The Legendary DURABLE (Wild One) Jacket

[Gypsymoth82]

@tmitchell59 I'm very interested in the following: "I do think Durable was a Canadian company."

Can you elaborate on this theory at all?

 

[tmitchell59]

This image shows Durable produced jackets without their label. There are others in this thread with a generic Horsehide tag and no makers label. This was also done by other makers like California Sportswear, producing the same jackets with their label and with only a leather tag. The jacket next to it is the first edition Durable, different lining, band around the belt line, no stars, small conmar zipper.

CSC and other makers produced jackets for all the major catalogs and for smaller retailers and shops. This is well known established fact. Star Sportswear produced jackets under the JC Penney Sportclad label. There are other examples we can document and others we can't.

See where I am going with this?

@tmitchell59 I'm very interested in the following: "I do think Durable was a Canadian company."

Can you elaborate on this theory at all?

I don't recall where I got the information Durable was Canadian, seemed to be common knowledge. I don't know how they determined this. Most Canadian makers did not use American produced zippers instead a Lightening or other British brand. I've always questioned this.

I can confirm the Canadian the connection with one Durable jacket I owned. That jacket also gives a couple of other clues.

 

[tmitchell59]

Durable

Note the Trademark number on the label.

 

[tmitchell59]

Durable

40s Talon zipper

 

[Doctor Damage]

I don't recall where I got the information Durable was Canadian, seemed to be common knowledge. I don't know how they determined this. Most Canadian makers did not use American produced zippers instead a Lightening or other British brand. I've always questioned this.

I can confirm the Canadian the connection with one Durable jacket I owned. That jacket also gives a couple of other clues.

Canadian zippers match the rest of the world, i.e. the pull is attached to the left side (left breast) of the zipper. US zippers are the opposite. I don't know what the vintage situation was. Also, with jackets this old, some will have had zippers replaced.

 

[tmitchell59]

Canadian zippers match the rest of the world, i.e. the pull is attached to the left side (left breast) of the zipper. US zippers are the opposite. I don't know what the vintage situation was. Also, with jackets this old, some will have had zippers replaced.

The blue Durable with the left side pull

The half-belt has a Talon zipper with the pull on the right side.

Makes me think Durable produced jackets for the Canadian and American markets.

 

[Gypsymoth82]

It would be pretty cool to find a Canadian labeled one in Canada. Challenge accepted.

 

[Canuck Panda]

Henry Morgans and Company aka Morgan's was a Frech Canadian department store in Montreal. It was later bought up by The Bay and then went dead like most Bay brands... Although Zellers is making a comeback!

Anyways, the manufacturer could have been American, and the jackets were just selling through a Canadian retailer. Up until the second war, the US industries were the powerhouse in manufacturing, it would made sense most of the stuff were actually produced in the US and just sold abroad. This could be the connection between Schott and Durable, that it was just a house brand sold to the Canadian distribution but still produced in the same factory in the US - This is not a fact but my guess! There isn't a lot of evidence that Canada had the full supply chain from tannery to fabrication, zipper factories included, not like the Americans back during the turn of the century at least. Lots of fur pelts were traded down but nothing industrialized. Just my hunch, not facts, until I can find some old records from 1920s...

 

[Aloysius]

Henry Morgans and Company aka Morgan's was a Frech Canadian department store in Montreal. It was later bought up by The Bay and then went dead like most Bay brands... Although Zellers is making a comeback!

Anyways, the manufacturer could have been American, and the jackets were just selling through a Canadian retailer. Up until the second war, the US industries were the powerhouse in manufacturing, it would made sense most of the stuff were actually produced in the US and just sold abroad. This could be the connection between Schott and Durable, that it was just a house brand sold to the Canadian distribution but still produced in the same factory in the US - This is not a fact but my guess! There isn't a lot of evidence that Canada had the full supply chain from tannery to fabrication, zipper factories included, not like the Americans back during the turn of the century at least. Lots of fur pelts were traded down but nothing industrialized. Just my hunch, not facts, until I can find some old records from 1920s...

I don’t think it would explicitly say “Durable of Canada” if it were an American made brand. Just my thinking.

I don’t think a Schott-Durable connection is attested to nowhere except this forum. You can see the construction similarities between Beck-branded and Perfecto-branded equivalent jackets. There’s no such with the Durable.

For instance, if Schott was making the Perfecto for “Durable of Canada”, why would they move the patch pocket button–quite an arbitrary change–or spec G-1 style underarm footballs for those, but not the Beck or Perfecto jackets? (I’m aware Schott eventually added underarm footballs to Perfectos but that was 30 years later.)

The 50s Schott Perfectos are actually imo more attractive than the Durables, but that in itself speaks to differences.

 

[tmitchell59]

If Schott owned Durable and thus made the Wild Ones jacket they would have been yelling that out loud, but they don't.

Why is so difficult to believe it was a Canadian Company? The label above says that. The other label says they used a tannery in Canada, with a store label from Canada, and a Lightening zipper!! Seems to point to being a Canadian company, doesn't it?

It would be pretty cool to find a Canadian labeled one in Canada. Challenge accepted.

Look up that trademark number, I assume it is a Canadian registration not USA.

Don't always look for a label, look for the jacket, especially the quality of the leather. I have yet to see a Durable with less than stellar leather.

 

[Canuck Panda]

I know where to look for old business license records I'll give it a shot next time I get that east. The thing is most pre war stuff weren't documented/kept well, most didn't even make the first microfiche, remember those from elementary school days!

 

[AHP91]

I don’t think it would explicitly say “Durable of Canada” if it were an American made brand. Just my thinking.

I don’t think a Schott-Durable connection is attested to nowhere except this forum. You can see the construction similarities between Beck-branded and Perfecto-branded equivalent jackets. There’s no such with the Durable.

For instance, if Schott was making the Perfecto for “Durable of Canada”, why would they move the patch pocket button–quite an arbitrary change–or spec G-1 style underarm footballs for those, but not the Beck or Perfecto jackets? (I’m aware Schott eventually added underarm footballs to Perfectos but that was 30 years later.)

The 50s Schott Perfectos are actually imo more attractive than the Durables, but that in itself speaks to differences.

Why would they? Why would Schott license their name on garbage products made in China and elsewhere? For money, of course. Now I have no idea whether such a connection exists. But I could imagine there’s been distributor’s requests that have been honored in the past, just as there are today. As Canuck Panda said, most of these records are lost to history. Schott employees have been corrected many times before in their own forums. Just food for thought

 

[Leigh H]

pretty interesting Gail from Schott said they never bought the brand.

https://www.schottnyc.com/forum/posts/durable_brand.htm

 

[Canuck Panda]

Gail was great! She knew everything!

I always loved the Durable mystery. How did an East Coast Canadian jacket made all its way to the Hollywood film set and onto the body of Marlon Brando. The same film crew could technically still be around, they'd be close to 90 to 100 years old now, if they were just young men/women then...

 

[Aloysius]

Why would they? Why would Schott license their name on garbage products made in China and elsewhere? For money, of course. Now I have no idea whether such a connection exists. But I could imagine there’s been distributor’s requests that have been honored in the past, just as there are today. As Canuck Panda said, most of these records are lost to history. Schott employees have been corrected many times before in their own forums. Just food for thought

Completely unnecessarily aggressive post.

I gather that you have some kind of grudge against the Schott family, but my point stands. If a company acquisition was necessary for a flap ticket pocket, then a whole number of 50s jacket companies needed to buy Durable.

It would be an extremely strange distributor request to ask Schott to move the patch pocket button slightly.

 

[Aloysius]

Gail was great! She knew everything!

I always loved the Durable mystery. How did an East Coast Canadian jacket made all its way to the Hollywood film set and onto the body of Marlon Brando. The same film crew could technically still be around, they'd be close to 90 to 100 years old now, if they were just young men/women then...

I think as with many things to do with this film jacket, we’re overthinking it. I very much doubt a specific brand was sought out (as we might need to today). It was the 50s—they likely asked the props department to get a few different motorcycle jackets and we ended up with the ones that were used. They were ‘in’ the era so to say.

 

[58panheadfan]

If Schott owned Durable and thus made the Wild Ones jacket they would have been yelling that out loud, but they don't.

Why is so difficult to believe it was a Canadian Company? The label above says that. The other label says they used a tannery in Canada, with a store label from Canada, and a Lightening zipper!! Seems to point to being a Canadian company, doesn't it?


Look up that trademark number, I assume it is a Canadian registration not USA.

Don't always look for a label, look for the jacket, especially the quality of the leather. I have yet to see a Durable with less than stellar leather.

Some more infos about Durable:

Interesting time for leather jacket manufacturers. Before the boom of radio and later t.v., North America was reliant on printed media to spread marketing and brand. The majority of the economy was centered around ports of call, and the major transport system was the Great Lakes Waterways. This made the port cities on these lakes the major producers of the great transportation revolution. Cars, planes and motorcycles needed the appropriate gear to go along. The modern motorcycle jacket and other leather jackets were based on the primitive designs that had always been used in Europe for horseback riding and work wear. The American jacket was born of the cross fertilisation of those Euro styles with Native American wear, rugged wear required to settle North America and innovative designs to adapt to the modern age and technology. This innovation often happened in a vacuums as different companies rarely had opportunities to see each others designs until catalogues were printed or big stores could distribute. Early jackets have great historical importance because of these isolated innovations. Check out this awesome early Durable Brand Canadian Jacket. Durable survived many many years producing utility jackets for many police forces. I have a great many of these jackets, and I'm pretty sure I read that Schott bought the company at some point. This early jacket would indicate that the company probably started under a different name and that they had in fact two locations: one at the Port of Vancouver; and one in Ottawa the capital city of Canada. This usually indicated a family presence in both cites, as well as an unusual example of east west marketing to capture leather markets up and down both coasts. The jacket pictured has the classic early primitive pre-zipper design, which included generous eggplant per portions to accommodate riding pants under the jacket. Not flattering but very useful.

David Himel 11 July 2011 at 01:42
Since posting on this jacket the brand was in fact Durabil...made by Grant...Holden and Graham..I have acquired a catalogue with this jacket in the listing from the 1920s...that being said...Durable is a loved and relatively unknown company...and I am seeking any information regarding the company.

DH may be willing to share more informations about Durable (former Durabil) on this forum, but I don't think, it's because he feels offended. But as I have always said, this man has certainly acquired excellent knowledge through his extensive collection and his dealership.

Edit: The myth of whether Schott bought Durable continues... LOL! It would be interesting to know where DH read this...

 

[AHP91]

Completely unnecessarily aggressive post.

I gather that you have some kind of grudge against the Schott family, but my point stands. If a company acquisition was necessary for a flap ticket pocket, then a whole number of 50s jacket companies needed to buy Durable.

It would be an extremely strange distributor request to ask Schott to move the patch pocket button slightly.

I don't have any grudge against the Schott family or their jackets for that matter. I actually own a number of them. I own a few made for the American market, a few for the Japanese market, a few newer ones, a few old ones. The quality varies greatly, in my opinion. I'm just saying that companies will always cater to the customers and distributors.

You're much more knowledgeable than I on the history between Schott and Durable, but I wouldn't put it past any company to make changes to make sales. Schott may claim otherwise, but the leather thickness between identical jackets designated for the Japanese market always seem to be thinner and thus more lightweight. I would gather this has something to do with the Japanese preference for lighter-weight jackets. I've seen everything from camouflage-printed perfectos, to denim material Perfectos, Perfectos without belts nor laces, anodized aluminum zippers made to look like brass, actual brass hardware. The list is endless.

Anyway this is beside the point of this thread. I'm just saying that a slight change in the placement of a pocket on a 70+ year old jacket doesn't seem outlandish to me.

 

[Aloysius]

Anyway this is beside the point of this thread. I'm just saying that a slight change in the placement of a pocket on a 70+ year old jacket doesn't seem outlandish to me.

Ah, my point was not so much one of intention. Rather, these jacket companies in the 50s (except perhaps Cal, whose inflation adjusted price is almost as high as a modern repro) were not luxury goods with modern repro-like tight tolerances. Thus, a consistent spec of the button being one inch higher would not seem viable to me.

EDIT: I did want to add that I apologise for assuming a grudge. There actually was a recent member who had such a grudge, though he withdrew it as he got more familiar with jackets.

 

[jeo]

I don't recall where I got the information Durable was Canadian, seemed to be common knowledge. I don't know how they determined this. Most Canadian makers did not use American produced zippers instead a Lightening or other British brand. I've always questioned this.

I can confirm the Canadian the connection with one Durable jacket I owned. That jacket also gives a couple of other clues.

Makes me think Durable produced jackets for the Canadian and American markets.

I believe there were two separate brands using the Durable name. One Canadian and One American. I don't believe one was producing jackets for the other.

I've seen these Euro looking jackets before with the Durable name on the label.

When you mentioned that Durable was a Canadian brand, it sparked my memory of one of these Canadian Durables that was posted not too long ago on TFL and that's why I said in my earlier post that I have a theory that there were two brands using the Durable name.

More on why I believe this below and the 4 reasons behind my theory. First reason was what I always thought, two more reasons that I learned in the last few posts + one last final straw.

I don’t think a Schott-Durable connection is attested to nowhere except this forum. You can see the construction similarities between Beck-branded and Perfecto-branded equivalent jackets. There’s no such with the Durable.

You're talking about the similarities between Schott/Beck and how there are none between Schott/Durable, but I quoted you because you hit on something that I'd like to point out between the Canadian and American Durables.

1) What you said is exactly correct. As seen on many jackets for brands produced by other manufacturers, they always had construction similarities or the manufacturer left their "mark" somewhere somehow.

The (CA) Durable posted above and others I've seen are very Canadian/European in all aspects. From the Canadian Lightning zipper, to the Euro left handed zipper placement, to all the design details.

I just can't see a Canadian company producing the (US) Durables without leaving a Canadian "mark" on them, even if they were producing for the American market and there are none on any Durables I've seen, MC or otherwise.

2) Even DH hinted at two brands. In his first post he talks about how the Canadian Durable changed names. In his second post he corrects himself and says that it's Durabil and that: "Durable is a loved and relatively unknown company" I'm certain he's talking about the (US/MC) Durables being loved and not a Canadian brand with the same name, therefore hinting at two separate companies.

The jacket he posted uses the name "Durabil" with a Canadian reference and the other jacket uses " Styled by Durable of Canada". Both have Canadian references. No MC Durable ever mentions Canada and in fact my "last straw" points to another direction. Stay tuned.

So are the Canadian Durabil and Canadian Durable brands one in the same? Maybe, maybe not.

They seem to have a similar script logo with the swoosh underline (faded but still there on the Durabil logo). Doesn't necessarily mean anything as many brands used script logos in this era.

3) (US) Durable also uses a script logo on a couple of their labels, but again, many companies had a script logo, so that doesn't mean anything but the following is something that I think does means something.

Although not all the (US) Durable labels had a script logo, every single one of them had one common thread and that is that they feature a crest and crown. The fact they carried out a specific brand related theme throughout all their different iterations of their labels means a lot in my eyes. Nothing of the sort on the Canadian Durable labels.

The last straw...the unlabeled Durable. Is there a Canadian or American connection with that jacket?

Hard to read, but it says "Genuine American - Leather Sportswear" and beneath that it says "American Sportswear Co"

Those 4 reasons are why I strongly believe that there were two brands using the Durable name.

I'm open to having my mind changed if someone can find a crest logo Durable with any kind of Canadian connection or a "Styled by Durable of Canada" Brando jacket.