Thinking of buying my first schott, what do you guys think of it?

[Bfd70]

I love my Schott 618. I use it on my motorcycle, and it works great. I have it in steer and horse and different sizes as my weight fluctuates.

All I have to say about Monitor's comment is: there are numerous complaints about Aero zipper failures on this forum, haven't heard of any Schott zipper failures in newer jackets.

Horse and steer different sizes! Disco!
Thats like my dream. 1 jacket 4 ways. I might just go buy a lottery ticket.

 

[roadking04]

Horse and steer different sizes! Disco!

Lol. I started with a 48 horsehide. Lost some weight and got a 46 horsehide. Lost some more weight and bought a 44 steerhide. I gave the 48 to my dad, I hope I never "grow" back into a 48 again. I am keeping the 46, "just in case".

I used to work out, injured my shoulders and had to quit lifting. I lost a bunch of muscle and gained a big gut. lol. Trying to lose the gut somewhat and keep it off. Easier said than done.

Seeing you and Viking in your 118s has me thinking about one of those also. So I am still missing the cow. lol.

 

[Aloysius]

To clarify, I am saying it is not made for the Japanese market therefore I would not use the term "Japanese" cut. It is made for a worldwide fashion/street brands available at their worldwide stores. I have no idea what cut that is as I have not gone and looked at the measurement. All I know from the photos is that they are slim straight just as I figure Stussy a street brand would choose. It is just my preference to avoid the term "Japanese" cut to describe any type of trim cut because these are not Japanese brands.

It’s a cut that was developed by Schott Japan for JDM models. That’s what makes it “Japanese”. Even the tag at the collar is the Schott Japan tag. Occasionally, other stores (or even Schott itself) will sell a JDM model elsewhere, but they were developed as JDM.

I’m not using “Japanese” as shorthand for skinny fit–if anything the wave for the past couple of years in Japan has been toward oversize with drop shoulders.

 

[Bfd70]

Lol. I started with a 48 horsehide. Lost some weight and got a 46 horsehide. Lost some more weight and bought a 44 steerhide. I gave the 48 to my dad, I hope I never "grow" back into a 48 again. I am keeping the 46, "just in case".

I used to work out, injured my shoulders and had to quit lifting. I lost a bunch of muscle and gained a big gut. lol. Trying to lose the gut somewhat and keep it off. Easier said than done.

Seeing you and Viking in your 118s has me thinking about one of those also. So I am still missing the cow. lol.

118 provides for the middle aged figure perfectly.

 

[Viking752]

118 provides for the middle aged figure perfectly.

well said

 

[Carlos840]

118 provides for the middle aged figure perfectly.

As i like to say, "Harley Davidson Santa" is the target body for most Schott patterns:

 

[Bfd70]

It could be said that some other makers are cutting patterns to look like Xmen comic book heroes.

 

[Bfd70]

As i like to say, "Harley Davidson Santa" is the target body for most Schott patterns:

Here is there 118 which is supposedly the most boxy.

 

[Viking752]

Here is there 118 which is supposedly the most boxy.
View attachment 458301

My 118 is not quite as fitted.

 

[Aloysius]

Here is there 118 which is supposedly the most boxy.
View attachment 458301

118 and 618 have the same pattern, just labeled one off (118 in 38 is 618 in 40).

People here talk a lot about Schott’s having a small, beer belly drop but the drop is 4-5 inches, which is the same as the Aero Ridley, which everyone considers slim. I don’t get it.

 

[Canuck Panda]

People here talk a lot about Schott’s having a small, beer belly drop but the drop is 4-5 inches, which is the same as the Aero Ridley, which everyone considers slim. I don’t get it.

EDITED

^^^ This.

The only thing I want to add is that (Schott) the S/M/L/XL tag ones seems to follow the US suit sizings, and the 38/40/42/44 tag ones seems to follow the European suit sizings, SLIMMER which is actually one size OR TWO smaller than the US suit sizes, except UK and Canada, we the same as US sizing. This is where I think people get confused.

The Japanese actually follows the European suit sizes in my experience. So it will fit just fine, regardless how you're built, as long as you can find the corresponding EU suit sizes in Japan, which is hard because they only stock up to 42 most of the time, 44 is difficult to find.
JAPANESE 42 = EU 50 or 52 depending on brands = US 39 really, or a slim US 40

A size 42 is actually 42" around the sweep, not the chest. And depending on the cut, the chest can ease from +2" to +6" (22" P2P to 24" P2P) depending on how low the arm hole is and what the design was meant to look like. The high arm hole ones will run with the tighter chest ease and the low arm hole ones will run with the bigger chest ease.

The older we get, we tend need bigger sizes because our belly gets bigger. Some lucky few are exempt but for 95% of us, this is just normal part of life. Staying active and healthy is good enough for me.

US/Canada/UK Medium is a 40, which will equate to EU 51 actually in my experience.

Typical EU suit size vs typical US suit size. Will vary between brands of course but gives an idea:
Boss suits

Brook Brothers suits

 

[Marc mndt]

The only thing I want to add is that (Schott) the S/M/L/XL tag ones seems to follow the US suit sizings, and the 38/40/42/44 tag ones seems to follow the European suit sizings, which is actually one size smaller than the US suit sizes, except UK and Canada, we the same as US sizing.

38/40/42/44 are not European suit sizes.

48/50/52/54 are the corresponding EU sizes

 

[roadking04]

118 and 618 have the same pattern, just labeled one off (118 in 38 is 618 in 40).

I thought the 118 was an inch longer in the body also???

 

[Canuck Panda]

38/40/42/44 are not European suit sizes.

48/50/52/54 are the corresponding EU sizes

My bad. I forgot about Italian sizing. Was so used to use the UK for EU too. I'll edit my post about suit sizing above.

I was trying to re-assure the OP if he can just find out what size it was based on (EU=Japan, UK=US=Canada), and use his suit size he will be able to fit into the jacket he wants. There are a lot of different ways to measure a garment and everyone will do it differently. With the big brands, tag size is always my go to unless they have zero quality control. Schott is not that bad in quality control no matter what people claim. The leather isn't so exciting but the quality isn't bad.

 

[TheDonEffect]

Man that's a sweet jacket, didn't know I could buy something like off the rack, lol. If it fits, and you like the way it looks on you, I'd say go for it. Regarding leather quality, lots of jackets that actually get used for more than posing on social media have uniform or smooth grain, but have saved people's lives in actual bike crashes and such. I don't think the texture is a representation of quality from a practical sense, grain is more for character/personality.

Like high end raw denim is supposed to be rugged and high quality, but many high end denim jeans fall apart if you wash them in a washing machine, meanwhile a $15 pair will get tossed in the washer week after week and hold up.

 

[Aloysius]

The only thing I want to add is that (Schott) the S/M/L/XL tag ones seems to follow the US suit sizings, and the 38/40/42/44 tag ones seems to follow the European suit sizings, SLIMMER which is actually one size OR TWO smaller than the US suit sizes, except UK and Canada, we the same as US sizing. This is where I think people get confused.

The Japanese actually follows the European suit sizes in my experience. So it will fit just fine, regardless how you're built, as long as you can find the corresponding EU suit sizes in Japan, which is hard because they only stock up to 42 most of the time, 44 is difficult to find.
JAPANESE 42 = EU 50 or 52 depending on brands = US 39 really, or a slim US 40

I see where you’re coming from, but this is incorrect.

The S/M/L sized Schotts aren’t just of one type. The specific sizes can vary dramatically, depending on the pattern of the model in question (which isn’t always easy to determine.) The 519, for instance, is the same pattern as the 613S; its M = 40, its L = 42 etc. The PER70 is similar in this respect, though it’s not the same pattern. The 626, on the other hand is a different cut entirely; it’s slim-straight, rather than tapered, and runs smaller in addition to fitting very differently.

Likewise, number-sized Schotts are not all the same. The jackets that have the stiff, coated hides–those that start with a 6— (613, 618, 613S(H), 618HH, 613H, 641) run one size smaller than tagged. Some people might get away with wearing their chest measure as the size, but for many, shoulder width will prevent that. This was the case for me.

The corresponding jackets in naked cowhide are sized according to the wearer’s size, so a 40 is for a 40, etc. These are heavier, though they are far softer and don’t require much break in. The naked cowhide is like a particularly plump goatskin, almost. If you lay a size 40 641 next to a size 38 141, you’re looking at the same jacket in different leathers. Likewise with 618 vs 118 except in that case the naked cowhide model gets a snap to hold the buckle in place, and is slightly longer.

Japanese size can mean a lot of different things. I was specifically talking about Schott Japan’s JDM jackets, which have a severe reverse vanity sizing where you could size up two sizes (compared to the size that matches your chest measure) and it will still probably not fit. Not all Schott jackets sold in Japan are on this pattern; likewise, as I was saying earlier, sometimes Schott Japan jackets will be sold in other countries. This happened with the 613US for a Fourth of July event, for instance.

Likewise, I have products from other Japanese brands that are labeled 44 and measure 20 across, things like that. But this isn’t universal. Buzz Rickson’s and Sugar Cane are true to size, when they use numbered sizing, and even their alpha sizing isn’t drastically different. In their case I think this comes out of fidelity to the American originals.

If anything, the prevailing cut in Japanese fashion right now is for severe oversizing and drop shoulders. The shrunken reverse vanity size products are a holdover and might well fade away.

N.b. there isn’t a single Euro sizing when it comes to tailoring. Different tailors and companies will fit differently, but something that fits well (rather than a 2010s skinny cut trend) will correspond to the Anglo tailoring size, just +10. The skintight shrunken-suit look is wrong according to any traditional tailoring–and sizing up such a suit still won’t get you a normal fit. I have plenty of jackets and coats from Italian tailoring houses that fit exactly like their corresponding Anglo size.

I thought the 118 was an inch longer in the body also???

It’s slightly longer and it has the buckle snap. But the pattern is otherwise identical (confirmed by Schott) to the 618.

 

[Guppy]

Really insightful, I didn’t realise this forum had shifted its perspective on Schott

It's all subjective. I still hold Aero in higher regard overall, but they're really two different companies doing different things. There's some overlap, of course.

Aero make reproductions of classic patterns, pre-1960, at premium quality, one at a time, by craftsmen and women who do it all from start to finish.

Schott make a great jacket, in a range of styles that are more contemporary than Aero's offerings. Schott perfecto motorcycle jackets are steeped in tradition, but are not reproductions; rather they are a continuous evolution from 1928 to to the present day. Schott jackets are mass produced, and most of the production is not customizable to the extent that Aero can offer on every order. But if you want to do a custom order with Schott, I believe you can.

I think that rankings and tiers are useful to a degree when comparing and contrasting the different makers. But they're the beginning of the story, not the final word.

It can take a long time to find the perfect jacket for you, but I think the happiest people are the ones who just fell in love with the jacket they happened to have, before scouring the earth and doing exhaustive research to come up with a theory of the ideal leather jacket, and then quest endlessly looking for a maker capable of building it.

Honestly, if my first motorcycle jacket hadn't been lost/stolen at a bar a dozen years ago, I'd probably still be wearing it, loving it, and wouldn't have ever thought about it enough to find a community like this, and I'd have so much more money in my bank account. I spent ten minutes talking to the guy who made it at a bike show, and apart from seeing the style on other people and wishing I could find one just like it, I did absolutely no research, and it wasn't custom made for me, but it fit perfectly.

It was a homerun in my first at bat, and I have never been able to replicate it, even if I have come close several times, and exceeded it many times over. I paid $225 for it in 2002. The more I searched for its replacement, the more I learned, the more discriminating my taste became, and the less satisfied I was with each thing I tried. Even though I now have dozens of jackets that I absolutely love, nothing can quite equal that one I lost. It's become like a legend now. Even if I found it again, it wouldn't be able to compare to what it's become in my mind.

 

[Carlos840]

118 and 618 have the same pattern, just labeled one off (118 in 38 is 618 in 40).

People here talk a lot about Schott’s having a small, beer belly drop but the drop is 4-5 inches, which is the same as the Aero Ridley, which everyone considers slim. I don’t get it.

My Schott 644 (same pattern as 641 different label) size 42 has a 23.5" pit to pit and had a 22" bottom hem before i had it tailored, that's an inch and a half inch drop, not what i would call V shaped...

With a 42" chest an 33" pants verry little in the Schott range fits me....

 

[newtojackets]

It's all subjective. I still hold Aero in higher regard overall, but they're really two different companies doing different things. There's some overlap, of course.

Aero make reproductions of classic patterns, pre-1960, at premium quality, one at a time, by craftsmen and women who do it all from start to finish.

Schott make a great jacket, in a range of styles that are more contemporary than Aero's offerings. Schott perfecto motorcycle jackets are steeped in tradition, but are not reproductions; rather they are a continuous evolution from 1928 to to the present day. Schott jackets are mass produced, and most of the production is not customizable to the extent that Aero can offer on every order. But if you want to do a custom order with Schott, I believe you can.

I think that rankings and tiers are useful to a degree when comparing and contrasting the different makers. But they're the beginning of the story, not the final word.

It can take a long time to find the perfect jacket for you, but I think the happiest people are the ones who just fell in love with the jacket they happened to have, before scouring the earth and doing exhaustive research to come up with a theory of the ideal leather jacket, and then quest endlessly looking for a maker capable of building it.

Honestly, if my first motorcycle jacket hadn't been lost/stolen at a bar a dozen years ago, I'd probably still be wearing it, loving it, and wouldn't have ever thought about it enough to find a community like this, and I'd have so much more money in my bank account. I spent ten minutes talking to the guy who made it at a bike show, and apart from seeing the style on other people and wishing I could find one just like it, I did absolutely no research, and it wasn't custom made for me, but it fit perfectly.

It was a homerun in my first at bat, and I have never been able to replicate it, even if I have come close several times, and exceeded it many times over. I paid $225 for it in 2002. The more I searched for its replacement, the more I learned, the more discriminating my taste became, and the less satisfied I was with each thing I tried. Even though I now have dozens of jackets that I absolutely love, nothing can quite equal that one I lost. It's become like a legend now. Even if I found it again, it wouldn't be able to compare to what it's become in my mind.

Completely understood! I was perfectly content with my lambskin fashion jackets until I found this forum

 

[Monitor]

@Guppy makes a great point, as always, but while you might luck out with your first leather jacket, especially if it is a
hand-me-down from when things used to be better made, bad lambskin jackets is what got me into this rabbit hole. Trying on leather jackets at shopping malls, I quickly realized that this just can't be it. . .