Vocabulary Today

[Dr Doran]

MY GOD, IT'S FULL OF STARS

Folks, I was about to start a new post on this subject (title: DECLINE IS REAL, FOLKS ... or is that too Jeremiah-ish?) and then I saw this one. More or less exactly what I was going to say.

I have just finished grading about 60 papers. Undergraduate papers, yes, but UPPER DIVISION. This means in a junior or senior-level course. This was at BERKELEY, considered one of the nation's best schools.

I WAS APPALLED.

Spelling mistakes. Their for there. Grammar mistakes. It's for its. Constant confusion of single subject and plural verb and vicey-versey. Paragraphs having nothing to do with the argument of the paper -- even paragraphs that COULD HAVE BEEN HARNESSED TO THAT ARGUMENT but were not. INCOHERENT THESIS ARGUMENTS. Failure to sum up the "arguments" in the conclusion. OVERABUNDANCE OF QUOTATION MARKS as though "scare quotes" show sophistication in thinking, as though their usage proves that the writer is clever enough to know that meanings of words are sometimes slippery, and that labels of things are not intrinsic to the things themselves -- something Plato figured out in his Kratylos dialogue TWO THOUSAND THREE HUNDRED AND SEVENTY YEARS AGO. Something that was "au courant" again with Derrida and deconstruction but that is no longer even faintly novel or even interesting at this point in the conversation.

Garbage, garbage, garbage. Absolute crap. I received some excellent papers and some good papers and some OK papers. However, the bad ones were so bad as to defy reason. In CofC terms, I lost some sanity points.

At Berkeley, the problem, or ONE problem, is grade inflation. The scale that the graduate student instructors and even many professors use goes not from A+ to F, but from A+ to B- (unless someone does something bad, in which case they get a C). The students end up thinking they can turn in utter crap and get a B- for their efforts. And turn in an only mediocre paper and get, instead of a B- or C+, a B+.

My grading is not the harshest. My colleague D_____ is harsher. In a pool of some 40 papers, he gave only 5 in the A range, 13 in the C range, and the rest in the B range. I usually find more papers in the A range than 5 if I have 40 in the total pool.

We cannot hope to have a generation of effective leaders if they cannot even write a coherent essay proving a point. Essay-writing is an exercise in THINKING.

 

[jamespowers]

We cannot hope to have a generation of effective leaders if they cannot even write a coherent essay proving a point. Essay-writing is an exercise in THINKING.

Uh, there is your problem right there. Schools today are geared toward teaching what to think rather than how to think logically and put together a coherent, well thought out argument/thesis.
Giving away answers to a test is only making such standardized tests worthless in evaluating what the students actually know. You are seeing the end result of years of this. Some local teacher here even admitted to cheating on such tests to passify the "bean counters." :eusa_doh: :rage:

Regards,

J

P.S. Yes, its private school for my children with a local school district populated with dolts like that.:rage:

 

[Dr Doran]

Uh, there is your problem right there. Schools today are geared toward teaching what to think rather than how to think logically and put together a coherent, well thought out argument/thesis.
Giving away answers to a test is only making such standardized tests worthless in evaluating what the students actually know. You are seeing the end result of years of this. Some local teacher here even admitted to cheating on such tests to pacify the "bean counters." :eusa_doh: :rage:

Regards,

J

P.S. Yes, its private school for my children with a local school district populated with dolts like that.:rage:

I'll homeschool if I can. Curriculum based around history, naturally. The only thing I cannot teach is post-algebra mathematics. Anything else, including biology and genetics, I can teach at least K-12 and in many subjects beyond that level.

My friend wants to start a K-12 school based around Latin, ancient Greek, and Hebrew: I can teach the first two and he the third. That's a good idea when they are young, as their minds are best for languages then. I can also teach Italian, French, and perhaps basic Spanish and my wife can teach French, basic Spanish, and advanced Polish although the last is not in great demand.

And we are political moderates, NOT P.C. and NOT extreme in our views and absolutely uninterested in pushing our opinions on people. Any takers? Step on up. We'll charge reasonable rates at first, then raise them once our teaching methods become known.

I am quite serious.

As for the local elementary schools: are you aware that the following utterly insane argument has been made by K-12 teachers?

"If a test produces results in a population which vary according to the race of the test-taker, then that test is inherently racist."

At what degree of insanity have we arrived?

 

[GwenLake]

It's at times like these that I'm glad I am homeschooled.

 

[Undertow]

As an English major, and not a great one at that, I often find myself editing essay papers at friends' desperate requests.

Mind you, I am sufficiently aware of my wordiness, redundancy, occasional grammar attacks, etc, and it is part of my life struggle to overcome these things.

However, while I'm reading through these undergraduate papers intended to display some sort of basic knowledge of the course, I can't help but to feel as just like Doran: Utter Garbage!

I don't expect my peers to have the style and flow of a literary genius, but basic grammatical errors, incoherency, complete lack of argument, among so many other things are inexcusably ridiculous at an undergraduate level. MAYBE a high school sophomore could make these mistakes because then at least one might say, “Eh, he/she’s only 16,” but NOT in college.

And to wrap this little potato in foil, I would go into nightlong bouts of editing and discussion in a desperate attempt to fix their errors to which I would hear many a complaint with little to no changes.

And when they received a B- (completely inflated in relation to the garbage they turned in) they would complain to me about how my editing lacked any results. :rage:

Eh, what do I care? India and China teach their students well and our corporations will hire overseas to save money anyway. Might as well live as the grasshopper, eat well, feel pleasant and hope we don't die in the winter.

 

[Dr Doran]

I don't expect my peers to have the style and flow of a literary genius, but basic grammatical errors, incoherency, complete lack of argument, among so many other things are inexcusably ridiculous at an undergraduate level.

Precisely, Undertow. That's what I'm talking about. I don't want Faulkner or Cormac McCarthy -style prose, just an argument that makes sense and is written in acceptable English.

And Gwen -- actually, according to my wife, Josefow might not be so bad. Polish K-12 is far more advanced than its American equivalent. When she moved to the USA from Poland as a child, she was shocked at how little a student her age was expected to know of mathematics. Then again, this was California public school, where the students (I AM NOT KIDDING) learned Michael Jackson lyrics in English class. This was in Pittsburgh, California. (My HIGH SCHOOL in Van Nuys, California was little better. Our psychology teacher used "I'M OK, YOU'RE OK" as our psychology textbook. Worse, I went to the monstrosity that is Junior College before transferring to a real school for my BA: in a philosophy class taught by one Dennis Green, there WAS no textbook. No readings at all. No recommended side readings. Only Mr Green talking, and repeating himself. And we could handwrite the paper.)

 

[Undertow]

Worse, I went to the monstrosity that is Junior College before transferring to a real school for my BA: in a philosophy class taught by one Dennis Green, there WAS no textbook. No readings at all. No recommended side readings. Only Mr Green talking, and repeating himself. And we could handwrite the paper.)

Awe man...man o man o man o man. I would say something clever here but that's just like the junior colleges in Iowa. I think some of those kids are lucky to read a newspaper and make any sense of it (which is why, in fact, they don't read newspapers. Why do that when you could read Maxim and look at the pictures?)

 

[GwenLake]

And Gwen -- actually, according to my wife, Josefow might not be so bad. Polish K-12 is far more advanced than its American equivalent. When she moved to the USA from Poland as a child, she was shocked at how little a student her age was expected to know of mathematics. Then again, this was California public school, where the students (I AM NOT KIDDING) learned Michael Jackson lyrics in English class. This was in Pittsburgh, California. (My HIGH SCHOOL in Van Nuys, California was little better. Our psychology teacher used "I'M OK, YOU'RE OK" as our psychology textbook. Worse, I went to the monstrosity that is Junior College before transferring to a real school for my BA: in a philosophy class taught by one Dennis Green, there WAS no textbook. No readings at all. No recommended side readings. Only Mr Green talking, and repeating himself. And we could handwrite the paper.)

I actually was in the public school system through elementary school, but didn't go on to gymnazium because I had to start my training for collage in the States.

The training in elementary school was pretty good, but I've heard stories about gymnazium. My friend's physics teacher only gave one quiz for the entire year; he just made up the rest of the grades.

My mom said that they teach math at a faster pace over here. I know nothing about arithmetic in the States, so I must rely on my mother's experience.

 

[jamespowers]

As for the local elementary schools: are you aware that the following utterly insane argument has been made by K-12 teachers?

"If a test produces results in a population which vary according to the race of the test-taker, then that test is inherently racist."

At what degree of insanity have we arrived?

Wonderful. :eusa_doh: :rage: I am aware of the idiocy around here. That's why public edumication ain't working for me.
Better yet, the local school principal said that his school teaches to the lowest common denominator not the highest. Result? Everyone ends up ignorant of any significant topic and is robbed of an education---especially the bored as heck smart children who could be our next generation of engineers. :eusa_doh:
I won't even go into how the same teachers want WAAAAYYYY more money in their new contract---retroactive no less. :eusa_doh: :rage:
Ok, off my fire everyone tomorrow and start rehiring the next day with standards fix for publik edumication.

 

[reetpleat]

Without sounding like a wise guy, hasn't everyone already realized that the quality of education is no longer what it once was? That's a universal given. I'm surprised that anyone is still surprised that the schools' product is lesser educated youth.

Once thing I am sure of is from several of my family having been in various jobs in the educational system is that every school district main office is is the crux of the problem. They've quit putting the students 1st and only strive to squeeze money out of the feds and by hoodwinking citizens to vote for increases in property taxes so they have more money to play with.

Educators instead of business-minded people control things and none have sufficient business skills or even inter-personal skills in most cases. They build dynasties of power that perpetuate the status quo as long as salaries continue to reward simply the degrees gained and not the results in education.

They're so hopelessly disconected from the real world of education floating on bloated salaries that they can't never be in touch with what it would take to actually improve kids' education instead of using smoke and mirrors to create an allusion of improvement.

While I agree that schools are not what they used to be, I might differ a little in my reasons. The demands on a school system are much higher with problem children, violence, and a general disconnect from society by a lot of people.

You may not have considered that closely your comment about schools being controlled by educators instead of business people. Educators have a long history of preserving and educating people with great success. And the past was even more so. I owuld argue the opposite. The intrusion of business minds, beaurocracy and bottom line thinking may be much of what is causing the deterioration of education.

At any rate, I feel that there are two discussions going on her. One is changes in language and the other is a dumbing down of language. 100 years ago the vocabulary and sophistication of your average person was much higher and it was the norm to write and speak in a more sophisticated way. It may be that that is a random conceit, or it may be a sign of higher thinking and respect for the language.

I have no problem with texting and alternate spellings. Your average high schooler knows that c u thr means see you there. I see no reason why a mere communication needs to be spelled out.

But, I do believe that most kids are lacking in their vocabulary and reading comprehension as well as ability to speak eloquently. I think they need to be encouraged or forced to read more as that will improve all three. Ideally, they are instilled with a love of reading, but how do you do that. All you can do is try. I know that my whole family are big readers except for my sister. And we all have very good speaking skills and vocabulary because of it. Except for her. She is very smart, but not so good at expressing herself well or understanding a lot of words I use.

 

[reetpleat]

To illustrate in to day's paper there was an article describing how school districts all over the country were helping the kids cheat to pass proficiency tests so they could keep the money flowing to the ivory towers.:eusa_doh: No kid left behind is a crutch and another excuse to steal money.

I assure you, the educators hate no child left behind. It is a crutch of the politicians to make it look like they are doing something instead of comprehensive reform.

 

[Dr Doran]

While I agree that schools are not what they used to be, I might differ a little in my reasons. The demands on a school system are much higher with problem children, violence, and a general disconnect from society by a lot of people. ... I think they need to be encouraged or forced to read more as that will improve all three. .

At the risk of sounding like a fascist, discipline must be maintained at all costs or else you have nothing.

At the risk of sounding like a fascist, force them to read. The clever and/or submissive ones will like it, the recalcitrant and/or stupid ones will hate it.

 

[Dr Doran]

but didn't go on to gymnazium because I had to start my training for collage in the States..

15 is rather early for college, co nie?

 

[Dr Doran]

Awe man...man o man o man o man. I would say something clever here but that's just like the junior colleges in Iowa. I think some of those kids are lucky to read a newspaper and make any sense of it (which is why, in fact, they don't read newspapers. Why do that when you could read Maxim and look at the pictures?)

I had no bloody idea that other states even HAD junior colleges until recently. I thought it was only a phenomenon in the Land of Second Chances, California (I guess the whole USA is the Land of Second Chances ... my French friends say that in France you have only one chance and you cannot go back to school when you are 50 like you can here).

As for Maxim, wow. I like looking at pretty girls a lot, but reading those articles -- yikes. .... as a joke, I subscribed to FHM before it folded. My IQ was dripdropdripping out of my skull with each issue, which took 15 minutes to read ... Plop plop on the floor. A point with each drop.

 

[GwenLake]

15 is rather early for college, co nie?

Tak, but I needed to start working on my high school credits.

 

[Twitch]

Reetpleat, oh no I realize it's not the teachers. The cux of the problem truly is the district head offices. It is as if they were a parody of the rest of the greedy executives in industry who make the grade with salaries not less than 100 grand a year and much more in many locales. Picture them sitting feet up on their desks smoking cigars and eating caviar like it was a cartoon and you will not be far from the truth.

They re-roof the wrong school building for like $100,000 but no one noticed it was the wrong school slated for demolition. New books lay in the depository unused for years until they are no longer new.

They have propagated so that the districts in Ohio are the same as ones in Texas. The scrambles to spend money before a fiscal year ends or next year they won't get as much. Junkets to other all over the country and beyond paid for by special interests. Nepotism in the extreme.

An you're right, it's not even a discussion that kids lack communication skills. It's just that there is SOOO much waste in school districts,

 

[jamespowers]

At the risk of sounding like a fascist, discipline must be maintained at all costs or else you have nothing.

At the risk of sounding like a fascist, force them to read. The clever and/or submissive ones will like it, the recalcitrant and/or stupid ones will hate it.

Its not fascism---its called learning and discipline. Drill and Kill might be made fun of but our parents learned and so did we. Its only now that they institute stupid "outcome based edumication." :eusa_doh: :rage:

 

[Dr Doran]

Its not fascism---its called learning and discipline. Drill and Kill might be made fun of but our parents learned and so did we. Its only now that they institute stupid "outcome based edumication." :eusa_doh: :rage:

Thank you, I was afraid you'd force me to goose step there for a moment. With a dunce cap.

 

[reetpleat]

I had no bloody idea that other states even HAD junior colleges until recently. I thought it was only a phenomenon in the Land of Second Chances, California (I guess the whole USA is the Land of Second Chances ... my French friends say that in France you have only one chance and you cannot go back to school when you are 50 like you can here).

As for Maxim, wow. I like looking at pretty girls a lot, but reading those articles -- yikes. .... as a joke, I subscribed to FHM before it folded. My IQ was dripdropdripping out of my skull with each issue, which took 15 minutes to read ... Plop plop on the floor. A point with each drop.

Don't know about CA, but Seattle has a number of great community colleges. Many are feeders to the UW or other colleges. Many of the teachers have more out in the world experience, and many teachers ae quite knowledgeable and skilled. Besides that, large colleges often offer classes taught by undergrads who may be great, but are no more experienced than community college teachers. Also, it is nice to be in classes with some older people with world experience instead of just a bunch of kids, expecially people who are making a great effort to be there. Many more interesting discussions. Lastly, when I was a scheduling counselor for one for a summer, the statistic I heard was the drop out rate of cc students at the U was lower than the drop out rate of students who started at the U.

I have atteneded UW and Seattle University and was not always that impressed wiht the education I got there. One of the best teachers I had wa at cc. He was very knowledgeable, but moreso, was able to actually share his love and enthusiasm for astronomy. Quite infectious.

Maybe we are just lucky with ours here.

As for Maxim, maybe most of it is kind of dumb. But some of those article are written by skilled professional free lance writers and can be pretty funny. I don't always have the energy or time to read the NEw Yorker. Am I the only one who likes Newyorker articles for about two pages, thinking I have really gotten the jist of the article, then flips back to discover ten more pages of it and never get around to finishing?

 

[reetpleat]

Thank you, I was afraid you'd force me to goose step there for a moment. With a dunce cap.

I guess when I say force, I mean for example, my friend actually setting aside the half hour of reading time per night for her son that his teacher recommends.

I mean, he might not like it, but at least he will get the practice. I doubt that that will somehow make him hate reading if he doesn't already. If he isn't reading he obviously doesn't like it much, so at least getting him in the habit, or at least getting him to do it.