Theoretically speaking...

[Senator Jack]

Posted by Marc C: They didn't invent either one, but they certainly latched onto both and found ways to market them. Punk fashion didn't enter the mainstream until big designers started adding 'punk' details to their clothes lines.

I seem to recall Bloomingdale's sold gold safety-pin earrings as early as 1978. Couldn't tell you the gender or sexual preference of that certain buyer, however. As for body modifications, I started spotting the obvious ones during my hardcore days which was long before the gay community latched on to it.

Not trying to take away from, or knock, the community and its contributions - but I think the claim that all style and fashion was borne from it is like claiming every genre of rock and roll was invented by black musicians. To do so would take away from the likes of Dick Dale, Black Sabbath, Iggy Pop, The New York Dolls, The Ramones, and just about every group that played along the Mersey River.


What a turn this thread has taken. And here I thought the picture was about Marion Crane and the stolen money.

Regards,

Senator Jack

 

[Marc Chevalier]

As for body modifications, I started spotting the obvious ones during my hardcore days which was long before the gay community latched on to it.

I believe you. It's not that the gay community invents all or even some of this stuff; it's that they adopt and promote it early on, and from there it flows into the mainstream.

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[Jovan]

This thread has taken a strange turn.

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Old tailors say, "The longer the thread, the more likely it'll tangle."

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[jamespowers]

Because any interest in fashion was seen as "sissy." Some examples of so-called "sissiness": business shirts without ties in the summer, and hatlessness.


In the same vein, Mrs. Hawes points out that a generation earlier, cigarettes were considered to be "sissy" for men.

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I can agree with the edited part.

Regards,

J

 

[Marc Chevalier]

I can agree with the edited part.

This is what the author meant by "ventilated shoes in the summer":

 

[Fletch]

Red ties and wristwatches were That Way till WW1.

Brown suede shoes were supposedly a reliable gay code signal at some place/time or another.

 

[jamespowers]

This is what the author meant by "ventilated shoes in the summer":

Oh, I thought she meant the cloth mesh kind. Then I agree with that too.

Regards,

J

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Oh, I thought she meant the cloth mesh kind.

Yeah, she meant the mesh kind, too. And she mentions sandals (which the Duke of Windsor favored in the French Riviera.)

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[Baron Kurtz]

funnily enough the mesh spectators were just a decade or so away from full acceptance by the 50s yoof.

bk

 

[jamespowers]

Yeah, she meant the mesh kind, too. And she mentions sandals (which the Duke of Windsor favored in the French Riviera.)

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I can't agree with the mesh but I can agree with sandals. You'll never see that on my feet. Reminds me too much of flip flops :eusa_doh:

Regards,

J

 

[jamespowers]

funnily enough the mesh spectators were just a decade or so away from full acceptance by the 50s yoof.

bk

I like the way they look now. I probably would have then.

 

[Tomasso]

Men's fashion trends follow gay men ... and it is fashion-conscious women, the media, and the stores that convince straight men to 'catch up.'


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I would say gay and black men. A friend (SWM) of mine, who owned a Versace Boutique in the 80-90's, would joke that he wasn't gay or black enough to wear most of the stuff he sold.

 

[Jovan]

I assure you, that doesn't stop some people.

 

[jamespowers]

I assure you, that doesn't stop some people.

lol lol lol lol lol I think I have seen them.

 

[Jovan]

My point is that gay, black, or straight, some things will always look tacky. The exception is of course such details as what colour shirt (pale yellow looks great on black men) etc.

 

[dhermann1]

Hueraches

For years when I was growing up my mother would tell me to get hueraches, they were so comfortable, etc., etc. They were big when she was young in the '40s. Now I wish I could find them! (Actually, I just Googled them and voila!)

 

[reetpleat]

I seem to recall Bloomingdale's sold gold safety-pin earrings as early as 1978. Couldn't tell you the gender or sexual preference of that certain buyer, however. As for body modifications, I started spotting the obvious ones during my hardcore days which was long before the gay community latched on to it.

Not trying to take away from, or knock, the community and its contributions - but I think the claim that all style and fashion was borne from it is like claiming every genre of rock and roll was invented by black musicians. To do so would take away from the likes of Dick Dale, Black Sabbath, Iggy Pop, The New York Dolls, The Ramones, and just about every group that played along the Mersey River.


What a turn this thread has taken. And here I thought the picture was about Marion Crane and the stolen money.


Well, since we are off topic, I will comment on this thread and your comment.

I agree that Gay men are not responsible for all fashion trends. They do tend to be early adopters which helps spread them.

Of course African Americans and to a lesser degree Ltinos and other Minorities are quite creative and also early adopters. And in their case, it is their embracing of a style that helps propel it into the main stream. What I mean is a gay man might wear something and it will be seen, and maybe gay designers, movie people etc help spread it by working it into movies, ads etc. But African Americans, by adopting a certain style will spread it to white youth who adopt it for the fact that it is an AA thing. Whereas straight men do not sport a look trying to look gay, White kids will sport a look trying to emulate their black swing, rock, hip hop heroes.

Of course other trends are spread by heteros, although I tend to think they are the less good ones. Fleece, dockers, etc. Other trends come from Europe and other places. some youth styles come from white rockers as in grunge, heavy metal, punk rock.

But I must comment on the music as well. while the british boys created a new sound, it was very much derived and in homage to american black music. Mersyside, brit blues such as Black Sabbath, the stones, etc, techno, were all derived from American blues and rock of a generation earlier, or in the case of techno, detroit r and b.