Hat making?? Learning Millinery..

[belfastboy]

I know there has been talk here in the past on using a pressure cooker to help with dye penetration. My own attempts at dyeing felt didn’t work out so well.

Yes, I think that might work. I could probably pick one up cheap at the Goodwill......although I may have exorcized my desire to dye the felt at this point.

 

[ChicagoWayVito]

Finally took the time to give my ASM 1107-1 some TLC, got her all oiled up, and then spent 90 minutes working on dialing in the thread tension. Very particular machine it is and doesn't not like any adjustments made to thread tension. Anyway, I did install sweatband with it tonight. Very pleased with the outcome! Hopefully, I can get the time to make more progress. I Will post pictures when finally completed.

 

[belfastboy]

I cannot recall the exact thread so I am putting in here. A while back there was a discussion on the merits of hand sewing leather sweats into hats rather than machine sewing. It was suggested that machine sewing could compromise the felt and even damage it to the point of tearing. The consensus was machine sewing did not present a real risk for that. Well I was refurbing a Flechet that Deadly had gifted me. The sweat was deformed and it needed about everything. I tore it down and when I removed the ribbon I discovered a 3-4" rip in the felt where the sweat had been stitched. The issue was that whomever did the sewing had the stitches so tightly bunched it actually ate the felt away. My wife zig zagged the felt back together and the ribbon will hide it again. First time I have ever seen this happen so at least it proves that machine sewing a sweat can if done poorly, wreck the felt. The other interesting discovery is that the bow work uses metal staples to hold it and the bow keeper together. Never seen that tacky method before!

 

[humanshoes]

Oh boy! That made me cringe just to look at it. Proof that machines are not always better than human hands. I suppose it just depends on the machine and whose hands it's in. I'll admit that I could write a small book on how to mess things up with a sewing machine. I have indeed "cut" some materials due to the stitch length being too closely spaced. I spent hours with my ASM 1107-1 dialing in the feed dog height, presser foot pressure, thread tension, stitch length, etc. and, if everything is not working together in perfect harmony, the machine can certainly damage the felt. Still, when the 107 or 1107 machines are set up correctly, and are creating stitch lengths of only about 2.5 to 3 per inch at a tension that is neither too tight nor too loose, I don't think the stitching will ever weaken the felt to point of becoming problematic.

 

[belfastboy]

Oh boy! That made me cringe just to look at it. Proof that machines are not always better than human hands. I suppose it just depends on the machine and whose hands it's in. I'll admit that I could write a small book on how to mess things up with a sewing machine. I have indeed "cut" some materials due to the stitch length being too closely spaced. I spent hours with my ASM 1107-1 dialing in the feed dog height, presser foot pressure, thread tension, stitch length, etc. and, if everything is not working together in perfect harmony, the machine can certainly damage the felt. Still, when the 107 or 1107 machines are set up correctly, and are creating stitch lengths of only about 2.5 to 3 per inch at a tension that is neither too tight nor too loose, I don't think the stitching will ever weaken the felt to point of becoming problematic.
View attachment 284032

I am thinking that this Flechet must have been sewn by a rookie...first day on the job.....as the stitch length was ridiculously close...non existent. The luck of the draw when one buys a manufactured product. Our first motor home, according the repair man that replaced the rotted floor of the MH (after just 3 years), the man that welded the frame must have been a rookie as the welds were overcooked which created large voids which created pathways for water ingress from the undercarriage. Leaks we did not see at all until one day the floor was spongy and rotted. Our repairman said the quality of the welds was so poor as to be criminal.

 

[belfastboy]

Oh boy! That made me cringe just to look at it. Proof that machines are not always better than human hands. I suppose it just depends on the machine and whose hands it's in. I'll admit that I could write a small book on how to mess things up with a sewing machine. I have indeed "cut" some materials due to the stitch length being too closely spaced. I spent hours with my ASM 1107-1 dialing in the feed dog height, presser foot pressure, thread tension, stitch length, etc. and, if everything is not working together in perfect harmony, the machine can certainly damage the felt. Still, when the 107 or 1107 machines are set up correctly, and are creating stitch lengths of only about 2.5 to 3 per inch at a tension that is neither too tight nor too loose, I don't think the stitching will ever weaken the felt to point of becoming problematic.
View attachment 284032

If you were to hand sew a sweat would you use about the same stitch spacing....1/4" or so?

 

[ChicagoWayVito]

If you were to hand sew a sweat would you use about the same stitch spacing....1/4" or so?

When I hand sew a sweat I do use about a 1/4" spacing but only on the outside of the crown. When I've come back inside the crown i do a little back stitch, so the stitches are varied in length depending if i am on the inside or outside. Longer stitches on the outside and short backstitch on the inside to hide the stitch and lock it in.

On the other thread about machine sewing, i mentioned that stitch length was important because if they are so small then the operator essentially just cuts the felt. My ASM is very temperamental and really only works with one thread tension and I spent 90 minutes the other day dialing in the tension. I keep a couple of second hat bodies around to test on before I ever put a quality hat body through it. Partly because I use it infrequently and partly to ensure the kids haven't made an adjustment for me.

 

[belfastboy]

When I hand sew a sweat I do use about a 1/4" spacing but only on the outside of the crown. When I've come back inside the crown i do a little back stitch, so the stitches are varied in length depending if i am on the inside or outside. Longer stitches on the outside and short backstitch on the inside to hide the stitch and lock it in.

On the other thread about machine sewing, i mentioned that stitch length was important because if they are so small then the operator essentially just cuts the felt. My ASM is very temperamental and really only works with one thread tension and I spent 90 minutes the other day dialing in the tension. I keep a couple of second hat bodies around to test on before I ever put a quality hat body through it. Partly because I use it infrequently and partly to ensure the kids haven't made an adjustment for me.

I do a back stitch about every 4 or 5 stitches. Do you baste the sweat in first or go straight to the final sew?

 

[belfastboy]

I bought myself a light box on Amazon and now playing with it. It looks like it will work well for hat pics. So here finally are the pics of that notorious mottled colouration on the Winchester felt. This is after the redye job and you can see how the dye did not penetrate in the centre of the brim. Not sure what to do yet....maybe bite the bullet and do a brim binding. So, not by design, this is my newest 'distressed' look hat.....it reflects the distress I feel at ruining such a nice Blue Smoke beaver felt!!!

 

[ChicagoWayVito]

I do a back stitch about every 4 or 5 stitches. Do you baste the sweat in first or go straight to the final sew?

If I am doing hand sewing then I go straight to the final sew. If machine sewing then I baste in by hand first. I haven't got the technique down just yet to go straight to the machine with hat and sweatband not attached. The first few stitches are a trick because the hat and sweatband don't move together so you have to keep them aligned until they lock in. Also since the sweat band is turned out so on the red tape is inside it is a skill to see where the folded part of the Reed tape should be so that when the leather is folded back in that the sweatband is sitting in the correct location.

 

[belfastboy]

If I am doing hand sewing then I go straight to the final sew. If machine sewing then I baste in by hand first. I haven't got the technique down just yet to go straight to the machine with hat and sweatband not attached. The first few stitches are a trick because the hat and sweatband don't move together so you have to keep them aligned until they lock in. Also since the sweat band is turned out so on the red tape is inside it is a skill to see where the folded part of the Reed tape should be so that when the leather is folded back in that the sweatband is sitting in the correct location.

I have been doing the baste stitch first but on my next one I will try just tack stitching the sweat in 3 or 4 locations to see how that works....may save me 30 minutes! Don't think I will ever get to the point of wanting to buy the machine and learn the mastery of that......hand sewing will keep me busy and out of trouble....to a degree.

 

[ChicagoWayVito]

I bought myself a light box on Amazon and now playing with it. It looks like it will work well for hat pics. So here finally are the pics of that notorious mottled colouration on the Winchester felt. This is after the redye job and you can see how the dye did not penetrate in the centre of the brim. Not sure what to do yet....maybe bite the bullet and do a brim binding. So, not by design, this is my newest 'distressed' look hat.....it reflects the distress I feel at ruining such a nice Blue Smoke beaver felt!!! View attachment 284070 View attachment 284071

I would try the Gunner Foxx Maker's Mark treatment on this, just for fun. I too mostly like to stay with making classy hats that are respectful of the craft but there is time to have some fun with them too. I have yet to try this out but this is what I am referring to.

WARNING: Graphic image that some might find disturbing.

I have done a bunch of research on what might work for this and I came across some information about what some home/craft brewers have done, so this will also work for those that want to dip their own bottles. It comes down to it, that it is a mix ratio of 3:1 of hot glue sticks to crayons. You want the mini-hot glue sticks and it is 3 of them to one crayon (don't forget to remove the paper) . On Amazon you can buy a single crayon color in bulk. Also, make sure that the hot glue sticks are the crystal clear ones and not the cloudy kind.

I would probably pick up a used crockpot and see if with will melt the glue and crayon and if so then I would do a large batch and dunk the hat crown down into the crock just like they do with bottle sealing.

 

[belfastboy]

I would try the Gunner Foxx Maker's Mark treatment on this, just for fun. I too mostly like to stay with making classy hats that are respectful of the craft but there is time to have some fun with them too. I have yet to try this out but this is what I am referring to.

WARNING: Graphic image that some might find disturbing.



View attachment 284086

I have done a bunch of research on what might work for this and I came across some information about what some home/craft brewers have done, so this will also work for those that want to dip their own bottles. It comes down to it, that it is a mix ratio of 3:1 of hot glue sticks to crayons. You want the mini-hot glue sticks and it is 3 of them to one crayon (don't forget to remove the paper) . On Amazon you can buy a single crayon color in bulk. Also, make sure that the hot glue sticks are the crystal clear ones and not the cloudy kind.

I would probably pick up a used crockpot and see if with will melt the glue and crayon and if so then I would do a large batch and dunk the hat crown down into the crock just like they do with bottle sealing.

Okay, this is truly a bridge too far!

 

[jlee562]

I bought myself a light box on Amazon and now playing with it. It looks like it will work well for hat pics. So here finally are the pics of that notorious mottled colouration on the Winchester felt. This is after the redye job and you can see how the dye did not penetrate in the centre of the brim. Not sure what to do yet....maybe bite the bullet and do a brim binding. So, not by design, this is my newest 'distressed' look hat.....it reflects the distress I feel at ruining such a nice Blue Smoke beaver felt!!! View attachment 284070 View attachment 284071

Ahh yes, the exclusive Wolfbrae "Marble" finish! It's an upcharge!

 

[belfastboy]

Ahh yes, the exclusive Wolfbrae "Marble" finish! It's an upcharge!

I can't risk creating a demand for this because I have no idea how to replicate the look!

 

[deadlyhandsome]

I can't risk creating a demand for this because I have no idea how to replicate the look!

Did Michelangelo recreate the David? Every masterpiece is unique!

 

[Frunobulax]

I have been doing the baste stitch first but on my next one I will try just tack stitching the sweat in 3 or 4 locations to see how that works....may save me 30 minutes! Don't think I will ever get to the point of wanting to buy the machine and learn the mastery of that......hand sewing will keep me busy and out of trouble....to a degree.

In stead of basting, I normally use 4-5 pins to keep the sweat in place and remove them as I move along.

 

[belfastboy]

In stead of basting, I normally use 4-5 pins to keep the sweat in place and remove them as I move along.

Do you run the pin through the same tab as your stitching?

 

[Frunobulax]

Not sure what you mean by tab. I try to run the pins and my stitching just above the reed, using the reed stitching to hide the sweat stitches.

Does that make sense?

 

[humanshoes]

If you were to hand sew a sweat would you use about the same stitch spacing....1/4" or so?

Yep, I use about the same spacing when hand sewing. I recently purchased sweatbands that are twice as thick as what I normally use and the machine, as set up, will not sew them properly so I've been forced to hand sew them. I've definitely been spoiled.