The Spanish Civil War

[feltfan]

This may be of interest though!

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article4944902.ece

Interesting! News to me. Thanks for bringing that forward.

 

[carebear]

This may be of interest though!

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle4944902.ece

Interesting! News to me. Thanks for bringing that forward.

Not to sound snarky, but that wouldn't be the first time the British paid Spain for aid against an enemy.

In the Napoleonic era, if not for British subsidies and support, Spain probably would not have resisted France, at least for very long.

Not a slam on the individual bravery or character of the people of Spain, much like the Russians they had been poorly served by their leadership, in about the same way, for a long time.

 

[PabloElFlamenco]

In the Napoleonic era, if not for British subsidies and support, Spain probably would not have resisted France, at least for very long.

Er...carebear, would you agree with me that your have expressed yourself rather poorly?
If my sources are correct, it was the people of Spain who rose up against the pompous arrogant French rulers, killing soldiers whenever they could, wherever they went, in a brutal and bloody exchange of extreme ugly violence. I repeat: the populace; not the rulers, not any "organized spanish forces"...
It is correct, I agree, to state that it was the British force, under Wellington, who entered Spain via Portugal, Ciudad Rodrigo, Salamanca to, at end, chase the main body of the French armed forces back over the Pyrenées, where they belonged and are, still today, at home.
Unfortunately, once the French gone, war in Spain was not over...a succession of "Carlist wars", civil wars within Spain, wreaked very, very substantial havoc. It's a very old and very sad story...

 

[carebear]

Er...carebear, would you agree with me that your have expressed yourself rather poorly?
If my sources are correct, it was the people of Spain who rose up against the pompous arrogant French rulers, killing soldiers whenever they could, wherever they went, in a brutal and bloody exchange of extreme ugly violence. I repeat: the populace; not the rulers, not any "organized spanish forces"...
...

It's a very old and very sad story...

Very poorly indeed apparently. My apologies.

I was trying to differentiate between the people of Spain, whose ferocity and effectiveness in resistence to the French invaders gave us the term "guerilla", and the then monarchy/aristocracy of Spain which was unable to mount an effective conventional resistance (in spite of the oft-demonstrated capability of the individual soldiers) due to the weaknesses inshrined in the system, weaknesses that finally led to the Revolution.

 

[H.Johnson]

For an on-the-ground narrative of this campaign I can recommend 'Rifles' by Mark Urban (Faber and Faber). The subject is, of course, the 95th Regiment of Foot (the 'Green jackets') and Urban (he is actually a BBC news reporter) has done a good job of describing the interaction between the British, French and Spanish irregular forces (all, obviously, from a British perspective) from soldiers' letters home, journals and official accounts. An some interesting information about the often despised Baker rifle. A good read, in my opinion.

 

[filfoster]

Spanish Civil War

This is an awkward fit in the WW2 forum, but I think appropriate for the Lounge because of its romance and place in history and literature. The Spanish Civil War was a 'rehearsal' for many of the combatants in WW2. There are virtually no reenactor uniforms available, especially for the Nationalist forces. Does anyone know where suitable kit can be found?

I have tried La Columna but the uniform purveyor there, an old friend actually, really does not make anything anymore, that I can get out of him.
Ebay seldom has anything and I would prefer new made anyway.
The Loyalist forces had their own uniforms and wore many surplus items from other nations, such as British battledress but can anyone locate a source for Nationalist kit?

 

[carter]

There is an existing on the Spanish Civil War located here:

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?t=10234&highlight=Spanish+Civil+War

 

[Creeping Past]

Spanish civil war re-enacting gear turned up unexpectedly in a thread called "Aero 1930s Halfbelt, just arrived".

 

[BellyTank]

Yes indeed-
one contributor to the thread reenacts the SCW in various impressions.

His name is "Sierra Charriba".

Have a look at his reenactment photos in the thread and probably elsewhere.
He is very resourceful.


B
T

 

[scotrace]

Thanks Carter!! Saved me a little diggin.'

 

[filfoster]

SCW

There is an existing on the Spanish Civil War located here:

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?t=10234&highlight=Spanish+Civil+War

Thanks, great stuff here in the thread you linked.

 

[filfoster]

SCW

Spanish civil war re-enacting gear turned up unexpectedly in a thread called "Aero 1930s Halfbelt, just arrived".

C J Nohai is the reenactor vendor cited. He is the friend I referred to in the original post reference to La Columna. He can make great, accurate stuff but he's not making any Nationalist uniforms and very limited Republican items. I have practically begged him to start this project but it hasn't materialized and I hope he has more lucrative projects. The search continues. I am pleased Jerry Lee's What Price Glory gets another nod. There may be some other nation's uniforms more commonly copied that could be adapted. But the buttons. They are always a problem.

 

[filfoster]

SCW

George Orwell's HOMAGE TO CATALONIA
An essay
http://newcriterion.com/archives/25/02/orwells-catalonia-revisited/

and his book
http://gutenberg.net.au/ebooks02/0201111.txt

I read Orwell's book last summer. A very readable, intimate look at the war and its less glorious aspects.

 

[Lincsong]

Very poorly indeed apparently. My apologies.

I was trying to differentiate between the people of Spain, whose ferocity and effectiveness in resistence to the French invaders gave us the term "guerilla", and the then monarchy/aristocracy of Spain which was unable to mount an effective conventional resistance (in spite of the oft-demonstrated capability of the individual soldiers) due to the weaknesses inshrined in the system, weaknesses that finally led to the Revolution.

Actually, guerilla warfare was first used against the Mohammedan Moors in the 1400's to expel them from the Iberian Peninsula.

 

[Story]

Director Michael Mann to shoot Robert Capa biopic
American director Michael Mann has partnered with Columbia Pictures to film a biopic on celebrated Austrian-Hungarian war photographer Robert Capa, according to entertainment trade publication Variety. Focusing on Capa's two-year romance with renowned Jewish German war photojournalist Gerda Taro during the Spanish Civil War, Waiting for Robert Capa will be adapted from the 2009 novel Esperando a Robert Capa, by Spanish writer Susana Fortes. Mann will reportedly produce and direct the film for a low budget. Public Enemies, directed by Mann this year, grossed over $194 million worldwide.

*
MADRID — A Spanish Civil War-era grave believed to hold the remains of the acclaimed poet Federico Garcia Lorca will be dug up in two to three weeks, an official said Monday, in the most high-profile step yet in a drive for Spain to address atrocities committed against civilians during that ruinous conflict.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jwMqZMBFgUT-1WovIPfURB5871swD9B5288O1

Spain to identify victims in Franco's mausoleum

(AP) – 5 days ago

MADRID — Spain is to identify tens of thousands of victims of the Spanish Civil War buried in the mausoleum of dictator Gen. Francisco Franco.

The government has agreed to complete the census within six months and help with the exhumation of the bodies, if so desired by victims' relatives.

Official estimates put the numbers buried at the Valley of the Fallen near Madrid at some 30,000, although some historians say the figure could be as high as 60,000.

Many of those buried were Franco supporters and were identified. But the majority are believed to be the unidentified bodies of people who fought against Franco in defense of the elected republican government during the 1936-39 war.

Parliament approved the initiative late Wednesday.

*
MOVIES
Spotlight on a Long-Upstaged War
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB20001424052970203917304574412963538827726.html

The politically interested and disinterested suffered terribly, perhaps even equally, in the Spanish Civil War. Orwell, who fought for the Republicans, predicted the war would be "an appalling disaster" regardless of who won. Atrocities were committed by both sides—the bombing of Guernica, the murder of Catholic clergy. But the little guy also had to endure the bitter knowledge that material support was not coming from Western governments that claimed to support democratic ideals. As one of the Abraham Lincoln Brigade veterans in "The Good Fight" says, "You had to ask yourself, What did it mean if you couldn't win the good fight?"

"It's important to look at things like this, to see how they happen," says Ms. Granero, "because we seem to keep making the same mistakes."

 

[cookie]

The present Spanish Government is going on with this way past reconciliation with the past and is disinterring bad memories along with graves if the above by true.

Let them rest in peace. At least they rest in Spanish soil.

The Great Decider will adjudicate the outcome of the Spanish Civil War in his own time.

Franco et al can answer to him for their crimes.

 

[Medvssa]

Not a satisfactory solution for those that don't believe in divine justice, and for those that do but still think we should strive for justice on earth too.
Following that reasoning, we wouldn't have courts of law either. I say better late than never.

And I don't think disinterring bad memories is something to avoid at all costs. Much more dangerous is to forget.

If reconciliation is at all possible, I don't think it should be, or could be, through ignorance, but through knowledge.

At least that is how I see it [huh]

 

[MisterCairo]

This is an awkward fit in the WW2 forum, but I think appropriate for the Lounge because of its romance and place in history and literature. The Spanish Civil War was a 'rehearsal' for many of the combatants in WW2. There are virtually no reenactor uniforms available, especially for the Nationalist forces. Does anyone know where suitable kit can be found?

I have tried La Columna but the uniform purveyor there, an old friend actually, really does not make anything anymore, that I can get out of him.
Ebay seldom has anything and I would prefer new made anyway.
The Loyalist forces had their own uniforms and wore many surplus items from other nations, such as British battledress but can anyone locate a source for Nationalist kit?

fftopic:

I like your avatar!

 

[Creeping Past]

And when coming to terms with the realities of war and its aftermath, past and present, be wary of the long-lasting effects of iconic imagery and its possible use as propaganda.

 

[Sierra Charriba]

Hi again, from Madrid. For what is worth, I post some photos of myself as SCW reenactor (2005-2008). Reenacting of SCW continues here in Spain but, in my opinion, with less success that we hoped in the beginning. To many people, its an "ugly" topic (not for me). Well, now I'm retired as reenactor, but it was a very exciting season in my life, and I keep from those years many friends (and some enemies, of course!).

"War is never glorious; it's never an adventure. War really has the taste of hell"
Harry Fisher, a Lincoln Battalion volunteer.

Salud!