Five Star Leather Jackets

[Aloysius]

@Aloysius I thought I was safe ordering a jacket based on an original pattern, I was wrong. This wasn't a unicorn based on photos. I've learned, It only works if you want an exact duplicate of the original in the same size. Any changes to critcal measurements means were relying on their ability to alter the original pattern and that's where it falls apart.

I think there are two additional things to take into account. Grading a pattern is less difficult than drafting a new one altogether, however I think you needed to have been checking in on the grading process a bit more.

And I think the CHL really throws an additional wrench in the works. It's already a gamble but once those super thick leathers enter into it, it's that much more likely to go wrong imo.

 

[GraceNote13]

Someone messed up while copying the pattern of the original. The neck area has no inward curve to it .

The collar is sometimes pre stitched and then get slits cut into it while sewing the neck curve (3 layers of leather ).However the old original jacket was probably stretched and heavily worn .

After unstitching the collar someone must have stretched the leather while transferring it to a piece of paper .

The added slits from the manufacturing process pulled apart and created a straight line .

You can see the inward curve missing on the five star listing .

The CHL emphasizes that problem.

requested collar pics below.

I didn't notice until I took these new pics the shoulders seams don't line up. The left shoulder's seam pulls more toward the front of the jacket than the right shoulder in the picture. In real life it's not as extreme as the below pic but it off by about 1/4".

 

[KBlake]

I think there are two additional things to take into account. Grading a pattern is less difficult than drafting a new one altogether, however I think you needed to have been checking in on the grading process a bit more.

And I think the CHL really throws an additional wrench in the works. It's already a gamble but once those super thick leathers enter into it, it's that much more likely to go wrong imo.

I think the experiment may have been more successful with a more compliant material.

 

[GraceNote13]

I think there are two additional things to take into account. Grading a pattern is less difficult than drafting a new one altogether, however I think you needed to have been checking in on the grading process a bit more.

And I think the CHL really throws an additional wrench in the works. It's already a gamble but once those super thick leathers enter into it, it's that much more likely to go wrong imo.

Totally agree, the thicker leather does add more variables and difficulty.

I wish I knew more about jacket making to be able to check in on their grading process. Fargham sent pattern pics unfortunately looking at flat paper I can't tell a good pattern from a bad one.

 

[ton312]

requested collar pics below.

I didn't notice until I took these new pics the shoulders seams don't line up. The left shoulder's seam pulls more toward the front of the jacket than the right shoulder in the picture. In real life it's not as extreme as the below pic but it off by about 1/4".

View attachment 586730 View attachment 586731

The real shame is that there’s obviously a lot of work put into it! I just don’t understand what is actually missing with 5 Star. Ultimately, I think it comes down not understanding human anatomy.

 

[El Marro]

If you're willing to search, are ok with wearing used jackets and are willing to buy and sell jackets to get the right fit, the secondhand market offers better value than 5*. I rescind all of my previous arguments to the contrary.

My man! It sounds like now you are ready to live your best life!

 

[GraceNote13]

I agree, it's sham

The real shame is that there’s obviously a lot of work put into it! I just don’t understand what is actually missing with 5 Star. Ultimately, I think it comes down not understanding human anatomy.

I agree it is a shame. Someone put a lot of work into making this jacket and unless your fitting it on a 3D body they probably thought it looked fantastic. The jacket probably represents 1 months salary in Pakistan for the sewer, feel bad if they take a hit.

My grandmother was a seamstress, I remember her having an adjustable body dress form mannequin in her home. She used it to fit garments when the person wasn't available for all the fittings. For the larger or more endowed ladies she would wrap portions of it in wadding to get the measurements to match. This would probable help if they setup a form to the measurements we give them and test fit as they went.

 

[Harris HTM]

stupid question but what does CHL stand for?

 

[Aloysius]

stupid question but what does CHL stand for?

"Cow Hide Leather". It was the natural endpoint of TFL's thick leather fetish.

It originates in someone, I think HH121, sending Five Star a piece of unusually thick Chromexcel, probably about belt leather thickness, and telling them to have their tannery make "CXL" based on that sample. Naturally, having no context for TFL shorthand, they assumed this was just some general term for cowhide, and they made a leather about as stiff as what he sent. I believe there was also a darker colored version that went with it, which they called "SXL", which was basically the same thing but even thicker.

It was utterly unusable though people here ordered several jackets in it and insisted that not only was it good but it was the best thing available because you get the most leather for your money. (Yes this was actually said.) That it would become a pliable, high quality hide by rubbing oil into it.

Eventually, the spell broke and this did not materialize. I expect all of them sold the jackets. (I actually don't hold this particular disaster against Five Star.)

Now they use it as a term for their thicker cowhides but I don't think the current "CHL" is quite the belt leather that the original was.

 

[Harris HTM]

"Cow Hide Leather". It was the natural endpoint of TFL's thick leather fetish.

It originates in someone, I think HH121, sending Five Star a piece of unusually thick Chromexcel, probably about belt leather thickness, and telling them to have their tannery make "CXL" based on that sample. Naturally, having no context for TFL shorthand, they assumed this was just some general term for cowhide, and they made a leather about as stiff as what he sent. I believe there was also a darker colored version that went with it, which they called "SXL", which was basically the same thing but even thicker.

It was utterly unusable though people here ordered several jackets in it and insisted that not only was it good but it was the best thing available because you get the most leather for your money. (Yes this was actually said.) That it would become a pliable, high quality hide by rubbing oil into it.

Eventually, the spell broke and this did not materialize. I expect all of them sold the jackets. (I actually don't hold this particular disaster against Five Star.)

Now they use it as a term for their thicker cowhides but I don't think the current "CHL" is quite the belt leather that the original was.

Thanks! I remember HH121 (or Hammerklavier)'s obsession with an ultimate thick jacket and how pissed off he was with JL when they told him they would skive the leather at the seams.

 

[PilotJens]

That seam is flat and it looks "uncut" .
Maybe soak it in water and bend it /work it back and forth to bend a curve into it .
Wear it and grap the inner side of the sleeve and tug it down and forward .
Soak the whole shoulder area and work it.
I would not write it off. The CHL / Crazy Hide Leather is still new and stiff .

You can still shape it a bit .
The Cut is not optimized for that hide but try working it in .

 

[PilotJens]

If you pull your finger along the inside seam of the collar ( behind the lining where the collar and neck opening meet )
Do you feel a continuous edge or are there ridges/slits cut ?

 

[unhatted]

Ok while we’re on the subject of leathers (and hoping to skirt any debates—preemptively sharing that my best value jacket is a second hand schott 618 which I love )…

I’m looking at the Cal Leather style LAPD jacket as I know this is a repro of an original pattern and it’s hard to find an original in my size (particularly for the money).

I’m wondering whether or not I should go with the ‘historically correct’ horsehide as I can take $100 off the price by getting it in goathide, which, while not ‘accurate’, seems to be quite reliable from 5* (I have a goathide from them I’m very happy with). Wondering if anyone with experience of both five star leathers can advise? (There’s also steerhide priced halfway between). Also, anyone with a detachable mouton collar—worth the extra $40?

 

[El Marro]

Thanks! I remember HH121 (or Hammerklavier)'s obsession with an ultimate thick jacket and how pissed off he was with JL when they told him they would skive the leather at the seams.

That man was mad as a hatter, regardless of what username he operated under! He was 86’ed by Lost Worlds, Vanson, and JL. At the end of the day Five Star was his last chance.

 

[GraceNote13]

If you pull your finger along the inside seam of the collar ( behind the lining where the collar and neck opening meet )
Do you feel a continuous edge or are there ridges/slits cut ?

It feels like a continuous edge.

 

[Aloysius]

I’m looking at the Cal Leather style LAPD jacket as I know this is a repro of an original pattern and it’s hard to find an original in my size (particularly for the money).

I’m wondering whether or not I should go with the ‘historically correct’ horsehide as I can take $100 off the price by getting it in goathide, which, while not ‘accurate’, seems to be quite reliable from 5* (I have a goathide from them I’m very happy with). Wondering if anyone with experience of both five star leathers can advise? (There’s also steerhide priced halfway between). Also, anyone with a detachable mouton collar—worth the extra $40?

Goatskin isn't historically inaccurate; I've seen a number of goatskin CHPs. (I've thought about having one made myself at Johnson.)

That man was mad as a hatter, regardless of what username he operated under! He was 86’ed by Lost Worlds, Vanson, and JL. At the end of the day Five Star was his last chance.

Then he burned bridges with Aero, simultaneously demanding the thickest leather they had in the workshop (against their warning) then being angry at them for the totally predictable result (which still didn't look bad!)

 

[El Marro]

Then he burned bridges with Aero, simultaneously demanding the thickest leather they had in the workshop (against their warning) then being angry at them for the totally predictable result (which still didn't look bad!)

I thought Aero might have been on the list but I wasn’t sure.

 

[El Marro]

Goatskin isn't historically inaccurate; I've seen a number of goatskin CHPs. (I've thought about having one made myself at Johnson.)

Langlitz actually recommends their goatskin over cowhide for serious riders (as opposed to imaginary riders like myself). I got a chance to handle one of their goatskin Columbia’s when I was at their shop and it was quite substantial, not at all lightweight or flimsy.

 

[Aloysius]

I thought Aero might have been on the list but I wasn’t sure.

Aero was the very last one. He made a thread flaming them for the worst jacket he ever had, and it was clear even from his own pictures that he was manipulating the images lol.

 

[mysternee]

It's been a busy week, but here are a few photos of the jacket, most taken by my extremely patient partner (bless her heart). Front, back, open, mirror. One thing I'll say about these photos is that Google's software is making the jacket look less brown than it does in reality. It's a greyish brown, but quite clearly a brown to the naked eye, whereas these photos make it look black. I'm pretty sure it's just modern phone cameras; the mirror shot looks browner to my eye, and it's more like that in reality.

I've worn it in our typically rainy weather, and while it's yet to encounter a proper soaking, it has shrugged off the rain so far. It also has been pretty dismissive of twigs and branches. Very happy I went with the goat, I really feel like I can just wear and not care, which is what I wanted.

The fit is perfectly generous and comfy, and a little bit oversized without being stupidly floppy. I could probably have taken another half inch off the sleeves, but it's really fine and anyway might have looked weird when the shoulders are deliberately a bit spacious. Oversized shoulders and fitted sleeves would probably look a bit daft.

I'm still extremely satisfied with it, and it looks like I'm going to get that refund of the tip for the hole in the knit, which was the only problem. As long as it holds up, it's a bargain.