USAF N-3B parkas - Let's talk about them!!

[Cocker]

I'm not even that certain that people will see something else thank a blue or sage green bomber jacket. What I'm fairly sure of is that the details will be lost on most.

 

[Doctor Damage]

FWIW, with the Silvermans jacket, I've been out for an hour at a tme in some fairly heavy rain n it. I wouldn't say it was waterproof (there are other ones they do, in a higher price bracket, which do have a waterproof liner - those are under the GTH brand (a Silverman's house brand), but expect to pay mored for them, around the same price as an Alpha), but mine doescope well with the rain and I certainly haven't eer been spaked through or gotten wet at all under it in those conditions.

Let's remember these parkas were designed by the USAF for use by airmen/aircrew in North America winter conditions. That means cold and snow. Not UK-style rain and damp. I would never wear a nylon flight jacket in the UK, to be honest.

 

[Doctor Damage]

What I'm fairly sure of is that the details will be lost on most.

What I'm fairly sure of is that the details don't matter that much, except to the zipper fetishists and hardware queens. The whole Buzz thing is really a joke in many ways, since they miss the whole point by perfecting mass produced utility clothing.

 

[Edward]

Let's remember these parkas were designed by the USAF for use by airmen/aircrew in North America winter conditions. That means cold and snow. Not UK-style rain and damp. I would never wear a nylon flight jacket in the UK, to be honest.

It's a fair point that they were designed for snow rather than rain - though, as stated, I've always found mine performed well in wet Winter London, and in the north of Ireland on Christmas visits there too.

What I'm fairly sure of is that the details don't matter that much, except to the zipper fetishists and hardware queens. The whole Buzz thing is really a joke in many ways, since they miss the whole point by perfecting mass produced utility clothing.

Really depends what you're after. Certainly there's an argument that the cheap and effective mass-market types are truer to the spirit of the military original than an expensive, perfect repro. On the other hand, if what the buyer values is that it is the same as the original in all the details, then those details do matter. Undoubtedly, the Buzzes and the more expensive Japanese repros are better quality jackets than the mass market cheap ones; whether that qualitative improvement is worth the additionsal cost is, of course, entirely a subjective judgement.

 

[MeachamLake]

I just wish Alpha would do a line of jackets to original milspec - or at least to the standard of the ones they made in the 1990s Replica Series. I fidn the quality of what they put out now pretty good, overall - just a shame when certain details are "wrong".

FWIW, with the Silvermans jacket, I've been out for an hour at a tme in some fairly heavy rain n it. I wouldn't say it was waterproof (there are other ones they do, in a higher price bracket, which do have a waterproof liner - those are under the GTH brand (a Silverman's house brand), but expect to pay mored for them, around the same price as an Alpha), but mine doescope well with the rain and I certainly haven't eer been spaked through or gotten wet at all under it in those conditions.

Rothco sound interesting; I've neer seen anything in the UK other than their MA1s. Am tempted by their MA1 if I can find one to try one and see in person.

Agree regarding Alpha. I saw their stuff in Selfridges Manchester a few weeks back and it seemed pretty well made stuff, but with very little historical attention to detail which was a shame. Clearly more aimed at the "hip hop kidz" than people like us! I guess they know their market well enough.

I've ordered the Silvermans jacket in green, chose size XL on their recommendation to my measurements. Should arrive soon - which is good, since it's currently -3 outside!

 

[MeachamLake]

Silverman's jacket arrived this morning (now that's quick shipping!). For £49.99, it's a damn fine jacket indeed. Sizing in an XL fits me perfectly, even at 6 foot 3. Sleeve length is spot on. The orange lining is my only point of contention really...not sure how I feel about it. It's not a total deal breaker, but I would prefer it without!

I've been looking at vintage originals but it seems like they were made with really short sleeves by modern parka standards - the Silverman's measures around 22.5 inches from underarm to cuff. Originals in a size large only measure 18/19 inches! Can anybody confirm this? I'm 6 foot 3 and I don't really know if I'd stand a chance with an original if this is true.

 

[Big J]

@MeachamLake, I'm glad to hear that worked out for you! Got any pics?

I actually went to the Silvermans 'store' (more of a desk at the warehouse reception) about a million years ago and bought my first pair of Danner Olympia boots for my first U.K. winter there! Happy days.

I think that because these coats have raglan style sleeves, sleeve length measurements are almost always unreliable. In addition, I find that chest measurements are always tag bigger than the tag size to fit over other clothing. These coats can be pretty had to get right from coat measurements alone.

 

[MeachamLake]

Sure, @Big J, here's some pics!

The lining is very orange as you can see in the photo...although it's covered up most of the time.

 

[MeachamLake]

Just as an update, I've taken a punt on an N-3A from a vintage seller to see how that compares. I'll decide which to keep when it arrives!

 

[Edward]

@MeachamLakeI actually went to the Silvermans 'store' (more of a desk at the warehouse reception) about a million years ago and bought my first pair of Danner Olympia boots for my first U.K. winter there! Happy days.

It's a fun place. A coupel of years ago, they opened a new, separate storefront on the Mile End Road, just round the corner: the original place is purely for storage now.

Sure, @Big J, here's some pics!

The lining is very orange as you can see in the photo...although it's covered up most of the time.

Looks good; same as mine. I considered the black one, but at the time, needing a cheap coat to get me through that Winter, opted for the green so I could wear it with both brown and black accoutrements. It obviously takes its nod from the many, many civilian imitations of the N3B which were big in mainstream fashion in the UK through the 70s and early 80s. These days in some circles they're more associated with Feargal Sharkey than the USAF. As to why the civvy ones had the orange, I don't know.... maybe they were capitalising on the popularity of the MA1, which at the time also had an orange liner (as per military spec from c.1960)? Gret coat, though. What's your impression on its effectiveness? I find it about on a par with the MA1, though warmer owing to the longer length.

 

[MeachamLake]

It's a fun place. A coupel of years ago, they opened a new, separate storefront on the Mile End Road, just round the corner: the original place is purely for storage now.



Looks good; same as mine. I considered the black one, but at the time, needing a cheap coat to get me through that Winter, opted for the green so I could wear it with both brown and black accoutrements. It obviously takes its nod from the many, many civilian imitations of the N3B which were big in mainstream fashion in the UK through the 70s and early 80s. These days in some circles they're more associated with Feargal Sharkey than the USAF. As to why the civvy ones had the orange, I don't know.... maybe they were capitalising on the popularity of the MA1, which at the time also had an orange liner (as per military spec from c.1960)? Gret coat, though. What's your impression on its effectiveness? I find it about on a par with the MA1, though warmer owing to the longer length.

Thanks Edward! I think both the black and green ones are fine colours for general wear. Comparing the details of the Silverman's and the Alpha Slim N3-B, you can see that they've basically ripped the design of the Alpha off completely - right down the rubber details on the pocket corners and pull tab, and the positioning of the popper stud at the bottom of the windflap. In these terms, it's remarkable value for money at 1/3 of the price!

It's not the warmest jacket in the world, if I'm honest...but then again, I've read that the originals are so warm that they're borderline unusable. So maybe there's a sweet spot. I'll report back when I recieve the original N3-B jacket I've ordered, although I'm expecting it won't be a good fit on me. Still, worth a shot.

I'm kind of baffled that nobody has attempted a mid market repro of these jackets - it's a bit of a shame. It would be nice to have the correct details - replica label, oxygen tab, real fur trim, USAF shoulder insignia - without spending a fortune on a Japanese repro that is nigh on impossible to obtain.

 

[Edward]

Thanks Edward! I think both the black and green ones are fine colours for general wear. Comparing the details of the Silverman's and the Alpha Slim N3-B, you can see that they've basically ripped the design of the Alpha off completely - right down the rubber details on the pocket corners and pull tab, and the positioning of the popper stud at the bottom of the windflap. In these terms, it's remarkable value for money at 1/3 of the price!

Yes, I would suspect that the Alpha was probably the start point there! It would be interesting to compare them for warmth.

It's not the warmest jacket in the world, if I'm honest...but then again, I've read that the originals are so warm that they're borderline unusable. So maybe there's a sweet spot. I'll report back when I recieve the original N3-B jacket I've ordered, although I'm expecting it won't be a good fit on me. Still, worth a shot.

I've found mine very effective in the last few UK Winters (including stints in Northern Ireland), but yes, I suspect it's less heavy than the original. Mine is about the same as an MA1, whereas I would have assumed an original would be closer the same as the N3A, which was markedly heavier. I would certainly still consider an original at some point if I find one - though probaBLY an N3B first. My holy grail would be an N2A, but those have shot up in price. Not sure of the weight of the Alphaversion, though it does look nice.

I'm kind of baffled that nobody has attempted a mid market repro of these jackets - it's a bit of a shame. It would be nice to have the correct details - replica label, oxygen tab, real fur trim, USAF shoulder insignia - without spending a fortune on a Japanese repro that is nigh on impossible to obtain.

I suspect it's simply a lack of demand. Everybosy wants the WW2 jackets because they're associated with being heroic and sexy and all that; less obvious stuff not associated with the Mythical Heroes, Cowboys and Indians type portrayal of Ww2 in cinema don't get a look in. Not even Steve Macqueen has given the MA1 the same level of demand as the A2It's not only a nylon / leather thing: a few folks have asked Ken at Aero over the years who he hasn't done a B2 - the answer is, I'm told, always that there just isn't enough of a market for it. Not a WW2 period jacket....

 

[MeachamLake]

Yes, I would suspect that the Alpha was probably the start point there! It would be interesting to compare them for warmth.

I've found mine very effective in the last few UK Winters (including stints in Northern Ireland), but yes, I suspect it's less heavy than the original. Mine is about the same as an MA1, whereas I would have assumed an original would be closer the same as the N3A, which was markedly heavier. I would certainly still consider an original at some point if I find one - though probaBLY an N3B first. My holy grail would be an N2A, but those have shot up in price. Not sure of the weight of the Alphaversion, though it does look nice.

I suspect it's simply a lack of demand. Everybosy wants the WW2 jackets because they're associated with being heroic and sexy and all that; less obvious stuff not associated with the Mythical Heroes, Cowboys and Indians type portrayal of Ww2 in cinema don't get a look in. Not even Steve Macqueen has given the MA1 the same level of demand as the A2It's not only a nylon / leather thing: a few folks have asked Ken at Aero over the years who he hasn't done a B2 - the answer is, I'm told, always that there just isn't enough of a market for it. Not a WW2 period jacket....

Well the store I bought the original one from has just messaged me to say that the item I purchased had actually been sold a few days ago, so no jacket for me! Oh well.

I guess you're right. I would have thought that the current trend and demand for Canada Goose / Moncler stuff might have led to a revival of interest in original parkas, but it seems that Alpha is probably the peak of this trend in terms of authenticity.

Here's two jackets I've found that are quite interesting though.

William Gibson N3-B Buzz Rickson - I'm not usually a fan of these WG Black collection jackets, but I'll be damned if this doesn't look cool. The black fur looks awesome...don't ask me why, but I could see James Bond wearing something like this on some secret mission to Siberia! Wouldn't be the best camouflage in the snow though...

https://www.historypreservation.com...gibson-n-3b-flying-jacket-tailored-cut-black/

Second is the Alpha N3-B Barricade with a real fox fur hood trim, but let down by the strange addition of lower handwarmer pockets...why?! Other than that, this looks like a very nice jacket.

http://www.alphaindustries.com/fall-winter-2017/alpha-industries-n-3b-barricade.htm

 

[Grayland]

Wore my Spiewak Golden Fleece N-3B today as it was close to 0 with the wind chill. Did the job!

 

[bn1966]

My N-2A is my favourite, had an N-3A but found no use for it as it was TOO warm

 

[MeachamLake]

Well, I decided to return the Silverman's jacket. Whilst it was nice, I found the orange lining to just not be to my taste - I've never found it a good look even on historically accurate jackets. I also didn't find the jacket warm enough to justify keeping, particularly since I've got other jackets on the way.

On that note, I am in the process of purchasing another N3-B from elsewhere...it's not vintage and not a high end repro either. I'll let you know what it is and post more details when it arrives!

 

[MeachamLake]

A quick update on my now frankly ridiculous N3B journey...

I found a pretty sweet Avirex Japan N3B for sale via Rakuten. There's quite a lot of cool stuff on there - including both real and faux fur versions of the N3B. I did place an order for an Avirex one, but communication and processing was sloooooow, and they sold out of jackets before I could even get a payment link. Oh well.

I then tried a Teesar Mil Tec N3B from an eBay store. Only cost me around £60. Sage green, nylon, pretty decent value. Sadly the size XL was just too big and they'd sold out of size large, so back it went. Nice jacket for the money though if you're interested in the style.

I then sourced a simply superb condition original Skyline 1960 N3B from eBay. This thing was incredible...almost as if it had been barely worn. Sadly I discovered the problem with original N3B jackets...the sizing. I went for an XL and this thing was probably two sizes too big. Even a large would have been roomy on me. It was absolutely enormous. I have since sold that one on to someone else...

Finally, to the present. I've just placed an order for another N3B. I won't give much away at this stage, but it's black and it's Japanese. I'll check back in a couple of weeks to show you more...!

 

[bla-ake]

I've been taking a look at Greenbrier N-3Bs on ebay and I've noticed that some of them don't have the MIL-J-6279 on the tag?
Is there any reason why they wouldn't (such as made for civilian contracts?)

 

[Doctor Damage]

I've been taking a look at Greenbrier N-3Bs on ebay and I've noticed that some of them don't have the MIL-J-6279 on the tag?
Is there any reason why they wouldn't (such as made for civilian contracts?)

Post a link to a listing so we can take a look.

 

[bla-ake]

Post a link to a listing so we can take a look.

Thanks for taking a look by the way.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Military-N...s-Medium-Greenbrier-Jacket-Coat-/162774632134
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Greenbrier-Industries-Inc-N-3B-Cold-Weather-Parka-/131973782507