The Trials and Tribulations of Hat Stiffener

[Rick Hartigan]

Thanks for your comments and I wear a size 7, which is a bit tight but keeps the wind from blowing it away. The old black hat was a 7 1/8 and I had to put some filler in the sweat band to make it fit right. It actually feel real comfy and, hopefully, with a new sweatband it will be perfect.

Just dropped the hat in the alcohol. I'll report in when finished.

 

[outsidebear]

Have heard of using 1 part shellac/9 parts denatured alcohol. Get the BEST quality of shellac you can obtain. Apply with a spray bottle.
I'm sure individual hatters out there have their 'secret' formula they use. shhh, it's a secret!!!

 

[Doc Glockster]

** Keep reading! I found a great new hat stiffener that I talk about several posts below this one. **


Maybe I'm just using it wrong, but I'm sick of the crappy results with Kahl's hat stiffener.

It seems to work great if a stiff had just needs a boost, but if I have to use a lot of it on an older hat that's gone a little soft I end up with white spots all over the brim. I've been able most of the time to get rid of the white spots with some steam after the fact, but I also recently ruined a sweat band with too much steam trying to get the white spots out!

I recently Googled alternate stiffening methods and this one came up:

http://www.ehow.com/how_8442118_make-own-felt-hat-stiffener.html

I even read a couple of claims in the innernetz that some people are using diluted white glue!

Isn't there one product or one method to re-stiffen a hat that's gone soft?

It seems like there's nothing out there that I can trust.

 

[Joshbru3]

Kahl's woks fine for light stiffening, but its heavily diluted. If you want something a bit stronger...

http://www.hatsupply.com/sizingstiffeners.htm

The felt needs to be "impregnated" with the stiffener for the best results. Its shellac which is diluted with denatured alcohol for the most part (a couple other things i'm sure). Once the alcohol evaporates, it leaves the shellac behind and thats what stiffens your hats. Be careful.....a little goes a long way.

 

[Doc Glockster]

Someone suggested I try a spray shellac like this:

http://www.rustoleum.com/product-ca...sser/interior-wood-finishes/bulls-eye-shellac

Anybody ever try that?

I'm getting just bold enough to try it.

I found an old thread on the subject, and I'm reading it now.

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?55628-Actual-shellac-as-a-hat-stiffener-!-!-!

I'm wondering if the aerosol shellac works better than brushing it on.

I'm reading....I'm reading...

Well, my questions weren't answered.

 

[Doc Glockster]

Wow. An interesting thread on both shellac and hair spray:

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-18346.html

If simple Wal-Mart grade hair spray will work (with the caveat that it has to be reapplied when the hat gets wet), then I'll be one jolly rancher!

There was another thread on hair spray:

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?38485-Hair-Spray-to-Stiffen-Felt/page2

The interesting part in my other link is BAKING the hat after applying hair spray.

Hmmmmm...

I learned a trick from my Drill Sergeants when I was a company commander in the Army. They still "shellacked" hats but they did it with unsented hairspray. Different formula but same result. They would liberally spray thier brown Drill Sgt's hats with cheap hair spray, put them in a wooden form and BAKE THEM IN THE OVEN! They baked them at low temps, about 200 or 250 degrees or so. Their hats were alway crisp and stiff with no sign of anything having been applied to them.

I used the hair spray trick for several years after that to keep my Hardee in good order. A good rain storm will wash both shellac and hair spray out very quickly.

 

[viclip]

Someone suggested I try a spray shellac like this:

http://www.rustoleum.com/product-ca...sser/interior-wood-finishes/bulls-eye-shellac

Anybody ever try that?

I'm getting just bold enough to try it.

I found an old thread on the subject, and I'm reading it now.

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?55628-Actual-shellac-as-a-hat-stiffener-!-!-!

I'm wondering if the aerosol shellac works better than brushing it on.

I'm reading....I'm reading...

Well, my questions weren't answered.

Zinsser's shellac is a great product used by fountain pen restorers in its liquid canned formulation. It's pure shellac diluted with ethyl & isopropyl alcohols.

Do note per the MSDS sheet from the Zinsser (Rustoleum) site that there are additional chemicals contained in the spray can version of their clear shellac. For some reason they don't link the English version, only the French & Spanish versions & since I know nada Espanol here is the ingredient list from the French version:

Éthano
Acétone
Gaz de pétrole liquéfié
Alcool Butylique
Alcool isopropylique

The additional chemicals may or may not be hat friendly esp. to the dye as well as to the pre-existing stiffener & to any water repellent that may have been applied.

Personally I'd want to experiment on a few junkers unless someone can provide assurances as to the safety of the additional chemicals.

 

[Doc Glockster]

The acetone might worry me in a brush-on liquid. In a spray it might just evaporate quickly enough to not matter. It's just nail polish remover after all.

Anyone care to try the aerosol Zinsser's on an old felt hat and post the results?

 

[Joshbru3]

I'm confused, why not use the same stuff that hatters and hat companies have used for generations? Straight shellac like Zinsser's will leave a hat stiff as a board. If you are trying to make helmets, then i'm sure that will work.......just get the colorless version. You can also mix your own shellac with denatured alcohol and shellac flakes. That way you can tweak your mixture. It would seem pointless though because the premixed stiffener already has the ratios figured out.

 

[Doc Glockster]

I'm confused, why not use the same stuff that hatters and hat companies have used for generations? Straight shellac like Zinsser's will leave a hat stiff as a board. If you are trying to make helmets, then i'm sure that will work.......just get the colorless version. You can also mix your own shellac with denatured alcohol and shellac flakes. That way you can tweak your mixture. It would seem pointless though because the premixed stiffener already has the ratios figured out.

I WANT the brim stiff as a board! I want a cowboy hat that will hold up in the rain or sun!

My everyday use hat started as a Stetson Hutchins. The brim was literally as stiff as a piece of wood. I LOVED it. Then weather and wear softened it up enough that now it holds its shape but it's kind of soft. I'd like to restore it to where it was.

 

[WesternHatWearer]

Zinsser's shellac is a great product used by fountain pen restorers in its liquid canned formulation. It's pure shellac diluted with ethyl & isopropyl alcohols.

Do note per the MSDS sheet from the Zinsser (Rustoleum) site that there are additional chemicals contained in the spray can version of their clear shellac. For some reason they don't link the English version, only the French & Spanish versions & since I know nada Espanol here is the ingredient list from the French version:

Éthano
Acétone
Gaz de pétrole liquéfié
Alcool Butylique
Alcool isopropylique

The additional chemicals may or may not be hat friendly esp. to the dye as well as to the pre-existing stiffener & to any water repellent that may have been applied.

Personally I'd want to experiment on a few junkers unless someone can provide assurances as to the safety of the additional chemicals.

Éthano = Ethanol
Acétone = Acetone
Gaz de pétrole liquéfié = Liquefied Petroleum Gas
Alcool Butylique = Butyl Alcohol
Alcool isopropylique = Isopropyl Alcohol

Just incase there was any questions what those are.

 

[WesternHatWearer]

I WANT the brim stiff as a board! I want a cowboy hat that will hold up in the rain or sun!

My everyday use hat started as a Stetson Hutchins. The brim was literally as stiff as a piece of wood. I LOVED it. Then weather and wear softened it up enough that now it holds its shape but it's kind of soft. I'd like to restore it to where it was.

I am also wondering about how best to stiffen a hat, thank you for posting this. I believe I am just going to call Hatco Hats and the person I had make a custom hat for me.

 

[Joshbru3]

I WANT the brim stiff as a board! I want a cowboy hat that will hold up in the rain or sun!

My everyday use hat started as a Stetson Hutchins. The brim was literally as stiff as a piece of wood. I LOVED it. Then weather and wear softened it up enough that now it holds its shape but it's kind of soft. I'd like to restore it to where it was.

Then honestly, get a small can of stiffener from Lesko and apply it to the underside of the brim. It will be very stiff.

 

[viclip]

The acetone might worry me in a brush-on liquid. In a spray it might just evaporate quickly enough to not matter. It's just nail polish remover after all.

Anyone care to try the aerosol Zinsser's on an old felt hat and post the results?

Speaking of acetone, it's also used in fountain pen restoration. Its usage is as a powerful solvent to chemically weld celluloid & other vintage plastic components which are cracked or broken.

 

[Doc Glockster]

Right now I'm searching the net looking for a local retailer that has the Zinsser's Bullseye aerosol in stock. I live near a small town out in the boonies so I may have to order it from Amazon if I decide to nominate myself as the guinea pig.

 

[moehawk]

I have had great results using the Zissner's Bullseye wax-free sanding sealer (just shellac without wax added) diluted 1 part shellac to 3 parts 99 grain ethyl alcohol or 91 grain rubbing alcohol. Spray on lightly and then spritz on straight alcohol to help shellac penetrate deeper into the felt. Works great.

 

[moehawk]

Oh yeah..I just use a regular pump spray bottle like you find in the gardening section of the hardware store.

 

[LuvMyMan]

Maybe I'm just using it wrong, but I'm sick of the crappy results with Kahl's hat stiffener.

It seems to work great if a stiff had just needs a boost, but if I have to use a lot of it on an older hat that's gone a little soft I end up with white spots all over the brim. I've been able most of the time to get rid of the white spots with some steam after the fact, but I also recently ruined a sweat band with too much steam trying to get the white spots out!

I recently Googled alternate stiffening methods and this one came up:

http://www.ehow.com/how_8442118_make-own-felt-hat-stiffener.html

I even read a couple of claims in the innernetz that some people are using diluted white glue!

Isn't there one product or one method to re-stiffen a hat that's gone soft?

It seems like there's nothing out there that I can trust.

The Kahl's should work if you take your time and use it in very thin applications of spray. One hat my Husband owned was a wide brim western stetson, the brim had been soaked while wearing it in the rain, it was a vintage hat and should have been just steamed back into shape, but that was before we knew what we do now. So we purchase one spray bottle of Kahl's and used it on the hat. I am sure it was super thin amounts of spray and there was no problems at all on the felt after being sprayed. However it took about 8 or 10 times using it very carefully and being as stingy with how much was being sprayed at one time.

 

[LuvMyMan]

Wow. An interesting thread on both shellac and hair spray:

http://www.authentic-campaigner.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-18346.html

If simple Wal-Mart grade hair spray will work (with the caveat that it has to be reapplied when the hat gets wet), then I'll be one jolly rancher!

There was another thread on hair spray:

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?38485-Hair-Spray-to-Stiffen-Felt/page2

The interesting part in my other link is BAKING the hat after applying hair spray.

Hmmmmm...

Some hair spray can and will have a "color" to it if you spray it on white paper it can show PINK tint to it...not a lot of tint but some hair spray has that. I would think it wise to not use it.

 

[Doc Glockster]

I took the plunge last night. I went to Home Depot and bought some Zinsser Bullseye clear shellac in the aerosol spray.

In short, I AM COMPLETELY SOLD ON THIS PRODUCT NOW!

BUT

There are some cautions.

I started with my workaday hat: It's a Stetson Hutchins that came from the factory as stiff as cardboard. Over time and many rainstorms, applications of Kahl's hat stiffener, hot sunny days, and just general abuse, it was just stiff enough to hold shape but was covered with white spots. I used to joke that the hat was "made to look like you just rode in off the dusty trail."

ONE pass with the Zinsser restored the hat's stiffness to acceptable and got rid of the Kahl's white spots! Another pass made the hat as stiff as cardboard just like it came from the factory. I am now somewhat suspicious that Stetson actually uses this on their lower priced hats. It sure is interesting that my hat was pretty much restored to its factory feel and look "just like that." I compared the used hat to a near new spare Stetson Hutchins in my closet, and it's amazing how close they are now.

My cautions:

1. The shellac darkens the color somewhat. It doesn't CHANGE the color, but it makes it a noticeably darker shade. I had started out spraying only the brim without removing the hat band. When I removed the hat band it was obvious the brim was a slightly darker shade of the same color. I do not think this was due to the wetness of the product since it dries so quickly. In short, I don't think I would use this on a white hat without testing it on one you can afford to ruin.

2. The spray really brings out the "grain" of the hat. If you are familiar with Stetsons the spray made my wool Hutchins look more grainy like a buffalo felt Austral. I don't mind this since none of my hats are high-end. They are all work hats and the grainy appearance is fine with me.

3. You can reshape the hat somewhat while the product is wet, but I would hesitate to try to shape the hat very much after the product dries for fear of cracking the felt.

4. You have to try your best to spray it evenly. I made a couple of mistakes that left dark spots and for the most part I was able to even out the finish with a hat brush and not affect the new stiffness. The shellac is a lot more forgiving of mistakes than Kahl's hat stiffener, though.

If I were you I would practice on a couple of old hats before applying this to one you really cherish. Having said that, I also would NOT use this product on an expensive dress hat. The results I got with this hat stiffener are just too coarse looking to be appropriate for an expensive "city" hat. It's fine for a work grade cowboy hat.

Long story short: if you wear $300 fedoras out to dinner with the wifey this product will probably yield results too coarse for your expensive high-end hat. If on the other hand you wear a hat for PBR or team roping you will appreciate the quick and definite results of this product.

I will try to come back here and post updates if, for example, the hat turns white in a few weeks, etc., but for now I am absolutely convinced that this product is the way to go for an everyday hat stiffener. NO MORE KAHL'S WHITE SPOTS FOR ME!