Airport Security

[Twitch]

lol

As I read these examples I have to laugh and then be sad shaking my head. I wonder when or if we will ever profile the true probable enemy- younger middle eastern single males- at our security points. Or will political correctness and the perceived danger of insult or being labeled racist overwhelm the basics of law enforcement so we continue to strip search grandma and the kiddies.

 

[Tommy Fedora]

I was in Rome a few years ago and the soldiers walking around the airport with machine guns on their shoulders really make an impression. It confirms the serious nature of the search that we endure with skepticism.
The .50 cal machine gun on a tripod on an elevated platform looking down on us travellers made me a little nervous too.

 

[ITG]

Yes, in fact, I've had less problems at DFW. Las Vegas was the worst. They took about 5-10 minutes a person to screen each individually. They even made me take my hair clip out of my hair (instead of running a wand over it like most airports do). I was so ticked off by the time I got to the screening that having to remove my hair clip ticked me off all the more because now I would have to go into a bathroom to totally redo my hair but we didn't have time for me to go to a bathroom-so I had to just gather my hair in frenzy and clip with hamburgers and all (Our flight was canceled that morning and we were scrambling as it was to get to the airport to board another flight. We were grumpy and hadn't eaten).

 

[Vintage Betty]

Air Travel

My husband and I travel quite a bit, so we have had these problems too. He said the worst so far was London recently, and he has now refused to go back there for a connecting flight, even if it means taking additional flights to go around London.

I lost my Driver's License for indentity purposes and was on a required search list for what was supposed to be a year...but six months into the year, they stopped searching me completely?

The worst to date for me is the guy who groped me in an airport with the excuse he had to make sure I was secure...blah blah blah.

But all of these tales don't even compare to our very close friends who are Iranian (they are simply, known as our second set of parents). The sons are immediately profiled, which they understand, but they can't get over the complete hatred and indignities the airline personnel put them through even though they are American Citizens and have been here most of their lives. The stories they told over dinner one night would make your blood boil. They go out of their way to avoid air travel because of the problems it has caused, including them missing flights.

Vintage Betty

 

[John in Covina]

Government at its Best!

One question I have is: If these are examples of governmant doing its best for Airport Security are you really sure you'd want governmet to be in charge of your HEALTH CARE?

 

[goldwyn girl]

On my recent trip to Australia it was the first time in years I was'nt singled out for extra screening. I passed right through in Vegas on LA on my outbound flight, I did'nt have on liquids, I thought it best to pack everything in checked bags and on my return the check in agent said it's best not to put liquids in carry on at all. No lighters in Australia. Everyone was stopped for a bag search at the departure gate and I sailed right through in LA. The most pleasant experience I've had for a long long time. But who knows how it will be on future trips. I did search for items banned from carry on bags before I left just to check I could take a brush, which I could and I did notice Snowdomes were a no no. I've always hated flying but now it's down right barbaric.

 

[Vintage Betty]

John-

I've just volunteered about four years of my life regarding this issue you mentioned. But since politics are not allowed in this forum, I invite you to PM me offline.

Vintage Betty

 

[Twitch]

John I mentioned this in another thread. We look at the ineptness in airport secuirty. We shake our heads when FEMA and the National Guard dunced around after Katrina, The FBI and CIA have been thoroughly compromised from within and without. The IRS is a debacle at best. Social Security is in the toilet. The spun off Post Office makes anyone go postal who has to deal with them. And the list goes on.

Now, people tell me they'd like the same folks who brought us these disasters to control our health care? Are they freaking crazy?lol

 

[Baron Kurtz]

"Don't you know those snowglobes are dangerous? You could bash the side of someone's head in with one..."

Only possible explanation I can see for the neueStasi on that one...

Snowglobes have liquids in them. And we all know the stories they've made up about the dangers of liquid plots on airplanes.

They're just yanking your chain! Security alerts, my butt. It's all about control.

bk

 

[carter]

Originally posted by Twitch
John I mentioned this in another thread. We look at the ineptness in airport secuirty. We shake our heads when FEMA and the National Guard dunced around after Katrina, The FBI and CIA have been thoroughly compromised from within and without. The IRS is a debacle at best. Social Security is in the toilet. The spun off Post Office makes anyone go postal who has to deal with them. And the list goes on.

Now, people tell me they'd like the same folks who brought us these disasters to control our health care? Are they freaking crazy?

Maybe not CRAZY but certainly myopic. They're so worried about that loose thread that they can't see their pants unravelling. It's the national version of The Emperor's New Clothes.

Caftan anyone?

 

[Chanfan]

Bruce Schneier likes to refer to it as "Security Theater" - things that are done to make you feel safer, without actually being effective at making you safer.

He does point out that sometimes security theater is either beneficial or necessary, but also has written many articles about the pointlessness of it all ("it" being the current airport security in the USA).

Another line of thought he espouses, that I like, is that folks worry far too much about things on the news. If it's on the news, it's by definition newsworthy - that is; rare enough to be interesting, and therefore it's not really a threat to you (at lest 99.99% of the time). It's when things are common place enough that they are no longer newsworthy, that they are a real concern - say, auto crashes.

 

[Qwkslvr]

No fly zone

I haven't flown since 9/11. I'd rather walk than go through all that.

 

[Vintage Betty]

My husband and I flew the week after 9/11

It wasn't as bad going through security as people thought.

Chanfan - I love the phrase "security theater". I will be actively using this from now on.

Qwkslvr - very cool avatar. Who is the artist?

Vintage Betty

 

[scotrace]

If current airport security is theatre, a grand (and dull) performance orchestrated to make it look like something is being done when it isn't - then what is the solution? What sort of security measures would actually be effective?

 

[Twitch]

Chanfan you have it right on there. It's a reactive orchestration instead of a proactive one. They know guns and knives are bad so they ban and scan for anything with even a hint at a shape point including tweezers. No you feel safe right?

Next 1 guy has some sort of alleged explosive in his shoe. Not to worry. Everybody will now have their shoes off and be inspected. Ah that feel safe.

Ok since it is possible to make chemical explosives from liquid components and that was hinted at we'll ban all liquids. Whew! NOW I'm safe.

If some fruitcake is found to have detinator cord sewn into the elastic of his underpants we'll all simply have to shrug out of our shorts for pre-flight inspection. THEN we'll be safe.lol lol

As for what measure would work I go back to Archie Bunker who actually had the most realistic concept of all- "give every passenger a gun upon boarding. When the hijacker pulls his gun out he's outnumbered."

 

[Qwkslvr]

It wasn't as bad going through security as people thought.

Chanfan - I love the phrase "security theater". I will be actively using this from now on.

Qwkslvr - very cool avatar. Who is the artist?

Vintage Betty

Mines cool, yours is beautiful. The artist is one of my favorites; Michael Parkes.

 

[PA Dancer]

fftopic: You might be happy to hear that the MythBusters busted this myth - they could not get a cell phone to make a spark no matter what they tried

LOL I saw that episode and still don't believe it.
They showed that a magnet couldn't de-magnitize a credit card either, but no matter what I do...I have this one wallet with a magnet in it and it always killed my credit card. LOL

 

[funneman]

Airport Security or lack therof.

I could spend all day telling stories of my misadventures with the TSA, but here is one of my all-time favorites.

Going through the X-ray machine at Roanoke, Va. the agent discovered by video camera in my carry-on bag.

"What's this?" she said, displaying amazing powers of perception.
"Why, that's a video camera".
"Turn it on."
"I can't, the batteries dead."

With that, the agent insisted I go all the way back through the airport to the front desk and bring the ticket agent who issued my ticket back to the xray machine to vouch for me and my camera.

Keep in mind the ticket agent had no idea who I was, but his "OK" was good enough for the TSA agent.

I felt much safer for this experience.

 

[Edward]

I went through a period of about two years when I was pulled aside EVERY time I flew, without fail. I just figure they go thru periods of profiling - choose all the "terrorist" looking people and a bunch of short chicks and old men so they don't look racist

Of course. They're not (to my mind rightly) permitted to use racial profiling officially, so naturally they simply resort to this sort of tactic to facilitate it. If they stop "all the folks that look like Arabs", that's racial profiling. If they stop "all the folks that look like Arabs and that girl with the porcelain skin that's the polar opposite of Middle Eastern looking", it's a "random sample."

When all the post-911 security measures were first implemented, they simply took the forbidden item and tossed it with a grin (as if it were funny). I lost a very expensive manicure set that my wife had given me that way. Not that business travel was ever fun, but it sure has became grim at times.

Not to be overly melodramatic, but it does often seem like we're rapidly lurching towards a position where we're giving up all the liberties that constitute the "way of life" that these authoritarians are supposedly protecting from the "terrorists."

lol

As I read these examples I have to laugh and then be sad shaking my head. I wonder when or if we will ever profile the true probable enemy- younger middle eastern single males- at our security points. Or will political correctness and the perceived danger of insult or being labeled racist overwhelm the basics of law enforcement so we continue to strip search grandma and the kiddies.

You'll forgive me if I'm a little touchy on the subject of racil profiling - I'm old enough to have been followed round shops and searched extra careful like the instant anyone clocked the accent.... Course, that never helped anyone a jot, as the Ra went over to using clean 'sleepers' - third and fourth generation immigrants with no Irish accent, no obvious ties to the six counties, and so on. All the 'racial profiling' in the world was effectively useless from then on. Exactly the same thing will happen with the current "Middle Eastern" threat. Wasn't one of the 'shoe bomber' types a - for want of a better term - "white convert"? Search all "the Arab looking guys" as a standard MO, and all you'll do is risk waving through the real danger. Not to mention help stir up an already volatile situation where young Asian men are all too often treated with fear and suspicion. But further comment takes us the way of the political.

My husband and I travel quite a bit, so we have had these problems too. He said the worst so far was London recently, and he has now refused to go back there for a connecting flight, even if it means taking additional flights to go around London.

Full of jobsworths, yes.

But all of these tales don't even compare to our very close friends who are Iranian (they are simply, known as our second set of parents). The sons are immediately profiled, which they understand, but they can't get over the complete hatred and indignities the airline personnel put them through even though they are American Citizens and have been here most of their lives. The stories they told over dinner one night would make your blood boil. They go out of their way to avoid air travel because of the problems it has caused, including them missing flights.

That must be a nightmare for them.

Snowglobes have liquids in them. And we all know the stories they've made up about the dangers of liquid plots on airplanes.

They're just yanking your chain! Security alerts, my butt. It's all about control.

bk

It always is. I've watched so many controversial laws and reductions of civil liberties go through over the years, and every time they trot out the Holy Trinity of excuses: drug dealers, paedophiles and terrorists. Anyone in opposition is accused of being soft on (at best) one or all of the above. In reality, all too often the measures they want to bring in are abouyt social control and will do nothing whatever to solve what they claim. But hey, I'm verging on the political again.

As a practical issue, though, it seems to me that if liquids are a danger, then they should not be able to allow you more than a single 100ml bottle - surely the five separate 100ml bottles of different liquids are more of a danger than the one bottle of 140mls? Especially crazy is the fact that they won't lewt you carry a\ 140ml bottle of liquid A, but if you have two 100ml bottles of liquid A - that's 200mls, folks - that's okay cause they're in 100ml bottles. It's nuts!

As for what measure would work I go back to Archie Bunker who actually had the most realistic concept of all- "give every passenger a gun upon boarding. When the hijacker pulls his gun out he's outnumbered."

Just pray that not a single one of them, hijacker included, is actually stupid enough to fire a gun in a pressurised cabin....

 

[Diamondback]

As for what measure would work I go back to Archie Bunker who actually had the most realistic concept of all- "give every passenger a gun upon boarding. When the hijacker pulls his gun out he's outnumbered."

:arated:, sir! I'll guarantee this: put me and my (in design stage) pair of .45s in the cabin of one of those 3 planes on Sept. 11, and a lot more people would be alive today that aren't...