The Holmes Fedora

[hatflick1]

Certainly the wardrobe master on the film Sherlock Holmes spared no expense
in terms of period attire. And throughout the movie Sherlock wore several different style hats (never a deerstalker), one of which was a fedora with the brim flipped up in front.

The fedora puzzled me. Was it even around back in the late nineteenth century? It appeared out of place surrounded by top hats and bowlers and
bakers caps worn in crowd scenes.

Elementrally, can anyone place the fedora back to the, say, 1880's?

 

[M6Classic]

Now that's a good question...I am sure it has been addressed often on this list, but permit me to recapitulate...

Fedora comes from the 1882 French play by Victorien Sardou, titled Fédora, in which the title character was a woman who wore a hat supposedly much like the fedoras we wear today. Fédora is still given as a French woman's first name.

Sherlock Holmes makes his first appoearance in 1887 in Conan Doyles' A Study In Scarlet. Therefore, it is quite possible that Sherlock Holmes...were he a real person...could have worn a fedora, though it might have called into question his sexual orientation, as fedoras were still considered a woman's garment into the Twentieth Century.

Buzz

 

[avedwards]

The hat you are referring to is not a fedora, but a battered homburg. A perfectly period accurate hat choice for the late Victorian times, and appropriate for Downey's Holmes is supposed to be very scruffy looking.

 

[Dixon Cannon]

The Hat in question...

....the game is afoot!

-dixon 'elementary my dear' cannon

 

[hatflick1]

I appreciate the feedback.

Although I have to admit, it still appears as a fedora to me.

http://cinematicpassions.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/2009_sherlock_holmes_002.jpg

What makes me question the hat as being a homburg is the brim. Most homburgs I have seen, even some pretty beat up ones in Old West museums and New Mexico roadside shops, had still managed to maintain the original stiff pencil roll.

Nonetheless, the period of the London setting certainly matches the homburg genre.

 

[jsbrendle]

homburg? perhaps...

I suppose it is possible that it could be a form of Homburg with a much flatter rolled brim rather than the curled-up sides style we commonly see? Does anyone know if that was something that was done during the period -- that difference in the roll of the brim?

 

[Tiller]

I suppose it is possible that it could be a form of Homburg with a much flatter rolled brim rather than the curled-up sides style we commonly see? Does anyone know if that was something that was done during the period -- that difference in the roll of the brim?

It is a Homburg, it was given to the film by Christy's of London. One of our great members found out about it. Apparently when given to Downey's he beat and bent it till it looked like it did in the final film. The idea being that Holmes's in his bohemian ways would have bashed the hat till it fit his aesthetic taste, not really caring about the fashion world at large. Whether this is how the Holmes of the novels really is, is debatable, but I think it works for Downey's Holmes.

 

[kaosharper1]

There was an earlier thread on this hat that did identify it:

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?t=46163&page=2&highlight=holmes

 

[hatflick1]

Kickin' A Dead Horse

I went to Christy's website to check out the company's offering of Homburg hats in order to try to spot the model Downeyized for Sherlock Holmes' bohemian appearance.

http://www.christys-hats.com/viewhats.php?section=Fur Felts&subsection=Traditional

The above is the only Homburg I saw featured. The brim seems much to narrow to achieve the desired vagabond look, doesn't it?

Should my New Years resolution be to drop this topic altogether?

Cheers!

 

[filfoster]

brimming

I went to Christy's website to check out the company's offering of Homburg hats in order to try to spot the model Downeyized for Sherlock Holmes' bohemian appearance.

http://www.christys-hats.com/viewhats.php?section=Fur Felts&subsection=Traditional

The above is the only Homburg I saw featured. The brim seems much to narrow to achieve the desired vagabond look, doesn't it?

Should my New Years resolution be to drop this topic altogether?

Cheers!

I agree the brim on the movie hat looks significantly wider than the Christy's website Homburg offering-yet it clearly has the bound brim edge. Puzzling.

 

[M_Jones]

I thought it was discovered that the hat was from Lock & Co not Christy's? [huh]

 

[M6Classic]

The hat you are referring to is not a fedora, but a battered homburg. A perfectly period accurate hat choice for the late Victorian times, and appropriate for Downey's Holmes is supposed to be very scruffy looking.

I don't disagree with you, but I also do not see what makes this hat a Homburg. Could you enlighten me.

Thanks,

Buzz

 

[Art Fawcett]

The hat you are referring to is not a fedora, but a battered homburg. A perfectly period accurate hat choice for the late Victorian times, and appropriate for Downey's Holmes is supposed to be very scruffy looking.

I completely disagree Sir. Unless he had taken it to a professional to "de-tune" there is no way you can take the curl out of a Homburg brim so completely. Even with the right equipment it's an almost impossible task getting the brim this flat. I also don't understand what is meant by the brim binding being "Homburg". There are many variations of brim binding so I don't understand what is meant.

 

[avedwards]

I completely disagree Sir. Unless he had taken it to a professional to "de-tune" there is no way you can take the curl out of a Homburg brim so completely. Even with the right equipment it's an almost impossible task getting the brim this flat. I also don't understand what is meant by the brim binding being "Homburg". There are many variations of brim binding so I don't understand what is meant.

OK, maybe I was wrong and just wanted to think of the hat as a homburg so I could think of the film as being period accurate. In that case it could be a fedora made to look vaguely reminiscient of a homburg by having the brim snapped up in the front?

 

[M6Classic]

OK, maybe I was wrong and just wanted to think of the hat as a homburg so I could think of the film as being period accurate. In that case it could be a fedora made to look vaguely reminiscient of a homburg by having the brim snapped up in the front?

I do appologize, indeed. I mistook your initial post that it was a Homburg to be an authortitaive statement. My mistake, but it sure sounded definitive.

Buzz

 

[avedwards]

I do appologize, indeed. I mistook your initial post that it was a Homburg to be an authortitaive statement. My mistake, but it sure sounded definitive.

Buzz

It was supposed to be an authortitaive statement at first because on another thread the hat was described as such. But hearing a skilled craftsman tell me that it is near impossible for the hat to be a homburg I have no option but to accept that I was wrong and possibly just making that statement because I wanted it to be true. And I apologise for having wasted time taking this discussion down a useless path.

 

[avedwards]

That said though, this post (on another thread about this hat) confuses me:

Some interesting new info... which I am not sure if they are on the mark with their response.

From Lock and Co:

"Dear Keith
Sorry, I told you the wrong hat.
It is actually our Dark Grey Homburg but the brim has been "played around with"!
The film actually premiered in London last night and one of my colleague tells me, that he wore the hat to the premiere.
Regards"
http://www.lockhatters.co.uk/Fedoras__Homburg___Pork_Pie-Homburg-P58.aspx

Now I am just not seeing it as that, but here is a shot from the premiere in London.

Perhaps Art can help shed some light as to whether this is possible? At least to my eye, the brim (bearing in mind the pencil curl) looks about the same width as the one sold by Lock.

 

[gtdean48]

Just got back from seeing the movie & the binding does look like the bottom & top of the binding are different lengths. In the modern photo of RDJr, it appears the bottom is the shorter of the 2. Didn't Jimmy the Lid get a hat off ebay that was once a Homburg but had a flattened out brim?

 

[Tango Yankee]

My wife and I saw the movie this afternoon. If it's from Lock and Co it looks to me like their Superfelt fedora in black. At no time during the movie did it strike me as possibly being a homburg.

Just my opinion...

Cheers,
Tom

PS Happy New Year!

 

[Tiller]

I thought it was discovered that the hat was from Lock & Co not Christy's? [huh]

Guess it did turn out to be Lock & Co lol. My mistake.