Button placement on cuffs

[Marc mndt]

Some vintage halfbelt jackets have these odd buttons on the cuffs. Odd because they don't seem to have any function. I wonder what they are for. Was this a way to cut costs? Giving it the appearance of a buttoned cuff, without actually having to sew the real thing? But then, why would they place the buttons above one another? Is this typical for a certain time period? Who can help me out?

I also see them on modern recreations like on this jacket from Thedi Leathers.

 

[navetsea]

that Thedi sure is strange, with that style (exposed zipper and such biker look) I expect metal grommet, or rivet

 

[Carlos840]

I guess it's the same as buttonned sleeves on suits, they started out functional, then someone one day decided he could save a few bucks by just having decorative buttons and not bother making them functional anymore.
Nowadays it's pretty much impossible to buy a suite with functional button cuffs...

 

[Seb Lucas]

Most clothing contains hints of things no longer useful but retained to suggest dignity or decorative flare - from the useless half-belt to the lapels on a blazer. Buttons are a more obvious sign of this. I do prefer it when they are useful.

 

[Marc mndt]

Sears calls it a 'half cuff with button trim'

 

[Marc mndt]

Most clothing contains hints of things no longer useful but retained to suggest dignity or decorative flare - from the useless half-belt to the lapels on a blazer. Buttons are a more obvious sign of this. I do prefer it when they are useful.

Has the halfbelt ever been functional?

 

[Marc mndt]

Adding them as decorative flare makes sense, more than saving costs I guess. When making these jackets for example, they certainly didn't cheap out on other parts of the jacket :

 

[Carlos840]

Has the halfbelt ever been functional?

The progression went: full belt>half belt back with removable front belt>half belt with side cinches>half belt no cinches.

Here is an example of the removable front belt:

http://www.aeroleatherclothing.com/product-detail.php?id=1471

 

[navetsea]

if there is similar button used elsewhere on the jacket like on that pocket flap, I think it is just keeping the theme together by adding decoration buttons on the cuff.

just my opinion though since our body is 3D and the more polygonals the better the jacket would follow the shape of the back, so I can see the purpose of a half belt panel on the hollow of the lower back after the upper back panels before it flares again toward the hip. but probably has greater effect on people with more athletic build, on normal joes with less dramatic shape along the torso probably it has no use, center seam or a pair of vertical seams would easily substitute it.

 

[Seb Lucas]

Has the halfbelt ever been functional?

They started in tweed jackets in the early 1900's, and while they probably evolved from full belts that had a little use, I'd say no.

 

[navetsea]

The upper panel bottom line can be a little curved downward, the belt is straight, the lower skirting panel upper line is slightly curved upward, then the back profile is more hugging around the back of the waistline

 

[Marc mndt]

They started in tweed jackets in the early 1900's, and while they probably evolved from full belts that had a little use, I'd say no.

I love the halfbelt with the open centre vent. This is one of my wool coats with open vent.

I'm thinking of having an open vent on my next leather halfbelt as well. Only thing that worries me is whether at some point it will remain opened all the time, like you see on all those vintage jackets. But that will probably take at least another 30 years so maybe I shouldn't worry.

 

[Doctor Damage]

Don't overthink this, guys. Many clothing items of all kinds and purposes have details which are purely decorative. Even stuff that seems functional really isn't, and probably never really was except perhaps on the very earliest version.

 

[tmitchell59]

I always roll out the roll up cuff. One of the most interesting feature of some vintage jackets. All these jackets are goatskin. Shows up on a few jackets from the late 30s.

Jackets from same time with different cuffs.

Sears Topline on the left-Sportclad on the right

 

[Marc mndt]

I always roll out the roll up cuff. One of the most interesting feature of some vintage jackets. All these jackets are goatskin. Shows up on a few jackets from the late 30s.

View attachment 249761
Jackets from same time with different cuffs.

View attachment 249762
Sears Topline on the left-Sportclad on the right

View attachment 249763

Was the roll up cuff a feature on kids jackets, allowing the sleeve length to 'grow' with them. Or were these also a feature on adults jackets?

 

[Marc mndt]

Now that we're talking details, how were these button holes made?

Was the reece buttonhole machine widely used? This particular one looks to be hand-sewn.

 

[tmitchell59]

Was the roll up cuff a feature on kids jackets, allowing the sleeve length to 'grow' with them. Or were these also a feature on adults jackets?

All the jackets I have with roll up sleeves are adult jackets size 42/44. I have seen the term, "adjustable" cuff, but don't recall exactly where. probably Sears catalog. Could be one maker did the roll up cuffs.

Now that we're talking details, how were these button holes made?
View attachment 249775


Was the reece buttonhole machine widely used? This particular one looks to be hand-sewn.

This I don't know, but can ask a friend who has a Reece machine.

 

[Marc mndt]

This I don't know, but can ask a friend who has a Reece machine.

I understand that these machines were very expensive. In fact so expensive that companies used to lease them instead of owning them.

Nowadays hand sewn button holes are still found on high end suits. This is an example from a Ralph Lauren suit, made in England. It takes a skilled laborer about 15 minutes to make one of these.

Some leather jacket makers also make their button holes by hand, like Whitefeather mfg :

 

[ton312]

My Herc has a button inside the cuff. I assumed it was a spare but you can actually fasten it that way too.

 

[tmitchell59]

My Herc has a button inside the cuff. I assumed it was a spare but you can actually fasten it that way too.
View attachment 249802 View attachment 249803

Yes indeed, a adjustable cuff. I thought they were spares, but they are for rolling up. Inside cuffs are finished and button is exactly placed for use.