Adventurebilt hats confuse me

[Jedwbpm]

Adventurebilt hats confuse me. What is the diference between all these Adventurebilt hats? Who is Mark Kitter and what are his hats pro and con? Who is Steve Delk and what are his hats pro and con? and how does Pennman fit into all this? How are all these hatters and hat related and not related? Who the hek is Henry? It is very confusing to me to try to keep up with all these guys making the same Hat or are they? Isn't there only one place left that makes felt hat bodies for sale to independent hatters. If Pennaman is a custom hatter what makes his hat a factory hat and not custum.

I play Bagpipes and hang at a Bagpipe forum to. At one point I started to figured out that they were a lot more makes of Pipes out there then there were real makers and that some makers were making pipes for other under a different band name. Once I stated to figure out who was making for who I was asked nicely to stop digging. Would the something happen here?

Jeff

 

[theinterchange]

I'm not confused by the Adventurebilt picture simply because I know what's going on. BUT I can imagine that it IS cloudy for the clueless.

Steve Delk founded Adventurebilt in Mississippi, and was later joined by Marc Kitter from Germany [isn't it?]. Marc specializes in "high end" hats while Steve specializes in the "lower end" and rabbit hats. [both command prices beyond what I'd ever consider paying for one hat] The Adventurebilt "Henry" IS a factory hat named after Henry Jones Jr. better known as Indiana Jones.

John Penman is also a custom hatter who was mentored by Delk, and as such has close ties to the company. He is the exclusive US distributor for the AB Henry hats.

There are several body makers, but only one is widely known, Winchester in Winchester, Tennessee.

Randy

 

[Mobile Vulgus]

Next question... does Adventurebilt offer any hats that are NOT from an Indy Movie? Or are they exclusively a niche manufacturer?

 

[theinterchange]

Next question... does Adventurebilt offer any hats that are NOT from an Indy Movie? Or are they exclusively a niche manufacturer?

I have seen some non-Indy Adventurebilts, but they're few and far between. Penman on the other hand, has some nice looking non-Indy hats. This being my personal favorite.

Randy

 

[kaosharper1]

Next question... does Adventurebilt offer any hats that are NOT from an Indy Movie? Or are they exclusively a niche manufacturer?

Why not just go to his web site and check it out?

http://www.adventurebilthats.com/

And Penman's site:

http://www.penmanhats.com/

 

[Mobile Vulgus]

Thanks for the sties. Did not know of them.

 

[Jedwbpm]

I'm not confused by the Adventurebilt picture simply because I know what's going on. BUT I can imagine that it IS cloudy for the clueless.

Steve Delk founded Adventurebilt in Mississippi, and was later joined by Marc Kitter from Germany [isn't it?]. Marc specializes in "high end" hats while Steve specializes in the "lower end" and rabbit hats. [both command prices beyond what I'd ever consider paying for one hat] The Adventurebilt "Henry" IS a factory hat named after Henry Jones Jr. better known as Indiana Jones.

John Penman is also a custom hatter who was mentored by Delk, and as such has close ties to the company. He is the exclusive US distributor for the AB Henry hats.

There are several body makers, but only one is widely known, Winchester in Winchester, Tennessee.

Randy

So everyone is in a tissey in the other thread about the guy making the midrange hat. What factory is making the Henry? Why would Adventurebilt make a hat call it Adventurebuilt but have somone else sell it. Who is really making the Henry? Why would I not buy a Pennman 100% Beaver for under $500.0 and only a 5month wait instead of from the other two

Jeff

 

[jlee562]

Ok, well, there's Adventurebilt and Adventurebilt Deluxe.

Steve makes the "regular" AB. Marc makes the Deluxe.

What Steve aimed to do with the AB is make a durable, handmade hat. Marc aims to make a hat with the best possible materials. He uses a different felt from a European supplier, Kangroo sweatbands, bridal satin liners, etc.

John Penman is another Indy hatter who is friends with Steve and Marc. He and Steve use the same felt, but not the same blocks (although John's are very, very, very close to Steve's). His hats are also 100% handmade.

The Henry is the Adventurebilt factory hat. It's an 80/20 rabbit/beaver blend, which the AB guys have good reason to believe is made on the original Herbert Johnson "poet" block from the 80's.

 

[zetwal]

There are several body makers, but only one is widely known, Winchester in Winchester, Tennessee.

Who are the lesser know providers?

 

[scottyrocks]

Here's a short history:

http://www.adventurebilthats.com/indy.asp

And here's info about the hats:

http://www.adventurebilthats.com/

There are other links to the right of the page, including testimonials. Although there have been some complaints on how long it takes to get an AB after ordering, Ive never heard a complaint about one of these hats once they are received.

 

[jlee562]

Next question... does Adventurebilt offer any hats that are NOT from an Indy Movie? Or are they exclusively a niche manufacturer?

Yes, but most of Steve's time is spent with the Indy hats.

 

[fmw]

Jeff, lots of name brand manufacturers have made hats for each other. It is a common practice in most industries. It is called OEM manufacturing. I believe some Stetson hats are made by Biltmore.

I wish I could answer you about the hatters. I haven't seen any of their work. I just ordered my first custom from Buckaroo and I'm mailing the check tomorrow. He's going to make me a hat like my Stetson Sturgis. I don't even know what to expect other than a better quality hat than the Stetson. We'll see how it goes.

 

[theinterchange]

Who are the lesser know providers?

I've been told there are a couple of overseas felters, Chinese I think.

But my experiences with hatters is that they... umm... blow wind from time to time to "protect their little secrets". I was told flat out by one that Winchester didn't produce a lightweight body. I only later discovered that they do. Speaking of which, didn't I hear that they were discontinuing the lite?

 

[DanielJones]

A bit about the "Henry"

Penman Hats is the only distributor of the "Henry" In the U.S. It is a factory made hat, made in Europe, so it is far less expensive to buy it from John if you are in the States. If you are in the U.K. or in Europe your best bet is to get it direct from Adventurebilt Deluxe (Marc Kitter). That is the difference of the "Henry" from the three hand made hats. It is a high quality factory hat, Marc worked directly with the European factory to get them made. He picked the felts to be used and the sweatband as well. I believe there were several prototypes before Marc green lit the factory project. So, for those that don't want to wait for a custom, hand made hat, can get a very good quality factory hat from John or Marc at a lower cost, thus you have the Henry (in Brown and Grey). You can get it open crowned and shape it your self or they can put a shape you want into the "Henry".

Hope that made some sense.

Cheers!

Dan

 

[bendingoak]

Let me clear up some things. Steve Delk started AB here in the US using Winchester felt. It's not a low end product. So, let's get that clear. He later added his good friend Marc Kitter who wanted to make a delux version of what steve is doing. He uses the best beaver felt you can find. I have worked with the felt myself and it's a dream to work with. He also has the nices sweatband I have ever seen. Top shelf stuff goes into macros hats. The liner are both the same from steve and marc. Bridel satin with imbroidled logo sewn I to them.

Both steve and marc gave me a big helping hand getting into making truely handmade custom hats. I was a customer and friend with both and they knew I had hurt my neck and back and can no longer continue in the fire department. I will always be thankful to both of these kind gentlemen for giving me a 2nd chance at be a productive person doing something I love. I was a firemen for almost 7 years and didn't know what I was going to do with my life except for sitting on th sofa watching TV. Not really trained to do anything and I can't get though a full day without taking little breaks. With the hat biz now. I can do something I love and still take my breaks when I need to.

I sell the factory hat called the Henry for steve here in the US to help him out because he really does not have the time. I feel honored to be brought on board as part of the AB family.

I would like to add that if. Not for the fame of the Indy movies I think steve and marc would be making other styles of hat and it's a shame they have been labeled that because they are wonderful hatters.

I myself don't just make Indy hats and never liked the term a " Indy hatter" I don't just make Indy hats and it's a bit of an insult.


Again, I would like to publicly thank both Steve and Marc because without them I would be sitting on my couch eating a twinkle.
John

 

[Jedwbpm]

Well alot has been sorted out for me. Thank you all for posting.

Over all here is how I see it. For all reasonable purposes there are only to felters in the US Stetson (Hatco), and Winchester. If you are not wearing a Hatco hat you are wearing a Winchester hat. The only diference among the custustum hatters is shaping and finishing and sowing. I mean a block is a block and any block can easily be reproduced.

I good set of Bagpipes cost about $1500.00 today after that you are paying for silver and froo froo and brand name. So what is the base price for a custum hat before you are paying for froo froo and brand name.

Is this the point where I am asked politely to stop asking questions?

Jeff

 

[bendingoak]

Just wanted to add the reason I took on the Henry. I wanted a production hat to offer customers who didn't want to wait for my handmade custom hats. I looked for a production hat I would be proud of wearing and I could not find anything I like or would wear. Marc went to great lengths to get the very best work from the factory and sourced the best materials for this offering. Wasn't going to just go with what the factories offer. Nope , not good enough for Marc and that's why I lime these two men. They are very passionet about their hats.

 

[bendingoak]

Well alot has been sorted out for me. Thank you all for posting.

Over all here is how I see it. For all reasonable purposes there are only to felters in the US Stetson (Hatco), and Winchester. If you are not wearing a Hatco hat you are wearing a Winchester hat. The only diference among the custustum hatters is shaping and finishing and sowing. I mean a block is a block and any block can easily be reproduced.

I good set of Bagpipes cost about $1500.00 today after that you are paying


for silver and froo froo and brand name. So what is the base price for a custum hat before you are paying for froo froo and brand name.

Is this the point where I am asked politely to stop asking questions?

Jeff

Ouch.


I think you just insulted every hatter here.

 

[warbird]

Well alot has been sorted out for me. Thank you all for posting.

Over all here is how I see it. For all reasonable purposes there are only to felters in the US Stetson (Hatco), and Winchester. If you are not wearing a Hatco hat you are wearing a Winchester hat. The only diference among the custustum hatters is shaping and finishing and sowing. I mean a block is a block and any block can easily be reproduced.

I good set of Bagpipes cost about $1500.00 today after that you are paying for silver and froo froo and brand name. So what is the base price for a custum hat before you are paying for froo froo and brand name.

Is this the point where I am asked politely to stop asking questions?

Jeff

I think you have a valid point in may ways. However I caution you that not all hatters are equal in taking a hat blank and turning it into a beautiful hat. The pouncing and blocking is not necessarily. Especially the pouncing with takes a great deal of experience to get it just right, without ruining it. I have watched this process numerous times and it is not easy.

Also the quality of other materials used and the many shapes and styles vary from one hatter to another. For some of the hatters who have been doing it a while the amount of blocks and specialized equipment is enormous. Not all hatter have the same blocks, and no they aren't easily made nor are there a tone of them out there. The blocks most use are very old. The equip most hatters use has been around for a long long time. Also remember that some hatter use all rabbit fur and some use numerous mixtures of beaver up to full beaver. And some hatters only use all beaver fur. It all depends. Most hatters will tell you they specialize in certain styles or types of hats. It is rare to find a person equally adept at westerns and fedoras, because of the different blocks, equipment and having to keep the different weights of blanks on hand to fulfill customer needs. If you are a hatter in NYC, you likely make mainly dress hats. If you are a hatter out wets of the south, you likely make mainly western hats. From a quality hat point of view, there are probably 1,000 westerns sold for every one dress hat in the US.

And in the fur felting process itself, Winchester uses equipment that is ancient. Every repair is done by a machinist who has to make parts as no company today makes that equip. Even Stetson's equip has been around for a long long time. That is why there is essentially one manufacturer of it in the US, outside of Stetson, and one or two in Europe.

 

[warbird]

Just wanted to add the reason I took on the Henry. I wanted a production hat to offer customers who didn't want to wait for my handmade custom hats. I looked for a production hat I would be proud of wearing and I could not find anything I like or would wear. Marc went to great lengths to get the very best work from the factory and sourced the best materials for this offering. Wasn't going to just go with what the factories offer. Nope , not good enough for Marc and that's why I lime these two men. They are very passionet about their hats.

While it is certainly true that the very best hats are hand made, if made by experienced hands, is the best hat one can buy. However, the thought processes you allude to here is true and they boggle my mind. There are some who incorrectly believe that a manufactured hat is crap. Nothing could be further from the truth. What makes a good or poor manufactured hat is the quality of materials used and the quality of the equip. Most of the hats that are coveted vintage hats on this board were manufactured hats. Some are duds today and some were duds back then. Like today the duds won't last long, but the good ones will survive into the future.