When did the penny drop?

[Big J]

So do assholes.

Is this your emulation of facist style bullying?

Name calling, this is what revisionists do when you show up the flaws in their arguments.
I've seen it all before Stanley. I deal with war-crime deniers for a living.

 

[Big J]

These are unsourced sound-bites, opinion comments.
Back it up with verifiable sources (not convicted war-crime deniers like David Irving) if you want me to think that it's anything other than just your opinion.

 

[Stanley Doble]

What is wrong with the quotations and sources I already provided?

For an eye witness account of the events leading up to the war, try Insanity Fair by Douglas Reed published in 1938. It is the source for the information about Hitler's liquidation of the SA and the reasons for it.

http://iamthewitness.com/books/Douglas.Reed/Douglas.Reed_Insanity.Fair.pdf

 

[Stanley Doble]

What is your problem? First you agree 100% with the idea that the Gestapo suppressed all dissent. When I point out that I said basically the same thing, you get sore.

So tell me, why do you call me a fascist for agreeing with you?

 

[Trenchfriend]

Don't feed the histrionics...

 

[Bolero]

Often a few words can "Speak Volumes"...and this statement by Stanley Doble, strikes me as a look into his inner Mindset re GeoPolitics and overall thoughts on WWII and Germany....and wasn't Coburg the German city of 1929 that was the first Nazi Party stronghold ??? However I'm sure that does not have any relevance re todays discussions...

All right. Explain to me why the American people allow their government to start wars for false reasons and commit war crimes around the world without protest?

 

[Bolero]

IMO... one, if not the Primary, reason for the continuation of Hitler's sick, Paranoidal, Demonic, Racial, Genocidal Programs and Rule was the appointment of both Goring and Himmler into the positions of running and controlling the Gestapo and the SS...These two organizations and their Fanatically extreme enforcement of Hitlers demands, thoughts, Genocide, Military Buffunary kept Him,Hitler, in power over the German Wehrmacht and General Population throughtout his Reign...

 

[Trenchfriend]

I forgot "Operation Cerberus", the return of "Gneisenau", "Scharnhorst" and "Prinz Eugen" to Germany. After that, they surely comprehend, that westsides the game is over.

 

[Stand By]

So do assholes.

Allow me to refer you to the Bar Rules as set by Paddy himself:
http://www.thefedoralounge.com/show...rt-and-protect-all-our-great-members-in-here)

I don't care what justification you may feel you have for the above. We can all disagree and yet make our points eloquently without deferring to profanity and insults. It is what true debate is made of.

PS. And in case you're considering a reply like "Who died and you moderator?" - I would say that, upon some consideration, I would hope you'd agree that it is better that I say this my way, rather than a moderator delete your last comment and then people here think "Hmm. Stanley's gone quiet" - and it's because you were banned from TFL (as this is where you're heading, I think) and that's avoidable.
Don't believe me? Send a PM to Schitzo and ask him about it. Oh right, you can't. He's been shown the door and he's gone.

 

[filfoster]

Where's the Moderator?

 

[Edward]

This thread probably could do with some tidying up. Don't forget, though, that the mods are busy folks who have real lives outside TFL... they can't spot everything. If you look along the bar at the bottom of each post (where you see the links for reply, reply with quote, et cetera), on the far left of that there's a little, yellow triangle with a tiny black exclamation mark in it. Hover your mouse over that, and a box saying "report post" will appear. Click on the yellow triangle, and you'll be able to send a report to the mods, which one of the team will definitely see faster than chancing across it.

 

[Stand By]

And furthermore, I think the penny would also have dropped for me looking up at all those formations of B-17s flying over Germany in 1943.
In 1942, the Luftwaffe was giving them a serious kicking (just as the Afrika Korps were to the fledgling US Army in N. Africa) and the USAAF was suffering unsustainable losses, and I could well have thought that this was now a war of attrition and things were getting serious ...
But by 1943, I think I would have looked up and realized that only more and more bombers were coming - too many to intercept - and realized also that Germany had no similar air force of heavy bombers to do this back to England. It was all one-way air traffic. And this without the bombers having full fighter escort at that time. I think I would have sensed the impending doom then as well.

 

[Stanley Doble]

I don't like being called a Nazi sympathizer especially by someone with a fat, white, bullet headed cigar chomping avatar.

My point was that there are lessons to be learned from the history of Europe and the world from the period 1920 - 1945. But they will be completely missed if you reduce that whole period to a cartoon populated by cartoon characters and not live human beings.

I dare say I have done more reading on this subject, and history in general, than 99 people out of 100. History is not always as simple as it is presented on TV or in the movies.

 

[Stanley Doble]

Just in case there is anybody left who is interested in facts, rather than propaganda-

I live in Cobourg, Ontario, Canada a small town on the shore of Lake Ontario. The town was founded by Loyalist refugees from the American Revolution. It was renamed Cobourg in 1818, in recognition of the marriage of Princess Charlotte Augusta of Wales to Prince Leopold of Saxe-Coburg-Saalfeld (later Saxe-Coburg and Gotha, who would later become King of Belgium).

Furthermore I will put Cobourg's and Canada's record in the fight against Hitler up against any similar town in the United States, or Japan.

 

[Stanley Doble]

IMO... one, if not the Primary, reason for the continuation of Hitler's sick, Paranoidal, Demonic, Racial, Genocidal Programs and Rule was the appointment of both Goring and Himmler into the positions of running and controlling the Gestapo and the SS...These two organizations and their Fanatically extreme enforcement of Hitlers demands, thoughts, Genocide, Military Buffunary kept Him,Hitler, in power over the German Wehrmacht and General Population throughtout his Reign...

Thank you. This was my point exactly.

 

[Stanley Doble]

Where's the Moderator?

That is what I would like to know. Insults like "Nazi sympathizer" "fascist" and the like, have no place in an intelligent discussion.

 

[Stand By]

What is wrong with the quotations and sources I already provided?

For an eye witness account of the events leading up to the war, try Insanity Fair by Douglas Reed published in 1938. It is the source for the information about Hitler's liquidation of the SA and the reasons for it.

http://iamthewitness.com/books/Douglas.Reed/Douglas.Reed_Insanity.Fair.pdf

Now that's odd. I only frequent TFL here at work in-between tasks and I can't access the link as it says it's prohibited by my workplace for "Hate Speech".
Goodness. I wonder what that was all about?

 

[plain old dave]

Furthermore I will put Cobourg's and Canada's record in the fight against Hitler up against any similar town in the United States, or Japan.

Scott County, Tennessee seceded from Tennessee when Tennessee seceded from the Union in 1861. Formed the Free State of Scott and independently declared war on Germany in 1917. Never signed the Armistice, so was at war with Germany until they re-joined Tennessee in 1986. That's a 69 year conflict.

But to get back to the topic, I can understand why the Luftwaffe never opposed Hitler; Goering. But the Kriegsmarine was never led by radical Nazis; you almost never see images of Naval leaders rendering the Nazi Party salute and after Hitler's suicide, Doenitz immediately accepted the Allies' terms. It might be fairly said that the Kriegsmarine was the least Nazified part of German society and what I never have been able to wrap my head around is why no senior Naval officers joined any of the anti-Hitler plots. Certainly some of the senior officers had read Mahan and understood that without a Navy Germany couldn't win the war.

 

[Big J]

Now that's odd. I only frequent TFL here at work in-between tasks and I can't access the link as it says it's prohibited by my workplace for "Hate Speech".
Goodness. I wonder what that was all about?

You're not missing anything. My request for specific sources to back up his claims led Stanley to link an entire revisionist anti-semetic book as a PDF file. Definitely NSFW.

 

[Stand By]

You're not missing anything. My request for specific sources to back up his claims led Stanley to link an entire revisionist anti-semetic book as a PDF file. Definitely NSFW.

Well that explains the "Prohibited category: Hate speech" that immediately sprang up on my monitor.
I'm sorry that IT will have flagged me for it. Lesson learned.
Thanks.