Which Suits Here are 1920s Period-Accurate?

[Marc Chevalier]

although the suit on the left looks fairly generic, it's also pretty accurate because there were, let's be honest, some fairly boring suits amid all the belt backs that we get so excited about. these 'conservative' styles are from Sears catalogue spring-summer 1923 (my own scans, thanks)

True!


Funny thing about those vintage deadstock early to mid '20s suits snatched up by the "Boardwalk Empire" costumer: each one had a paper card with 'care instructions' tucked into the breast pocket. One of the instructions said: "Do not hang jacket on a nail set into the wall." Made me laugh, that one!

 

[Flat Foot Floey]

It's a congruence of factors: the ego of the star actor playing the role, and/or the costume designer's desire to put his or her 'unique and creative mark' on the outfit's design, and/or the intention to convey the character's personality (strong, submissive, etc.) via the outfit -- even at the expense of period-authenticity.

Yes. Well, I remember the Esquire interview with the costumer. I liked the idea to change the general view on the 1920s from black&white to a more colorful approach. This was also the main point for all the menswear blogs who wrote about BE.

Maybe they tried to get the details right too but it got lost on they way from costumer/research to tailors etc...?

But I agree creating a "signature look" for each character was more important and would lead to exaggeration.

 

[herringbonekid]

'cassimere' turns up a lot in these catalogue descriptions... i take it that's just an outmoded version of cashmere ?

 

[Marc Chevalier]

... the idea to change the general view on the 1920s from black&white to a more colorful approach.

It's a good strategy, but plenty of 1920s menswear fabrics and designs were colorful in their own right. The costumer could (IMO should!) have been both colorful and period-accurate, without sacrificing one for the other.

 

[Marc Chevalier]

'cassimere' turns up a lot in these catalogue descriptions... i take it that's just an outmoded version of cashmere ?

Yes.

 

[Edward]

In most U.S. productions, the lead male character's costumes are among the least period-accurate.

Funnily enough, I assumed it was Buscemi on this basis alone. What era (if any) are Nucky's suits more correct to? I like them.

 

[Undertow]

Funnily enough, I assumed it was Buscemi on this basis alone. What era (if any) are Nucky's suits more correct to? I like them.

Yes, and when answering Edward, please make note of the waistcoat; I'm curious to know how that factors in.

If it were 30's, I believe the shoulders would have to be wider (which is hard to see in this clip) and we'd see high button stance with wider lapels (again, hard to see here). The waistcoat would need to be higher yet, although I can't say how high.

If it were 40's, we'd have more natural shoulders, lapels would still be wide but the button stance would be lower and I believe the gorge would be less pronounced. I'm not clear on the waistcoat - I'm not sure that any waistcoats should be "too long".

Someone please help me here, I'm drowning! lol

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Funnily enough, I assumed it was Buscemi on this basis alone. What era (if any) are Nucky's suits more correct to? I like them.

His total look is a pastiche. For instance ... the suit jacket's shoulders are, at the earliest, from the 1930s. The jacket's sleeves are 1940s 'Bold Look' appropriate. The necktie's thickly lined construction is, at the earliest, 1940s-looking. The semi-soft collar, collar pin, and shirt color are appropriate for 1920. (The shirt itself would have probably been made of a soft-sheen silk, rather than the poplin or end-on-end cotton fabric worn by Steve Buscemi. Also, the collar pin would have been worn higher, pushing the tie knot outward.)

 

[Chasseur]

A little off topic, but another thing Hollywood will often do to the leads in period productions is to make their wardrobe and hair more "modern" so the audiance identifies with them more, and save many of the extreme fashions and styles of the period for evil or humourous characters. Think of Emma Stone's character in The Help vs. Bryce Dallas Howard. Nice natural girl with contemporary views we can identify with vs shallow, vindictive, and racist socialite.

I find the extensive use of dark on dark colors and the "cool" hair style (yes, I did read the discussion about how period correct it might be on the haircut thread...) on Michael Pitt's character I think are a good example of this. His color sceme would fit in very well with most contemporary conceptions of "cool or sexy". Lots of dark gray shirts with blue suits; all shirt, vest and coat all the same dark colar; brooding looks, etc. Sometimes I think he escaped from a Twilght film when I am watching Boardwalk...

 

[Marc Chevalier]

... please make note of the waistcoat; I'm curious to know how that factors in.

Here's one approximate rule of thumb for waistcoat length in the 1920s: the location of the waistcoat's bottom button should be roughly parallel to the location of the jacket's bottom button. Both buttons should be about where your navel sits. Again, this is only approximate. (BTW, the 1930s, waistcoats became even shorter as trousers became higher-waisted.)


You can see the rule applied (sort of) in the brown suit of the guy at left:

 

[Flat Foot Floey]

His color sceme would fit in very well with most contemporary conceptions of "cool or sexy". Lots of dark gray shirts with blue suits; all shirt, vest and coat all the same dark colar; brooding looks, etc. Sometimes I think he escaped from a Twilght film when I am watching Boardwalk...

Yes. But he started with a working class style in brown-tones. The character development was also mentioned here or in the recaps. The psychology isn't very deep though.

 

[herringbonekid]

(yes, I did read the discussion about how period correct it might be on the haircut thread...)

i'm glad that some people saw my point of view on that one. and i agree that overall his look was contemporary-20s. of course, it doesn't help that Pitt has a pouty, rock star look to begin with.

 

[Chasseur]

Yes. But he started with a working class style in brown-tones. The character development was also mentioned here or in the recaps. The psychology isn't very deep though.

Good point Floey, and I agree with you on the shift from working class to suits. However, I think even the early work clothes he wore tended to have a dark color gray upon gray, upon dark brown or charcoal, with a sort of hip modern feel to it etc.

If he was wearing clunky boots with these outfits you could easily see him on the Sartorialist.

i'm glad that some people saw my point of view on that one. and i agree that overall his look was contemporary-20s. of course, it doesn't help that Pitt has a pouty, rock star look to begin with.

While I was not part of that haircut discussion I tend to agree with you on your point.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

What issue of Esquire did the BE costume article appear in?

Thanx!!!
Charlie

 

[Flat Foot Floey]

Maybe just online?

 

[Qirrel]

The problem with the costumes for this series is that they were made by Martin Greenfield, who is not a costumer, but a modern tailor with modern working methods. You can't make a period accurate suit without also using period accurate tailoring techniques. Take the shoulders of Nucky's suits as an example: They are straight and shapeless, which is the exact opposite of what would have come out of a(ny) respectable tailoring shop in 1920.

 

[Undertow]

Good rule of thumb, thank you, Marc!

I suppose that rule has since been thrown dead from a window?

 

[Patrick Hall]

I have always thought Buscemi's collars look awfully strange on this show. I guess it must be the low placement of the collar pin - also they look perhaps an inch too big. Maybe his pastiche wardrobe is also the way it is because of little concessions like that - "I hate collars that touch my neck," and "why are these pants so high?"

 

[Mr Vim]

The pants struck me as high waisted enough when I can actually see them, which is only once in season one to my memory... I recall someone pointing out that the Artist has some anachronistic tailoring but it still comes off amazing.

Alright so his suit is anachronisitc, they're all bespoke, is it such a stretch to think that the character maybe wanted them that way? Or, Martin Scorscese, who if I recall is very particular about everything on his sets, said I want Nucky's outfit a certain way.

 

[Marc Chevalier]

I recall someone pointing out that the Artist has some anachronistic tailoring but it still comes off amazing.

Yes, I was the one who pointed that out ... but the tailoring in "The Artist" is much less anachronistic, and notably more period-correct, than "Boardwalk Empire"s.

Alright so his suit is anachronisitc, they're all bespoke, is it such a stretch to think that the character maybe wanted them that way?

IMO, it is a big stretch. Nucky would have made his stylistic choices from among the variety of tailoring options and details (shoulder shapes, sleeve and waistcoat lengths, etc.) that were available in the late 'teens and early '20s ... not the '30s, '40s, and beyond.