What modern invention/innovation do you wish had *never* been developed?

[LizzieMaine]

I've never measured it -- it's standard size for a prewar refrigerator, whatever that is. It's plenty big enough for me, though. After defrosting it last week, it contains a jug of orange juice, a jug of drinking water, a quart of milk, five bottles of Coke, a jar of Durkee's Dressing, a jar of mustard, a bottle of ketchup, a pound of sausage, a dozen eggs, a pound of cottage cheese, two packs of Kraft Singles, half a pound of salami, half a pound of ham, a bag of carrots, two sticks of butter, a chocolate Easter bunny from about three years ago, and a casserole dish of leftover macaroni and cheese. In the freezer compartment there's an ice tray, two migraine pads, two frozen Banquet meals, a venison steak somebody gave me years ago, and half a bag of frozen french fries. How much more room do I need?

 

[HudsonHawk]

I've never measured it -- it's standard size for a prewar refrigerator, whatever that is. It's plenty big enough for me, though.

Kelvinator advertised it's "Family Sized" Big-6 model, which featured a whopping 6.5 cubic foot capacity (about the size of two small "dorm fridges"). Nowadays, an "efficiency apartment" sized fridge is about double that. A standard household one about 18-20 cubic feet.

 

[vitanola]

Just curious, as this raises an interesting point: What type of electrical usage is employed by your era TV set and refrigeration in relation to similar modern appliances of comparable size and other variables, such as BTUs, square footage, etc.? Has anyone ever done objective and impartial study in this area?

Well refrigerators in the era were quite efficient. They had to be, for the real cost of electric current was an order of magnitude greater than it is today. Refrigerators became inefficient during the period of exceptionally low electricity prices which began in the mid-fifties. Features like the early self-defrosters were notorious energy hogs, and manufacturers began slipping on insulation thickness in order to increase the cubic capacity of a machine of a given foot print.

A large 2-door Monitor top was determined to use 262 kwh/yr by the LA Board of Light and Power in 1933. This would have been one of the CA series Methyl Formate machines. My current two-door CK machine uses just about the same amount of energy. Another example which I restored for a friend is considerably more efficient, for it has been re-insulated using closed cell foam (the original insulation became water-logged after a flood). The upgraded machine consumes but 165 KWH/year. That's what you get with five inches of R-8.75 foam!

Kelvinator advertised it's "Family Sized" Big-6 model, which featured a whopping 6.5 cubic foot capacity (about the size of two small "dorm fridges"). Nowadays, an "efficiency apartment" sized fridge is about double that. A standard household one about 18-20 cubic feet.

True, but you would be amazed at how much larger these old units seem. Things keep getting lost in the back of our big Frigidaire, uselessly taking up space until they are thrown out. In the Monitor Top, the cabinet is shallow and wide, and the shelves slide out so that one can easily locate items even when the machine is tightly packed. The toe-touch door opener is a nice feature, too. One can come up to the box with both hands full of leftovers and still open the door.

I think the problem here is one of experience. You do not appear to ever have lived with these things, and yet you know in your heart that modern stuff is always better in every way. I have used both modern and period stuff, for years at a time and understand that some things have not improved. Styles have merely changed.

I would, for example, never claim that my Flivver was an objectively better car than, say my little Benz. More fun? For me, yes, but the Benz has it all over anything I've ever owned for reliability and service.

 

[LizzieMaine]

Kelvinator advertised it's "Family Sized" Big-6 model, which featured a whopping 6.5 cubic foot capacity (about the size of two small "dorm fridges"). Nowadays, an "efficiency apartment" sized fridge is about double that. A standard household one about 18-20 cubic feet.

Seriously? Who needs that much space? If you live in an efficiency apartment, you don't have a big family to feed, so what do people fill all that with??

 

[HudsonHawk]

True, but you would be amazed at how much larger these old units seem. Things keep getting lost in the back of our big Frigidaire, uselessly taking up space until they are thrown out.

Certainly smaller sizes or different configurations may be more useful for some people. But size affects the energy usage, that's all I'm pointing out.

You do not appear to ever have lived with these things, and yet you know in your heart that modern stuff is always better in every way.

I have never said or implied that in any way. I have said that modern ones are comparatively less expensive and older ones are not infallible.

 

[HudsonHawk]

Seriously? Who needs that much space? If you live in an efficiency apartment, you don't have a big family to feed, so what do people fill all that with??

Personally, I have a lot of mustard. And that's not a joke, I have dozens of different mustards in my fridge. I'm kind of nuts about mustard. I'd expect beer takes up a lot of room in the average modern fridge as well.

 

[LizzieMaine]

I'd expect beer takes up a lot of room in the average modern fridge as well.

I think we've hit on the real cause of the obesity epidemic.

 

[vitanola]

Personally, I have a lot of mustard. And that's not a joke, I have dozens of different mustards in my fridge. I'm kind of nuts about mustard.

[video=youtube;yEE7f0uLvHM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEE7f0uLvHM&feature=youtube_gdata_player[/video]

 

[LizzieMaine]

As far as costs go, well, let's take a look over the long run. I paid fifty dollars for my refrigerator twenty-six years ago. If I'm using an average of, let's say 550 KWH a year to run it, at my current price of .065 cents per KWH -- which is a lot higher than it was in 1988, but let's just say -- that's $979.50 I've paid for refrigeration. Over twenty-six years.

If I pay, say, $650 for a good-quality modern refrigerator -- not a cheap dorm fridge, but something with a reasonably decent build quality, and then add to that whatever it costs me to run it over twenty-six years at, say, 425 KWH a year, it'd still run to $1346.15.

But could I, reasonably, expect that refrigerator to last twenty-six years? Let's assume it fails after thirteen years and has to be replaced, which is quite a bit better a deal than my mother has gotten. Add another $650, and assume the new one gets, oh, 325 KWH a year. That gives us $1933.76 over the same twenty-six year period, and that's being pretty conservative with the figures.

So how is that less expensive?

 

[ChiTownScion]

Personally, I have a lot of mustard. And that's not a joke, I have dozens of different mustards in my fridge. I'm kind of nuts about mustard. I'd expect beer takes up a lot of room in the average modern fridge as well.

With me, the freezer capacity of an era refrigerator would be an issue. I usually buy French Vanilla by the gallon, and I also need enough space for that portion of my ice cream maker to be kept frozen. And that's in addition to the needs of others in this house. My personal vices may be rather moderate, but I'd never want to live life sans Bananas Foster or Cherries Jubilee.

 

[vitanola]

With me, the freezer capacity of an era refrigerator would be an issue. I usually buy French Vanilla by the gallon, and I also need enough space for that portion of my ice cream maker to be kept frozen. And that's in addition to the needs of others in this house. My personal vices may be rather moderate, but I'd never want to live life sans Bananas Foster or Cherries Jubilee.

Well, live with a vintage or antique refrigerator does have its limitations. Since we live in a country district there is an immense amount of cheap, high quality produce available in the late summer. We can and freeze large amounts, and so we do have a modest sized chest freezer in the cellar. With that in the house, the, er, modest freezer compartment of an antique machine is much less important.

 

[vitanola]

Well, live with a vintage or antique refrigerator does have its limitations. Since we live in a country district there is an immense amount of cheap, high quality produce available in the late summer. We can and freeze large amounts, and so we do have a modest sized chest freezer in the cellar. With that in the house, the, er, modest freezer compartment of an antique machine is much less important.

By the way, "Bananas Foster" and "Cherries Jubilee" are both served flambé. I can hardly see why one would need large freezer space for them. The ice crealm, being made fresh in a freezer would hardly take up space in the ice box.

I must give you my recipie for "Bananas Foster Brooks". It uses Shellac Thinner and Jamaica Ginger in the place of rum and creme de banana.

 

[sheeplady]

Well, live with a vintage or antique refrigerator does have its limitations. Since we live in a country district there is an immense amount of cheap, high quality produce available in the late summer. We can and freeze large amounts, and so we do have a modest sized chest freezer in the cellar. With that in the house, the, er, modest freezer compartment of an antique machine is much less important.

We have a large upright freezer for the same reason.

I also like to do homemade "frozen dinners" (frozen leftovers) that we can then un-thaw and eat to avoid eating out. We also put up a lot of food, etc. I never found the freezer compartment on a modern fridge to be large enough- even in my old apartment I had a small upright. That has since sadly died, but I hope to get it repaired to keep in the pantry.

My parents who grow almost all of their own vegetables (I'd say 95%) have two large upright freezers in their basement. (My mother does not can.)

 

[HudsonHawk]

But could I, reasonably, expect that refrigerator to last twenty-six years? Let's assume it fails after thirteen years and has to be replaced

Of course you could expect it to last that long. Why would you assume it won't.?

 

[vitanola]

Of course you could expect it to last that long. Why would you assume it won't.?

Experience?

My father purchased a new GE side-by-side when he remodeled his kitchen in 1996. The compressor failed in 2011. I just helped our next-door neighbor move in a new refrigerator to replace the Knemore that they had purchased in 1999. Then there is our Frigidaire, which had the compressor replaced after failure at four years, and now had a door rusting out, a common problem with these machines, or so says the service rep.

 

[LizzieMaine]

Of course you could expect it to last that long. Why would you assume it won't.?

Two dead refrigerators in my mother's cellar.

 

[HudsonHawk]

Experience?

Exactly. I bought my house in 2001. The refrigerator was built in 1978. It's still going strong in the garage. The one I purchased in 2002 is still going strong. The fridge my parents purchased in 1984...still going strong. None have ever needed any sort of repair. Again, I've never known anyone who's refrigerator ever died, despite being 15, 20, 30 plus years old. I find it a completely flawed premise to assume that a refrigerator will not last 20 years.

 

[vitanola]

How very lucky!

Now, the life expectancy of a modern (made after 1996, there were some technical changes made in that year to refrigerator designs across the board here in the 'States) domestic refrigerator according to the NAHB averages 13 years. slightly less for side-by-units, slitly more for top or bottom freezer units. Th average life of an American refrigerator is just under twenty years, but that figure is distorted by the many ore-1955 machines still running in garages and cellars.

Your 1978 machine would be just about the worst of all worlds, efficiency-wise. Thin walls, light insulation, heated door jambs, and a greedy auto-defroster.

 

[HudsonHawk]

Your 1978 machine would be just about the worst of all worlds, efficiency-wise. Thin walls, light insulation, heated door jambs, and a greedy auto-defroster.

Not to mention it lives in the 110 degree heat most of the year. I keep trying to explain to my wife that a new fridge would pay for itself in energy savings, but she completely misunderstands thermodynamics.

 

[HudsonHawk]

How very lucky!

Now, the life expectancy of a modern (made after 1996, there were some technical changes made in that year to refrigerator designs across the board here in the 'States) domestic refrigerator according to the NAHB averages 13 years. slightly less for side-by-units, slitly more for top or bottom freezer units. Th average life of an American refrigerator is just under twenty years, but that figure is distorted by the many ore-1955 machines still running in garages and cellars.

Those numbers are also distorted by the great number of refrigerators that have been replaced in the last 30 years for aesthetic or efficiency reasons, and don't have anything to do with them failing mechanically. The same reason porcelain coated cast iron sinks have a "lifespan" of only 5 years.