The Real McCoy’s J-100 fit comparison between the old model (BJ9110) and new model (BJ19110)

[Marc Fischetti]

Hi guys,
I recently went on an obsessive journey to get the perfect fit on the beautiful Real McCoys Buco J-100 Shinki horsehide leather jacket and in turn discovered a few things about the various differences in the fits, as well as the quality of leather. I was able to make a direct comparison between the two models (something that is sorely lacking so far on line)
I thought this might at least be a little helpful to anyone confused or even unaware that there are different models and what those differences are. There’s definitely a lot of interest here on the Buco J-100 and I figured this could add to the conversation.
I’ll also post photos of the two models as runwayed by yours truly to emphasize the differences.
Ok, first off, I’m 5ft 8’ and weigh 68kg. I am pretty lean and do work out so I am not a skinny frame, but I’m not super-jacked either (go easy on me I’m 55 so trying to hang in there ) I knew I’d need a size 38 from what I’d seen online.
I live in Monterrey, Mexico which has an extremely hot climate most of the year, however from October through March a jacket with t shirt is perfect. It can get cold so I do layer, but only for a few weeks of the year so I wasn’t looking for that with the J-100. This means I will wear only a t-shirt with the jacket and I also wanted a very fitted look.
At first it may not seem that there’s a lot of difference between the 2 Models but there definitely is. The older model for me was way better. Firstly the grain of the leather is much smoother and a little stiffer which I preferred, the color popped more. The arms are definitely longer and slimmer, even the zips at the wrists are slightly longer than the new model. The front is shorter on the older model and sits better above my hips. The newer model had a larger hem and larger chest (about an inch larger for each). The shoulders are also narrower on the older model, again by around an inch or maybe a little more.
I’d say overall the newer model fits more like a true 38 and is longer, especially at the from for some reason, the upside V at the bottom is longer than on the older model. The new model is also heavier or heftier and is possibly geared more towards a person that actually rides motorcycles, the leather might be a little thicker but I’m not sure. I used to ride but stopped since I moved her in Mexico and I would have definitely used the new model on my bike, the first one not so much.
One final thing that you can see from the pictures, the horizontal seam at the back is more in line with the sleeves seam on the older model, it sits higher on the new model.
They are both amazing jackets but i decided to keep the old model and sell on the new one (the wife threatened to leave me if I kept them both. It was a tough choice ).
Hope this thread is helpful and if not it’s at least a cool story bro as they say.

First 5 pictures are from the old model BJ9110, the last 3 are the new model BJ19110.

 

[Canuck Panda]

both fits you well. congrats. I also would want the old model. they were exact replica of the original 50s J100 just sized down one to two depending on the year of production to fit the Japanese domestic market. The new fit is slim long and is more modern cut but works well with untucked shirts. The old fit has more taper like the original. Old fit leather didn't get softened at the tannery, new fit leather is soften at the tannery because it is easier to wear for most 1st time leather wearers. I too prefer the old fit leather as I like to break things in myself and it is not that stiff to begin with anyways. I had the opportunity recently to pick up another old fit in a rare size but I passed. Now reading this post I wonder if I made the right call...

https://www.instagram.com/reel/ColbPmhLLp0/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

 

[Marc Fischetti]

It’s interesting about the old vs new leather. I did not know that the new one was softened unlike the old but it makes sense now you mention it. The new leather was far softer and shinier but the grain was not so nice, not so smooth. It does seem like they’re going after a larger market and a more commercial fit.
There’s so little information out there on the 2 models and I actually bought the new one first in error not realizing that they had been altered in fit. It wasn’t big on me at all but just didn’t fit me as I was lead to expect then after a little more digging I realized why. I managed to snag each one on eBay at a decent price and hopefully I won’t have too much trouble moving the newer one on.
Thanks for the extra information.

 

[Canuck Panda]

New fit command higher selling prices in Japan. Their customer want the softer easier to wear slim long stuff that they can casually wear modernly with their shirt untucked. I see a lot of old fit J-100 popped up on used market recently. I assume they "upgraded" to the new fit.

 

[Marc Fischetti]

Would you happen to know if the fit of the padded version of the Buco J100 that The Real McCoy’s do is based on the older or newer version? It seems larger in some pictures but it’s difficult to tell.

 

[Canuck Panda]

The old one (old fit) had the padding on the outside, BJ2002 and maybe a few other special model numbers.

I have been looking for one of these old ones forever and haven't found one in bigger sizes.

The current one is BJ19002, and from the numbers posted online, I believe it’s the new slim long fit with wider shoulder. The padding is also underneath now and not patch on top. Looks very nice though.

 

[Marc Fischetti]

Great, very informative. Thank you. Yes I like the new one a lot but that fit just might not be for me. I fear going down a size might be too small.

 

[Canuck Panda]

I too prefer the old fit. The new fit is really made for untucked shirts which is more popular these days.

 

[Shawnziee]

Thank you everyone for answering all my questions,..... I knew that RMC changed all their models' fit to be more "user-friendly" and was wondering how that has affected J-100.
I was lucky to have purchased a (second-hand) old fit and I love everything about it. Is it the most comfortable jacket I own? Absolutely not, but I love the way it fits, looks, and smells. I have purchased a mouton collar (new) with shinki HH and that hide feels way different in every way. It is softer with less shine to it, and it doesn't smell Shinki lol.
That said, I am still looking for a brown one in the old fit.

 

[Canuck Panda]

In the recent days when I was looking at the different cuts of the J-100 I've realized that the wide shoulder slim torso (current fit) also existed before, back in 2013/2014, when the old fit (Y tapered) also existed. For example this climbing hill variant:

Very confusing I know. So it's best to find out what the RMC Style number is and then try to find blog post on what cut it was, either Y tapered or wide shoulder slim torso.

FWIW, my J-100 shirt old fit, Y tapered, jacket had the softest Shinki compared to the other Buco jackets I have, so it could have been worn very close to the skin. This wide shoulder slim torso climbing hill looks like it has the stiffer Shinki. I am not sure about other colors or the new one that is being sold in store now.

 

[jeo]

The older model for me was way better. Firstly the grain of the leather is much smoother and a little stiffer which I preferred, the color popped more.
The new model is also heavier or heftier and is possibly geared more towards a person that actually rides motorcycles, the leather might be a little thicker but I’m not sure.

I agree that the old fit suits you better.

I own the new fit J-100. I do not own and have never owned the old fit J-100.

But when I compare my new fit J-100 to my old fit J-24, the “new fit” leather is much stiffer and smoother. The leather on my “old fit” is softer and grainier.

I also would want the old model. they were exact replica of the original 50s J100 just sized down one to two depending on the year of production to fit the Japanese domestic market. The new fit is slim long and is more modern cut but works well with untucked shirts. The old fit has more taper like the original.

Exact replica of the older unlined horsehide Buco J-100s or the newer, lined steerhide Buco J-100s? To me they do not look like they would fit the same.

Also, what are you basing this on? Do you own an original?

From the few I’ve seen of people wearing the originals and tons I’ve seen people wearing the old fit, they do not look like exact replicas.

Perhaps irrelevant, but I own a few original Buco J-24s both in size 38 and 36 and I also own the old fit RMC J-24 size 36 and they are nowhere close to being exact replicas of the originals in terms of fit.

I haven’t tried the new fit J-24 so I cannot say if those fit like the originals.

Here’s my new fit J-100 size 36 model BJ19110.

Tried to showcase the cut in the body with this shot.

Here’s my original unlined horsehide Buco J-100 tagged size 38 from around 1953-1955.

Fits quite longer and slimmer than my new fit 36. Has smaller shoulders, chest and waist.

This original HH size 38 isn’t a great fit on me tbh. I think an original steerhide size 36 would be great though. They look like they have a cut better suited for me.

Old fit leather didn't get softened at the tannery, new fit leather is soften at the tannery because it is easier to wear for most 1st time leather wearers. I too prefer the old fit leather as I like to break things in myself

The new leather was far softer and shinier but the grain was not so nice, not so smooth.

New fit command higher selling prices in Japan. Their customer want the softer easier to wear slim long stuff that they can casually wear modernly with their shirt untucked. I see a lot of old fit J-100 popped up on used market recently. I assume they "upgraded" to the new fit.

FWIW, my J-100 shirt old fit, Y tapered, jacket had the softest Shinki compared to the other Buco jackets I have.

Conflicting info here. I’m confused. What’s softer, old fit leather or new fit leather?

Again, my “old fit” leather is softer and grainier than my “new fit” leather which is much stiffer and seems thicker/heavier and happens to be smoother than my “old fit” leather. Just an fyi, I bought my old fit J-24 second hand but it was practically new and not broken in.

I also have a friend who also has the new fit J-100 and his is also super thick and stiff. I’ve seen and held plenty of old fit leather and while not the softest in the world, they sure seem a bit thinner, more pliable and softer.

 

[Canuck Panda]

I agree that the old fit suits you better.

I own the new fit J-100. I do not own and have never owned the old fit J-100.

But when I compare my new fit J-100 to my old fit J-24, the “new fit” leather is much stiffer and smoother. The leather on my “old fit” is softer and grainier.



Exact replica of the older unlined horsehide Buco J-100s or the newer, lined steerhide Buco J-100s? To me they do not look like they would fit the same.

Also, what are you basing this on? Do you own an original?

From the few I’ve seen of people wearing the originals and tons I’ve seen people wearing the old fit, they do not look like exact replicas.

Perhaps irrelevant, but I own a few original Buco J-24s both in size 38 and 36 and I also own the old fit RMC J-24 size 36 and they are nowhere close to being exact replicas of the originals in terms of fit.

I haven’t tried the new fit J-24 so I cannot say if those fit like the originals.

Here’s my new fit J-100 size 36 model BJ19110.

View attachment 591623

Tried to showcase the cut in the body with this shot.

View attachment 591624

Here’s my original unlined horsehide Buco J-100 tagged size 38 from around 1953-1955.

Fits quite longer and slimmer than my new fit 36. Has smaller shoulders, chest and waist.

This original HH size 38 isn’t a great fit on me tbh. I think an original steerhide size 36 would be great though. They look like they have a cut better suited for me.

View attachment 591625
View attachment 591626









Conflicting info here. I’m confused. What’s softer, old fit leather or new fit leather?

Again, my “old fit” leather is softer and grainier than my “new fit” leather which is much stiffer and seems thicker/heavier and happens to be smoother than my “old fit” leather. Just an fyi, I bought my old fit J-24 second hand but it was practically new and not broken in.

I also have a friend who also has the new fit J-100 and his is also super thick and stiff. I’ve seen and held plenty of old fit leather and while not the softest in the world, they sure seem a bit thinner, more pliable and softer.

I hear you man. I don't have the original. I did some research and posted the Lightening magazine page about it up in this thread. The number they posted (of the original) is very similar to the one repro I had just two sizes different. But you got both original jacket and repro so I will go with what you got.

The leather on my old J100 was soft, not stiff at all. I had it at the same time as the Mobster new fit size 40 and the J100 couldn't stand while the Mobster could. Now I have the Mobster in size 42 and it's the same thing, it stands, the J100 didn't. All my other RMC jackets, J-24, J-25 and Steinbeck all had the stiffer leather, not the soften one like the J100. So I would assume they purposely soften the J100 leather because it was a shirt. Although from looks of the finish I couldn't tell the difference, just the temper. It's also worth noting that the new Mobster and J-24, and 25 I have didn't really skive either, whereas the Steinbeck had obvious skiving in most of the seams.

 

[jeo]

I hear you man. I don't have the original. I did some research and posted the Lightening magazine page about it up in this thread. The number they posted (of the original) is very similar to the one repro I had just two sizes different. But you got both original jacket and repro so I will go with what you got.

Even with owning my original J-100 I can’t sit here and proclaim that I know how they all fit.

And I’ve never owned the old fit J-100 so I can’t speak to whether they are exact replicas but certainly don’t look like exact replicas at all.

One thing I’ve learned after close to 20 years of doing this, is numbers don’t mean as much as you think they do. It’s just about the pattern than it is about the numbers.

The leather on my old J100 was soft, not stiff at all. I had it at the same time as the Mobster new fit size 40 and the J100 couldn't stand while the Mobster could. Now I have the Mobster in size 42 and it's the same thing, it stands, the J100 didn't. All my other RMC jackets, J-24, J-25 and Steinbeck all had the stiffer leather, not the soften one like the J100. So I would assume they purposely soften the J100 leather because it was a shirt. Although from looks of the finish I couldn't tell the difference, just the temper. It's also worth noting that the new Mobster and J-24, and 25 I have didn't really skive either, whereas the Steinbeck had obvious skiving in most of the seams.

Wait so you originally said the new leather has been softened. Now you’re saying the old fit leather is the soft leather?

This is why I’m confused lol!

This is also why I wanted to post my experience with the “new fit” leather.

My new fit leather doesn’t seem to have been softened at all. It’s stiff as hell and going to take me a long time to break it in.

My old fit leather is softer than my new fit, but I wouldn’t call it soft either tbh. It’s definitely more pliable than my new fit leather.

The Mobster standing on its own means nothing. That jacket has so much structure with all that stitching around the pockets, that bottom waist band (I mean the seam itself that connects the body panel to the waist band) and then on the inside of the jacket you have the leather facings and then the bottom hem is also leather, making it double the leather. Also the connection of the inside bottom hem connecting to the inside leather facings also creates structure.

The J-100 is just one piece of leather all the way with no seams on the front panels creating any kind of structure with a very thin liner on the inside all the way around besides small leather facings on each side.

How do you know there is no skiving? Did you open up the jacket and take it apart?

 

[Canuck Panda]

Even with owning my original J-100 I can’t sit here and proclaim that I know how they all fit.

And I’ve never owned the old fit J-100 so I can’t speak to whether they are exact replicas but certainly don’t look like exact replicas at all.

One thing I’ve learned after close to 20 years of doing this, is numbers don’t mean as much as you think they do. It’s just about the pattern than it is about the numbers.



Wait so you originally said the new leather has been softened. Now you’re saying the old fit leather is the soft leather?

This is why I’m confused lol!

This is also why I wanted to post my experience with the “new fit” leather.

My new fit leather doesn’t seem to have been softened at all. It’s stiff as hell and going to take me a long time to break it in.

My old fit leather is softer than my new fit, but I wouldn’t call it soft either tbh. It’s definitely more pliable than my new fit leather.

The Mobster standing on its own means nothing. That jacket has so much structure with all that stitching around the pockets, that bottom waist band (I mean the seam itself that connects the body panel to the waist band) and then on the inside of the jacket you have the leather facings and then the bottom hem is also leather, making it double the leather. Also the connection of the inside bottom hem connecting to the inside leather facings also creates structure.

The J-100 is just one piece of leather all the way with no seams on the front panels creating any kind of structure with a very thin liner on the inside all the way around besides small leather facings on each side.

How do you know there is no skiving? Did you open up the jacket and take it apart?

Alright man. You got me, nothing makes sense from my posts about this jacket. Please consider this post to erase everything I ever said about any of the jackets listed here.

Just tired.

 

[jeo]

Alright man. You got me, nothing makes sense from my posts about this jacket. Please consider this post to erase everything I ever said about any of the jackets listed here.

Just tired.

Not trying to get you, but you made a statement. Is everyone just supposed to take your word for it and not question anything you say? When I make a statement, I’m able to back it up and when I give my opinion I usually say it’s just my opinion. I was also genuinely curious man. If you know to identify how there is skiving just by looking at a jacket, I would have loved to know.

 

[Aloysius]

Re: skiving, I find I can usually tell extreme skiving by feeling the seams, but I don't know if I could distinguish slight skiving vs unskived seams, even though I prefer the latter.

 

[Canuck Panda]

Not trying to get you, but you made a statement. Is everyone just supposed to take your word for it and not question anything you say? When I make a statement, I’m able to back it up and when I give my opinion I usually say it’s just my opinion. I was also genuinely curious man. If you know to identify how there is skiving just by looking at a jacket, I would have loved to know.

I look at the point where multiple layers of leathers gather, at least 4 layers sometimes more at the points if two parts attach together.

The J-24 just cut the big mitre so there is visually thick to thin to thick, to me this is no skiving, just mitering to reduce bulk to make the point, so there is visible thickness difference.

The Steinbeck I almost cannot see the mitre, and it just feel almost same thickness going around the layered point corner. This I consider has seam allowance edge skiving so the overall thickness feels similar throughout.

The sewing allowance is similar at about 3/8" for both jacket as you can see when I pinch both.

To my best knowlege the old J100 I had was similar to the Steinbeck and not the J-24, the leather was even softer. The look of the leather was the same, just softer.

That's all I've got. Nothing left in me for the night...

Edit, one more, J-25 doesn't have the big corner mitre like the J-24, but there is visually bulk of the seam from thin to thick compared to the Steinbeck which does not. The J-25 I don't consider it skived seams either, but it also doesn't have the big mitre bulk reduction at the corner like the J-24 so it feels even extra bulky at some points.

 

[jeo]

View attachment 591716 View attachment 591717 View attachment 591718 View attachment 591719 View attachment 591720 View attachment 591721 View attachment 591723

I look at the point where multiple layers of leathers gather, at least 4 layers sometimes more at the points if two parts attach together.

The J-24 just cut the big mitre so there is visually thick to thin to thick, to me this is no skiving, just mitering to reduce bulk to make the point, so there is visible thickness difference.

The Steinbeck I almost cannot see the mitre, and it just feel almost same thickness going around the layered point corner. This I consider has seam allowance edge skiving so the overall thickness feels similar throughout.

The sewing allowance is similar at about 3/8" for both jacket as you can see when I pinch both.

To my best knowlege the old J100 I had was similar to the Steinbeck and not the J-24, the leather was even softer. The look of the leather was the same, just softer.

That's all I've got. Nothing left in me for the night...

Edit, one more, J-25 doesn't have the big corner mitre like the J-24, but there is visually bulk of the seam from thin to thick compared to the Steinbeck which does not. The J-25 I don't consider it skived seams either, but it also doesn't have the big mitre bulk reduction at the corner like the J-24 so it feels even extra bulky at some points.
View attachment 591725

Thanks for showing this.

The only thing that is real evident to me is the bulk reduction or miter on corner of the Buco collar which I’m assuming they did so that the button would be easier to attach?

Skiving is when they “shave” the leather towards the edge, right? And from my understanding it’s done on shoulder seams, armpit etc… for comfort and sometimes corners so that the folded over leather doesn’t get too thick?

I see the same thickness in that last picture on both jackets it’s just that the Buco has a wider fold. Wouldn't skiving mean that you wouldn’t see or barely see anything?

This is my RC. It has very thick leather so I can see this.

This to me is not skived.

And this shoulder seam to me is skived. Barely see the fold.

Is this correct?

On my RMC Buco, I can’t tell at all. You see the fold here and I can pinch but still can’t tell. Is this skived?

Skiving has been discussed and shown plenty here but quite honestly I’ve never bothered to think too much about it.

 

[Nykwil]

I have a new fit J-100 bought from Standard & Strange in 2021.
I noticed the leather was rather thick and smooth in the beginning but through the years it’s gotten lighter and grainier.

I will say some of you guys have so many jackets to wear that some of your jackets never get to a state where the jacket finally has conformed to your body. I tend to wear the same jacket for weeks/months on end. But I totally understand doing that isn’t feasible for some.

To be fair though I have sprayed this jacket to death with water and even soaked it once to get it to shrink a bit.

It’s finally at a state where I can toss it on and feel like I’m not fighting the jacket and it can drape properly on me. I’m hoping the thick leather on my Nelson will end up this way after 2.5 years of wear.

 

[Bender]

I just ordered a 19110 (current version) J-100 from Standard & Strange.

I have an unworn NOS RMC 9110 (older version J-100) I recently bought that is too small... when the new one arrives, I'll compare that leather with the older version.

I imagine most of these comparisons are between new or lightly worn 19110s and well-worn 9110s. So it should be interesting to compare the two leathers when both jackets are new and unworn.

That said, the older NOS version I have is the camel color leather, so it's possible it's yet a different hand than the black leather on either the new or old J-100s.