Whats difference between Buco J21 and J24??

[zhz]

I spend few hours try to find the answer online, but no luck...
It is obvious that the lining is different, J21 uses wool and J24 uses nylon. Also, seems like J21 is a standard or wider fitting than J24, which is a slim fitting jacket.
Apart from this, are there another difference?

 

[bretron]

Map pocket (I think), lining and tag? I've asked this question as well, but between the J21 and J22, also the J23 and J24...

 

[zhz]

Map pocket (I think), lining and tag? I've asked this question as well, but between the J21 and J22, also the J23 and J24...

Map pocket? you mean the shape, size of the D pocket? I can see the difference of map pocket between J22 and J24, but J21 and J24? Cant tell...

 

[IXL]

I believe the J-24 is the only one of the four featuring the twin, rear "pillion pockets."

 

[jonbuilder]

Yes the J24 is the only jacket with twin pillion / map pockets. My J24 has the checked wool lining. J24 is longer than J21 or j22 jackets

 

[bretron]

Ok, I'll try again- seeing as I seem to finally have an audience

So if I got it; a J23 is a nylon lined version of a J22. And a J24 is a J23 but with a twin billion/map pocket. Then what the heck is the difference between a J21 and J22?

 

[zhz]

By pillion pockets, I assume you guys are talking about two vertical zipped pockets at the back of the jacket, right? Not the hand warm and the D pockets in front?

 

[zhz]

Also, whats the correct leather weight of these jacket? I assume it is 2.5-3oz HH, is it correct?

 

[zhz]

Ok, I'll try again- seeing as I seem to finally have an audience

So if I got it; a J23 is a nylon lined version of a J22. And a J24 is a J23 but with a twin billion/map pocket. Then what the heck is the difference between a J21 and J22?

I think the fit is different as wll. I believe j24 is the most slim one in J2X family.

 

[zhz]

Ok, I'll try again- seeing as I seem to finally have an audience

So if I got it; a J23 is a nylon lined version of a J22. And a J24 is a J23 but with a twin billion/map pocket. Then what the heck is the difference between a J21 and J22?

I think the fit is different as wll. I believe j24 is the most slim one in J2X family.

 

[IXL]

By pillion pockets, I assume you guys are talking about two vertical zipped pockets at the back of the jacket, right? Not the hand warm and the D pockets in front?

Correct.

 

[bretron]

I think the fit is different as wll. I believe j24 is the most slim one in J2X family.

Appreciate that

 

[Blackadder]

Our discussion from earlier.

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?52779-D-Pocket-leather-jackets/page22&highlight=buco

My understanding is only the J-21 has the "tear drop" epaulet and the subsequent models have changed the epaulet to a straight ones. Also the D pocket of the earlier J models look bigger and its position is different from the latter models. Then there is the most obvious difference the lining.

 

[Blackadder]

If this is correct, that is really a J-21 and not J-22 then some J-21 has two pillon pockets.

J-21?

J-24

 

[jonbuilder]

The following information is taken from Rin Tanaka motorcycle books and buco catalogs
The J-21 was the first of a series for jackets with D-pockets including the j-21, j-1, j-22, j-23, j24, j24h, and j-82. The j-21 was the first made from 1948 to 1950 with a 22’ back length and red, green and yellow plaid wool lining. Only the j-21 had one pyramid and 2 round studs on the epaulets. The j-1 was a j-21 with 24’ length sold 1948 to 1949. The j-21 had the second Buco brown label that did not mention horsehide. The j-22 and j-23 replaced the j-21 in 1951. The j-22 had a red & black plaid wool lining and the j-23 had a black rayon quilted lining. Based on the Buco catalog the j-22 & J23 were 24” in length. The j-24 is the only jacket of the series with two back zip pockets. The early j-24 was made from horsehide and came with buco’s third label or first blue horsehide label. From 1957 to 1958 the j-24 was made of steer hide and came with a blue steer hide label. In 1959 the j-24 was again made with horsehide as j-24h with the fifth blue horsehide label. The belt loops were gone and a stretch band was added on the waist to the j-24h. The quality of the horsehide by this time was not as good. Buco j-82 was a lower priced steerhide with the fourth buco blue steer hide label made 1956 to 1960

 

[pawineguy]

The following information is taken from Rin Tanaka motorcycle books and buco catalogs
The J-21 was the first of a series for jackets with D-pockets including the j-21, j-1, j-22, j-23, j24, j24h, and j-82. The j-21 was the first made from 1948 to 1950 with a 22’ back length and red, green and yellow plaid wool lining. Only the j-21 had one pyramid and 2 round studs on the epaulets. The j-1 was a j-21 with 24’ length sold 1948 to 1949. The j-21 had the second Buco brown label that did not mention horsehide. The j-22 and j-23 replaced the j-21 in 1951. The j-22 had a red & black plaid wool lining and the j-23 had a black rayon quilted lining. Based on the Buco catalog the j-22 & J23 were 24” in length. The j-24 is the only jacket of the series with two back zip pockets. The early j-24 was made from horsehide and came with buco’s third label or first blue horsehide label. From 1957 to 1958 the j-24 was made of steer hide and came with a blue steer hide label. In 1959 the j-24 was again made with horsehide as j-24h with the fifth blue horsehide label. The belt loops were gone and a stretch band was added on the waist to the j-24h. The quality of the horsehide by this time was not as good. Buco j-82 was a lower priced steerhide with the fourth buco blue steer hide label made 1956 to 1960

Thank you, great information!

 

[Blackadder]

The following information is taken from Rin Tanaka motorcycle books and buco catalogs
The J-21 was the first of a series for jackets with D-pockets including the j-21, j-1, j-22, j-23, j24, j24h, and j-82. The j-21 was the first made from 1948 to 1950 with a 22’ back length and red, green and yellow plaid wool lining. Only the j-21 had one pyramid and 2 round studs on the epaulets. The j-1 was a j-21 with 24’ length sold 1948 to 1949. The j-21 had the second Buco brown label that did not mention horsehide. The j-22 and j-23 replaced the j-21 in 1951. The j-22 had a red & black plaid wool lining and the j-23 had a black rayon quilted lining. Based on the Buco catalog the j-22 & J23 were 24” in length. The j-24 is the only jacket of the series with two back zip pockets. The early j-24 was made from horsehide and came with buco’s third label or first blue horsehide label. From 1957 to 1958 the j-24 was made of steer hide and came with a blue steer hide label. In 1959 the j-24 was again made with horsehide as j-24h with the fifth blue horsehide label. The belt loops were gone and a stretch band was added on the waist to the j-24h. The quality of the horsehide by this time was not as good. Buco j-82 was a lower priced steerhide with the fourth buco blue steer hide label made 1956 to 1960

J-21 with one pyramid and 2 round studs
http://ameblo.jp/safari-kouenji/entry-11414438067.html
Then J-21 without the 2 round studs
http://global.rakuten.com/en/store/nomad/item/100549/
http://eijucraft.cocolog-nifty.com/blog/2010/12/buco-j-21-proto.html
J-22 with one back zip pocket
https://www.etsy.com/hk-en/listing/211471964/vtg-original-50s-buco-j-22-wool-plaid?ref=market
Supposedly J-21 and/or J-22 with 2 back zip pockets
http://item.rakuten.co.jp/nomad/100203/
http://item.rakuten.co.jp/nomad/100548/
I am more confused than ever. I guess these last 2 jackets could have all been J-24s with older labels and linings applied to them. But then came this weird one in the Lightning archives that I posted above, i.e. with plaid lining, brown label and 2 back zip pockets and the weird D-pocket.

 

[ttonyd]

Allow me to add to the confusion....
I have a j-24 (2 zip pockets in back)
With black quilted nylon lining and the old brown label.

 

[ttonyd]

Allow me to add to the confusion....
I have a j-24 (2 zip pockets in back)
With black quilted nylon lining and the old brown label.

I would love to figure out just what I have here. Someone on another forum said it may be a prototype made in late 40's. Wish I could find a resource to be sure in case I sell it.

 

[Monitor]

What you have is a several thousand dollars. XD