Harking for a simpler time.....

[V.C. Brunswick]

To put it simply, no matter where we are we're always wishing we were somewhere else -- even when we're someplace we want to be.

 

[Flicka]

What always amazes me more than anything is that we are on a site that is about the Golden Era, but there's always this fight against those of us that would be happier back then. Aside from this computer, my life is exactly as it would be in that time period. I don't really need anything that was invented in the last 40 or so years and for the most part I don't use it [huh]

I agree - though I do use modern communication devices a lot, it's not as if I couldn't be happy without them. I prefer many, many things about the golden era to today.

What I don't agree on though is a) that 'simplicity' in the sense of freedom from choice is a good thing and b) that such a 'simplicity' existed in the Golden Era.

On the contrary, in the time between the wars the world wrestled with enormous questions - can Capitalism survive? Is Democracy desirable? How do we cope in a world that is filled with possibilites; a suddenly urban society where women wear short skirts and demand equal rights to pay and vote, where people are suddenly only a telephone call and a train ride away, where information in the shape of papers, pamphlets, books etc. are suddenly swelling to hitherto unknown proportions? 'Breathing', Beatrice Webb wrote in 1932, 'from infancy an up, an atmosphere of morbid sexuality and alcoholism, furtive larceny and unashamed mendacity [...] - the average man is, mentally as well as physically, poisoned.'

That's how the world looked to them. It wasn't simple; it was a time of upheaval of the social and political order where men struggled to understand what was going on. The transitions we have experienced since are in no way greater than those experienced between 1870 and 1939. Looking back, it looks simpler because distance tends to blur out the things that didn't happen and so it seems like the choices that were made weren't actually choices but just the natural flow of events.

The patterns that are obscure when we stand close to an object emerge when we back away, like a gouache painting. But honestly, if things had been so 'simple' back then, would the world have changed the way it has? No, that change is caused by the fact that the world in the Golden Era wasn't 'simple' and that suddenly all truths hitherto known to man were up for questioning.

Personally, I don't think uncertainty was ever greater than in the Golden Era - and that's part of why I love it. It was so full of possibilities and visions and promises of a grander future that never came. Instead, we're stuck with this world, which chafes on us, and we can't even explain why. We've driven the world to the bring of the Apocalypse through our desperate attempts to consume away the increasing hollowness inside.

The Western world is eating cake because we have no bread and we wonder why we're still hungry...

 

[LizzieMaine]

Personally, I don't think uncertainty was ever greater than in the Golden Era - and that's part of why I love it. It was so full of possibilities and visions and promises of a grander future that never came. Instead, we're stuck with this world, which chafes on us, and we can't even explain why. We've driven the world to the bring of the Apocalypse through our desperate attempts to consume away the increasing hollowness inside.

The Western world is eating cake because we have no bread and we wonder why we're still hungry...

I couldn't have said it better myself. We had so many chances, and we blew it -- we had a chance to achieve something far more than we did, and we tossed it away for a king-sized cigarette with an asbestos filter, a beaverboard house in the suburbs, an oversized, overpriced car, and a giant-screen television set. And this is the world we get stuck with as a direct consequence of those choices -- a society of drugged-out, over-medicated credit-card zombies convinced they can buy their way out of their nightmare.

Dystopia? We're soaking in it.

 

[Cricket]

I am guilty at times to sit and daydream about how "simple" the yesteryears may have been and find myself wishing to be there like so many others have said in this thread.

But looking over a few posts, I feel safe to say that I am pretty happy at my place now. My family and I live in a rural community in Mississippi where we still have those town hall meetings, community functions; men offer ladies chairs and stand up when they enter the room for the most part; the farm men sit at the local coffee shop every morning and discuss crops, the weather, etc.; I a member of a civic club that still honors the flag before every meeting; my family and I do attend church most every Sunday; my husband and I have our own garden that we live off during the summer and can the rest for the colder months; we fish in our family pond and will have a fish fry, inviting our friends; my husband hunts and he cleans and butchers the meat (in the backyard right in front of my breakfast area which kind of freaks me out); and I honestly love my small community and try to do my part through volunteering, my job at the newspaper, raising a happy family, etc.

But all these things that make me happy are also laced with a few challenges. For a town of our small number, we have a high number of crimes to fuel drug habits; the public school district here is a sad situation, just last week we had a "gang expert" come in and identify 10 gangs at our local high school; there is still racial tension in some situations; many children in our local elementary school have been expelled for drugs and weapons; as a reporter, I have already written about one murder and a few child abuse cases in the year; many local merchants are struggling to survive because many shoppers are commuting to the city 30 miles up the road to conduct business; there are middle school students who are pregnant; and many of those town hall meetings are filled with angry shouts and frustrations.

I am not sure what point I was trying to make so forgive me. But I am happy with a lot in my life in this time but there are those obstacles that cause me daydream and drift into space about "the good ole days." I can't help but thing that perhaps it was similar then too with aperson happy with their situations, confused about the uncertainities but yet filled with hope and wishing for a time machine.

 

[Feraud]

What always amazes me more than anything is that we are on a site that is about the Golden Era, but there's always this fight against those of us that would be happier back then.

Those clowns don't last long around here.

 

[scottyrocks]

Cricket, you and people like you, both in your community, others, and here on FL, may be the only saving grace and hope for this country.

Indeed, we are operating on a double (or maybe even triple) edged sword. Today's time saving devices are only as life-simplifying as we choose to make them. Others have pointed out how people have let these devices change their lives to the point that they have made life more complicated instead of simpler, i.e., cell phones and the like making people disposable to their companies and/or businesses, as well as clients, 24/7. The internet, although increasing business opportunities for both buyers and sellers, has made sellers' lives a 24/7-type situation, as well.

But then there are those of us, some of us here who have stated that although these modern conveniences exist doesn't necessarily mean that we have become slaves to them. Everyone in my families (ex- and current) has iphone4's. I refuse to get one. I still have an env3 sans a data plan of any sort. What I want from a phone is simply to be able to communicte without having to hunt down the theoretical pay phone. all I see around me is people staring down into a little screen furiously poking away with their thumbs. Irritates the heck out of me.

I wear certain clothes multiple times simply because I see nothing wrong with doing so. My parents had an experession about this: 'What are you going to do, wear that until stands up by itself?' No, just until I feel that it needs to be washed, not washing simply because I wore it once. I operate most of my life this way. I do things as I see fit, and don't do things simply because the herding masses do so.

 

[Feraud]

Has the ubiquitous electronic device really made life simpler or turned most people into simpletons..

 

[FountainPenGirl]

Said it well

I think it was put very well by Scottyrocks in the previous post. I also go along with what Rue and Tom posted earlier that I've copied below.:eusa_clap
Life was deffinitely not easier years ago and it certainly had it's challenges and troubles. I'm not sure how to put it into words but anyone who understands will know what I mean. There was something to the quality of life that is what people long for. It's an intangible thing that you can't put your finger on but you feel none the less. My family all worked hard on farms to eek out a living and never got rich, but they were all genuinely happy and satisfied with their lives in general. Not to say that they didn't have dreams too, but even if they didn't come true they had enough not to complain and be genuine happy and loving people. I don't know if this makes any sense but it's in this type of thing thats what people feel good about. It's not about the time as much as it's about what's in people that was much more common back then than today.
Well that's my abstract thought for the day.


rue
What always amazes me more than anything is that we are on a site that is about the Golden Era, but there's always this fight against those of us that would be happier back then. Aside from this computer, my life is exactly as it would be in that time period. I don't really need anything that was invented in the last 40 or so years and for the most part I don't use it

AtomicEraTom
Baffles me, too. I don't tell the modern-day-ers that what they're doing's wrong. I'm happier to discuss my issues with today with folks who understand; that's a big part of my membership here. I can be fairly certain that I would, in fact, be happier then, than now. I know what I am, I know what I like, and a society years back would be more tailored to a fella like myself.

 

[scottyrocks]

FPG, I know what you mean, about the intangables.

I grew up in the 60s. In some ways life was simpler and in some ways not. But one thing is certain. Living in the 60s, not knowing about stuff that exists now, but not then, is different than hindsight from 2012 to 1968, for example. Kids played, in a simpler way than now. Adults' jobs were simpler, in some instances, because a job now where you aurs a day was often 9 to 5 back then (doctors and the like not withstanding).

Speaking of doctors, and medicine in general, today's technology has truly made life simpler, as well as more likely that I will live longer. When I first contracted diabetes in late 1965, checking glucose levels at home was literally a test tube and eye dropper affair. X drops of urine, Y drops of water, drop in tablet, watch it fizz, and compare the final color to a chart. Then rinse it all out for the next time, which was multiple times a day.

That evolved into test strips that you would pass through the urine stream, wait for the color change, and compare to a color chart. And despite the intervening years, I was still testing from a urine base which is no where near as accurate as a blood test.

Years later, home blood test kits were available that operated much the same way as the urine test kits. At least we now the ability to test glucose where it mattered - in the blood stream.

All this time I had been sticking myself with needles multiple times per day. Then insulin pumps made their debut, maybe 20 years ago. I didn't get one until about five years ago (I still hate being dependent on machines). It makes injecting insulin a much simpler and more accurate operation, not to mention way less painleess.

Now, the blood glucose machines communicate with the pumps. More technology, more simplicity, better quality of life.

I know I am a specialized case, especially compared to the general more healthy populace, but in this regard, technology works for me, making my life simpler, and better.

 

[Hercule]

Rue
“What always amazes me more than anything is that we are on a site that is about the Golden Era, but there's always this fight against those of us that would be happier back then. Aside from this computer, my life is exactly as it would be in that time period. I don't really need anything that was invented in the last 40 or so years and for the most part I don't use it “

AtomicEraTom
“Baffles me, too. I don't tell the modern-day-ers that what they're doing's wrong. I'm happier to discuss my issues with today with folks who understand; that's a big part of my membership here. I can be fairly certain that I would, in fact, be happier then, than now. I know what I am, I know what I like, and a society years back would be more tailored to a fella like myself.”

Forgive me, but I think you both are deluding yourselves by the notion that you’d necessarily be happier living back then. You (we all for that matter) have no choice but to view previous eras through modern eyes. As a result there is no immediacy of context for us, no uncertainty from moment to moment or day to day, no opposing forces to influence our choices and effect our circumstances. The trouble is that we know how it all turned out, for better or for worse, and unless a psychologist can elaborate otherwise, I really don’t think you deny that - you just can’t un-know what you know. Sure we can dream about living in earlier times, and I’ve done it myself, but without the exigencies and realities that gave meaning to the original context, we have no actual investment in the reality of another time period. Thus we pick and choose what makes up our impression and understanding of that era and in the end it all remains a fantasy, wearing costumes and play acting, nostalgia for times we never new. However, I might suggest that one can certainly, though perhaps only at best, aspire to those qualities and aspects which make a certain era appealing - facilitated of course by various garb, accoutrements and period methods - a fun and entertaining exercise to be sure.

Maybe you would be happier living in a previous era, who is anyone to say otherwise, unfortunately that’s something you’ll never be able to know; that knowledge simply does not exist.

Just a thought.

Oh my, I just noticed this is my 100th post! I think I'll celebrate by watching Casablanca this evening (as if I really need an excuse).

 

[sheeplady]

I loved the farm life and miss a lot about it. I sure wouldn't wanna be farming anymore, though. It's much more fun to just go drive truck and tractors now and then and not have it be an essential to your income.

A hobby farm would be fun. A make your living off the farm would be my worse nightmare. I think the golden era of producing high quality products, with fair wages, and good treatment for workers and animals passed decades ago. Right now the only farms that are making it where my parents live have 800-2,000 cows and hire illegal labor. These farms are horribly abusive to their animals and workers. And they aren't pleasant to live around either.

I do think one area of life that was "better" back then was food production and manufacturing. I think both those areas have taken a dive. I don't think healthcare practitioners care nearly as much as they used to, even if treatments have improved.I do think that today there are incredibly unreasonable expectations for people regarding work, education, and home life that have resulted in way too much stress with too little benefit.

 

[LizzieMaine]

I think the fact that we talk nowadays about "the healthcare industry" speaks volumes about modern attitudes that I want nothing to do with. And I can think of nothing more utterly horrifying than the thought of that industry keeping me alive until I'm 100.

 

[Hercule]

... And I can think of nothing more utterly horrifying than the thought of that industry keeping me alive until I'm 100.

Lizzy I bet you'd make for one sassy hundred year old!

 

[LizzieMaine]

Has the ubiquitous electronic device really made life simpler or turned most people into simpletons..

Paddy Chayefsky, a man of the Era, said it best nearly forty years ago, thru the mouth of Howard Beale:

"What is finished, is the idea that this great country is dedicated to the freedom and flourish of every individual in it; it's the individual that's finished. It's the single, solitary human being that's finished; it's every single one of you out there that's finished. Because this is no longer a nation of independent individuals, it's a nation of two-hundred some-odd million transistorized, deodorized, whiter-that-white steel-belted bodies, totally unnecessary as human beings, and as replaceable as piston rods....The whole world is becoming humanoid, creatures that look human but aren't. The whole world, not just us. We're just the most advanced country, so we're getting there first. The whole world's people are becoming mass-produced, programmed, wired, insensate things, useful only to produce and consume other mass-produced things, all of them as unnecessary and useless as we are."

If that was true in 1976 -- and you won't get any argument from me if you say it was -- gad, how much more so in 2012. Chayefsky was the Jeremiah of his generation.

 

[AtomicEraTom]

I'm no expert, as I'm a modern person who knows what he knows from the Lounge, Reading, and from what people who were there say. I think the latter example is the best report, as they're local folks and I'm saying that as 21 year old me, living in the same place, doing the same job, and in no other way changing my life, besides the era, I'd be much happier. My wages as a Union Factory worker would go much farther than they do and I would fit in better culturally. I wouldn't be the odd duck for wearing the clothes I wear, or listening to the music I listen to, or doing much of what I do in my life.

I'm not saying the era was perfect and I'm not saying that my life would be perfect. I just feel that I'd be a lot better off. I wouldn't be such an oddity, which gets incredibly old. I'd likely be married, possibly own a house.

My Grandfather married in 1951 and built a house in Suburban Milwaukee, with the help of his father. He worked as a Union Lather and my grandmother never worked a day in her life. They raised five kids, and even built a summer home in 1958. Almost every person in their neighborhood had summer cabins, new cars, and nice homes. They didn't have fancy jobs that made a fortune, their next door neighbor worked at Schlitz, another at Allis-Chalmers, my Dad's first job was at Briggs and Stratton, they said that was a 'lifetime job' back then.

All of that's changed. Briggs and Stratton doesn't hardly have any jobs in Milwaukee anymore. Schlitz and Allis-Chalmers are long gone, too. The only big Milwaukee manufacturers still doing big in Milwaukee that come to mind are Master Lock and Harley-Davidson.

Now, I'm much like my grandfather, and I find it very hard to believe that my life would have varied much from his, were I living in the same generation. He did nothing spectacular, he went to a public school, got a job, got married, had a family, built a home, and just did the same as every other Suburban Milwaukee resident. That'd be more than enough for me to be much happier than I am now. So, how can you possibly tell me I wouldn't be happier then rather than now?

Just a thought.

Forgive me, but I think you both are deluding yourselves by the notion that you’d necessarily be happier living back then. You (we all for that matter) have no choice but to view previous eras through modern eyes. As a result there is no immediacy of context for us, no uncertainty from moment to moment or day to day, no opposing forces to influence our choices and effect our circumstances. The trouble is that we know how it all turned out, for better or for worse, and unless a psychologist can elaborate otherwise, I really don’t think you deny that - you just can’t un-know what you know. Sure we can dream about living in earlier times, and I’ve done it myself, but without the exigencies and realities that gave meaning to the original context, we have no actual investment in the reality of another time period. Thus we pick and choose what makes up our impression and understanding of that era and in the end it all remains a fantasy, wearing costumes and play acting, nostalgia for times we never new. However, I might suggest that one can certainly, though perhaps only at best, aspire to those qualities and aspects which make a certain era appealing - facilitated of course by various garb, accoutrements and period methods - a fun and entertaining exercise to be sure.

Maybe you would be happier living in a previous era, who is anyone to say otherwise, unfortunately that’s something you’ll never be able to know; that knowledge simply does not exist.

Just a thought.

 

[sheeplady]

I think the fact that we talk nowadays about "the healthcare industry" speaks volumes about modern attitudes that I want nothing to do with. And I can think of nothing more utterly horrifying than the thought of that industry keeping me alive until I'm 100.

I refer to healthcare as the healthcare-industrial complex.

I know lots of good people who work in healthcare. But my experiences lately with it haven't been good.

 

[tbrunke]

I would have to say that my philosophy on it all is what I call "progressive conservatism" which preserves what is vital, rejects what is outworn, and accepts that portion of the new which is useful.

In context with this discussion, I think that society as a whole rebelled against the social graces of the past and have gone so far afield of them that today we see people who have no respect for others or even themselves. I live in a city, right in the downtown, and most of my neighbors look at me funny when I say hello to them. It is a sad state of affairs and I think it will only get worse. People were more gracious in the past and had more morals, or at least acted like they did. We now live in a society where it is presumed alright to do or be just about anything, a live and let live, carefree, whatever, type lifestyle. Very unfortunate if you ask me.

Now there are many things of the past in which I would not care to be a part of, as there are many things now I do not take part in. There is new now, that I would wish to keep (internet, some technology, etc.) and good from the past that I would like to see incorporated in todays society (manners, dress, pride in our country etc.).

To say all is bad now, and to also say all was better than is a misnomer. I would like the best of both worlds!

 

[tbrunke]

Well said Tom

I'm no expert, as I'm a modern person who knows what he knows from the Lounge, Reading, and from what people who were there say. I think the latter example is the best report, as they're local folks and I'm saying that as 21 year old me, living in the same place, doing the same job, and in no other way changing my life, besides the era, I'd be much happier. My wages as a Union Factory worker would go much farther than they do and I would fit in better culturally. I wouldn't be the odd duck for wearing the clothes I wear, or listening to the music I listen to, or doing much of what I do in my life.

I'm not saying the era was perfect and I'm not saying that my life would be perfect. I just feel that I'd be a lot better off. I wouldn't be such an oddity, which gets incredibly old. I'd likely be married, possibly own a house.

My Grandfather married in 1951 and built a house in Suburban Milwaukee, with the help of his father. He worked as a Union Lather and my grandmother never worked a day in her life. They raised five kids, and even built a summer home in 1958. Almost every person in their neighborhood had summer cabins, new cars, and nice homes. They didn't have fancy jobs that made a fortune, their next door neighbor worked at Schlitz, another at Allis-Chalmers, my Dad's first job was at Briggs and Stratton, they said that was a 'lifetime job' back then.

All of that's changed. Briggs and Stratton doesn't hardly have any jobs in Milwaukee anymore. Schlitz and Allis-Chalmers are long gone, too. The only big Milwaukee manufacturers still doing big in Milwaukee that come to mind are Master Lock and Harley-Davidson.

Now, I'm much like my grandfather, and I find it very hard to believe that my life would have varied much from his, were I living in the same generation. He did nothing spectacular, he went to a public school, got a job, got married, had a family, built a home, and just did the same as every other Suburban Milwaukee resident. That'd be more than enough for me to be much happier than I am now. So, how can you possibly tell me I wouldn't be happier then rather than now?

Just a thought.

 

[AtomicEraTom]

Thank you. I also forgot to mention that in 1951, my Grandpa who was married, and had a kid on the way a year later, and was building a house, was 21; the same age I am now. Puts your life in perspective.

Well said Tom

 

[sheeplady]

Thank you. I also forgot to mention that in 1951, my Grandpa who was married, and had a kid on the way a year later, and was building a house, was 21; the same age I am now. Puts your life in perspective.

I think one of the saddest things about our modern society is that the US is facing the first experience in a long time, where young people (mainly under 30) will have far fewer opportunities than their parents. I see it all the time with my students. It's not as bad as it was when it was back in 2008 (things back then were very bad- people were losing jobs left and right, students were dropping out, moving back home, etc.) but it is still bad. Most of my students are incredibly smart, ambitious, and hardworking people. Knowing that it won't open the doors for them it opened for their parents is absolutely heart-breaking to me.

I'm not talking about a glamorous big house out in the suburbs, I'm talking about someday being financially sufficient beyond living paycheck to paycheck. And I fear for many people in our society, particularly the young, that is their future.