, I am so not used to seeing White men in hats that when I do see one in a hat that is not a cowboy hat, it seems like a costume or I think he has been influenced by "Mad Men", lol. Which is so ironic that I think that considering the hats that we wear today originated in European culture.

When I first joined this forum, I was shocked that finger waves, pin curls and wet sets were considered "vintage" over in the boards for women here. Heck, go to any of the numerous Black American salons and just about every single woman is in there under the dryer getting a wet set and she then goes home and pin curls her hair at night to keep the set. Go down south and every other Black woman has finger waves. In Black culture, I guess the preference is for shorter hair, and when you want to change it up for a longer length you can weave it up with hair from China and India! LOL. I had grown my hair down to my back but after a while I missed my cute wet sets that gave me curls and waves so I quickly cut it. Plus hats look better with shorter hair. This is why the women over in the beauty boards have to resort to the "ethnic aisle" in beauty stores just to get setting lotion because White salons rarely do wet sets. Yet that is all that's done in Black salons.

 

[CaramelSmoothie]

Continuing what I wrote about the hair. On this night that I was out with my family, a White woman walked up to me and complimented me on my "vintage hairstyle". I was like "whaaat?", lol, this is how I have been curling my hair since I was a teen!

 

[CaramelSmoothie]

Yeah, I think a custom hat's the way to go. O.

For custom's women's hats, milliners are charging an arm and a leg....and a torso! On Etsy, they are charging between $300-$500 for a "vintage inspired" hat. I can get a one of a kind true vintage hat that no one on this Earth will ever have for HALF that amount. Ha!

 

[T Jones]

I'm obviously from a whole different neighborhood. I live in a mostly White suburb, (for the last 13 years now), where hat wearing by White males are quite common place. Not too many Westerns though, but flat caps, newsboys, and yes, even a few fedoras are worn here...oh yes, and the ball caps. I guess it depends on one's neck of the woods.

 

[Historyteach24]

I never hardly see proper hats. I went to get my car inspected today and the guys running the station in their mid-50's looked at me like I had two heads. I would figure guys that age would welcome that.

 

[dh66]

Caramel Smoothie I thank you for validating my point. Great observation as well about the "ethnic" aisle of hair care products. Many years ago when hair grew on the top of my head I always went there for my pomade purchases. My wife is a hairdresser and she will back you up that a lot of hard to find vintage hair care products can easily be found at stores that cater mainly to Black clients. (way better prices too, I was always floored by online shops that cater to the "rockabilly" crowd that charged $6+ for a can of Murrays or Dixie Peach)
btw - I didn't see this last time, but the first time Obama was inaugurated both he and Joe Biden wore hats. And as for being hatted up for church, that is an art form down here!

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[dh66]

Oh...and nice curls

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[T Jones]

Just acquired a vintage '70's / 80's (?) 4X Open Road. Very disappointed with this one. What I noticed is that the workmanship and what seems to be a cowhide sweat are very subpar to the earlier Open Roads. The logo on the liner is not covered by plastic, the ribbon work is crooked and pulled too tight in some areas, and the stitching where the sweat was sewn in is visible under the hat ribbon. Aside from that, the crown looks to have a noticeable front to back taper and the dumb thing fits too tight. As everyone may recall, I hated my Black Akubra Squatter. This OR is definitely a contender for first place for my most hated hats! I may sell this one real cheap!

Oops, just noticed. Wrong thread for this one!

 

[The Fedorable]

I think there may be something to this, Matt. I don't in ANY way want to offend anyone here, so PLEASE don't take what I'm about to say as anything other than an observation.
White people don't wear hats. I live in a city with a majority African American (or whatever term is correct) population. They wear hats. A lot of 'em. There's a church a few blocks from where I live and it's rare to see a man WITHOUT a hat on Sunday morning. There are several stores that sell fashions geared to the fashionable black man (think Stacy Adams) where decent looking hats can be had very reasonably. One store in particular, that I have purchased several from, carries the full lines from Dobbs and Stetson, and even had Beaver Brand a while back. Dobbs has some moderately priced very nice wool hats, as well as Stacy Adams and Kangol for anyone wishing to "test the waters" so to speak.
The only times I even get a second look wearing a hat are when I'm out in the suburbs where all the white people live. There's no places out there to even buy a hat, except maybe walmart or target. Go in the malls and you won't likely find one, expensive or otherwise, so maybe it's less a price issue as an availability one.

On a related rant, years back there WAS a store in the mall called Hats in the Belfry. They actually had some decent lids for sale among all the novelty and costume hats. Unfortunately, I'm not sure that this didn't hurt more than help hat wearing because people made the association of a fedora with a costume. I mean, no one would ever go out and about in a rasta tam with fake dreadlocks or a giant stuffed mug of beer or a wizard hat, and fedoras come from the same place......

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I saw a bunch of caucasian guys wearing black fedoras in LA a couple months ago. Anyone from child to grown up; It was a bright Saturday afternoon, and there were guys wearing black fedoras as far as the street was. Though they were Jewish, so that could have be a factor to it. I was wondering why I saw a bunch of people wearing fedoras. Not the trilbys. These were roughly.. 4, maybe 4 1/2 in center dent crowns with maybe a 2 1/2 in wide brim.

 

[Lotsahats]

Probably more like 3-3 1/2" brims. When it's hot and I'm earring my black hat, I need all the shade I can find.

 

[CaramelSmoothie]

Caramel Smoothie I thank you for validating my point. Great observation as well about the "ethnic" aisle of hair care products. Many years ago when hair grew on the top of my head I always went there for my pomade purchases. My wife is a hairdresser and she will back you up that a lot of hard to find vintage hair care products can easily be found at stores that cater mainly to Black clients. (way better prices too, I was always floored by online shops that cater to the "rockabilly" crowd that charged $6+ for a can of Murrays or Dixie Peach)
btw - I didn't see this last time, but the first time Obama was inaugurated both he and Joe Biden wore hats. And as for being hatted up for church, that is an art form down here!

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Since we are on the subject of hats and hair. Not sure if many people know this, but back in the day, Black women were not allowed to try on hats in major department stores. IIRC, this was due to not only just run of the mill discrimination but it was thought that the pomades that they wore would ruin the hat. But then again, White men wore pomades back in those days so I am not sure how much that played a factor in that decision.

I do remember Obama in the hat, but that was the only time. And I have never seen Michelle Obama in a hat, this is surprising the more I think about it. I guess she just doesn't like hats!

 

[CaramelSmoothie]

Oh...and nice curls

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Thank you. I spend a lot of time under the dryer getting those curls!

I saw a bunch of caucasian guys wearing black fedoras in LA a couple months ago. Anyone from child to grown up; It was a bright Saturday afternoon, and there were guys wearing black fedoras as far as the street was. Though they were Jewish, so that could have be a factor to it. I was wondering why I saw a bunch of people wearing fedoras. Not the trilbys. These were roughly.. 4, maybe 4 1/2 in center dent crowns with maybe a 2 1/2 in wide brim.

Maybe it was a special event they were attending? The last time I saw a White guy in a hat was as I was walking down the street and he was sitting on a restaurant patio having lunch. Not only did he have on a hat, but he had on a pin striped suit, complete with a vest and suspenders. My first thought was that he was in costume for a party, but then again, it could have been his own personal style. I am wondering how much shows like Boardwalk Empire and Mad Men are influencing men in this area. I don't watch either show so not sure how much of a following each show has but it seems like a lot of people online want to mimic the fashions.

 

[mayserwegener]

Most of the Black men in my area (Laurel, MD) that wear city dress hats on a regular basis are over 50. I can't recall any recently 30 and under. I am a 52 year old White guy and wear a hat everyday but I keep a low profile (work casual dress) so don't get much notice.

 

[CaramelSmoothie]

Interesting comments on the african american hat wearer and hats in general:



source: http://www.thestar.com/life/fashion...ore_hat_co_puts_a_fashionable_lid_on_men.html

Originally written in 2009. I ran across it while looking for info on Biltmore Hats....

Thank you for this article Great White! As many of you know I am starting a hat site, although it will only showcase my hats, it is good to hear it straight from the horses' mouth (in this case, the hat manufacturer), that Black American men really do wear a lot of hats. I can definitely use this article when planning the layout of my site!

Again, thanks! Bookmarking this article now.

 

[mayserwegener]

The orthodox Jewish communities are also a big factor. Companies like Borsalino and TONAK would be in trouble without that market. When I visited TONAK a few years ago they made a point about that.

Also there is a difference regarding wearing a hat everyday and only on special occasions. Like I said I rarely see younger Black men wearing city dress style hats on a regular basis.

 

[The Fedorable]

Maybe it was a special event they were attending? The last time I saw a White guy in a hat was as I was walking down the street and he was sitting on a restaurant patio having lunch. Not only did he have on a hat, but he had on a pin striped suit, complete with a vest and suspenders. My first thought was that he was in costume for a party, but then again, it could have been his own personal style. I am wondering how much shows like Boardwalk Empire and Mad Men are influencing men in this area. I don't watch either show so not sure how much of a following each show has but it seems like a lot of people online want to mimic the fashions.

That possibility hadn't crossed my mind. I see the occasional hat around town on white folk. Seems to be a panama type of hat, ball cap or flat cap every time. Your observation is quite plausible and odd to think about. Thinking about it now, it's just odd. Good eye, brother.

I've yet to watch Boardwalk Empire, but I can agree that Mad Men has it's own role in influencing me in my attire. Just the look of it all is so simple. I don't know where people are getting the influences for hats, but it was the old noir movies and LA Noire that had me interested.