The Conversion Corral

[gtdean48]

hmmmm... this thread just inspired me to buy up a couple of cowboy hats that I've seen in the mall. I just wonder if they are fur or wool... All I can say about 'em is that they're really stiff and kinda thick. The felt is almost double the thickness of my Christy's. I guess I'll try to buy one since they are relatively cheap.

That's the attitude, plus you'll have practiced when you run into the next hat that needs converting!!! :eusa_clap :eusa_clap

 

[donnc]

but I'm sorry to hear the alcohol didn't make a difference.

Not sure it made no difference at all. The brim is less rigid, maybe because the alcohol washed out some shellac. Or maybe because I got it wet and handled it a little, haven't steamed it ... with no prior experience, I don't know what to expect without the alcohol rinse.

And of course if they actually don't use shellac any more, results might be dramatically different with an old hat.

For this hat, for what it is - basically still a western style hat, in a rather outdoorsy color - the brim is probably about the right stiffness now. For the experiment's scientific conclusions, my summary would be, if there's interest in this procedure -- "more research is needed."

 

[fenris]

That's the attitude, plus you'll have practiced when you run into the next hat that needs converting!!! :eusa_clap :eusa_clap

...and the fact that no "real" fedoras are being sold here in the Philippines (no fur felts anyway). So a cowboy conversion may be the best way to add to my one-hat collection.

 

[Sam Craig]

...and the fact that no "real" fedoras are being sold here in the Philippines (no fur felts anyway). So a cowboy conversion may be the best way to add to my one-hat collection.

Fenris,

At the back of the sweatband, if there is a size tag, look for fabric content. Often, though not always, a wool hat will have the phrase "100 % wool" on the tag that states the size of the hat

Sometimes there are tags with information on the underside of the sweatband, also, if they are in good enough condition to turn out.

Welcome to the hunt and if you read through this thread you will find all sorts of good pointers to how you can make those westerns into snazy fedoras.

Good luck,

Sam

 

[donnc]

Welcome to the hunt and if you read through this thread you will find all sorts of good pointers to how you can make those westerns into snazy fedoras.

The examples in the thread have mostly been fur felt; isn't that significantly different to work with? For example, you can't just saw the brim off and sand it? Does it help to steam a wool crown? Etc. I'm not saying it's hopeless, just that, to the extent that Fenris manages to make a good looking fedora out of a cheap new cowboy hat, he may have acquired some skills to teach the rest of us.

 

[gtdean48]

I have adjusted creases on wool hats mainly by wetting = no need to bother with steam. I do that for rabbit, beaver & blended fur felt hats as well, if it is an involved crease adjustment. Just tweaking or fine tuning, I use steam.

 

[John in Covina]

The brim wilted when the alcohol hit it, but it's stiff now that it's nearly dry. I rinsed with water after I saturated it with alcohol. It did give me a chance to stretch it into a more oval head shape, which was the number one problem.

The shellac disolves in alcohol but it doesn't disolve in water. The water drives the shellac out of solution and back into the hat felt. Soak in alcohol and rinse with alcohol, the water interferes with the process you want.

 

[fenris]

Any pointers when working with wool? I assume wool hats would probably shrink from the wetting and/or steaming.

 

[Redwoodjedi]

This started out as a wool felt Wrangler Cowboy hat...

...and it has since become a fedora conversion. The dimensions are as follows:

Crown: 4 3/4"
Brim: 2 3/4"
Ribbon: 1 1/8 black non grosgrain
Size: 7 (now 6 7/8 due to steaming and reblocking)

Unlined

The style of crease I call the "Mario" because he seems to almost solely apply this crease to his wonderful hat collection but yes it is a Diamond Crease or at least an attempt at it. This was my first shot at a conversion hence why it is a wool felt and I wouldn't have lost any sleep if I trashed it. I have done others since and now prefer converting old cowboy hats that are 5X beaver or better. It's a little stiff and stubborn but I'm pretty determined and I like the finished outcome.

Sorry I have no "before" shots but will take them from now on as a member of this site. Here's the pics:

And my ugly mug wearin' it.

Cheers,

RJ

 

[Redwoodjedi]

Any pointers when working with wool? I assume wool hats would probably shrink from the wetting and/or steaming.

Yes! Start with a size bigger than you wear. The one I posted above is a size 7 on the tag. Shrinking occurred with the steaming and blocking down to my pinhead size 6 7/8.

You might have to put a little stiffener in it as wool becomes very pliable and has almost no memory and so your precious creasing and bashing will take on dull edges and look flat if you don't apply a little stiffener.

Hope that helps,

RJ

 

[fenris]

What do you guys use to mark he brims prior to cutting? Tailor's chalk?

 

[Redwoodjedi]

What do you guys use to mark he brims prior to cutting? Tailor's chalk?

Fenris -

I use a red colored pencil. The line is definitive and stable enough to stay there while I am trimming away the excess but does not stain or mark anything but the very surface of the felt which after it is trimmed is going to be sanded thus effectively "erasing" any remnants of the red pencil.

Make sense?

RJ

 

[fenris]

Got it! All i need now is to find a hat... All the hats i saw today were leather or wool with a wire-like thing inside to hold the shape of the brim. Somebody has bought all the felt-made hats! Darn it!

 

[gtdean48]

What do you guys use to mark he brims prior to cutting? Tailor's chalk?

I use a yellow crayon & cut on the crown side of the mark. HTH

 

[donnc]

This was my first shot at a conversion hence why it is a wool felt and I wouldn't have lost any sleep if I trashed it.

Looks like pretty good work to me. Is the brim folded over and sewn? I can't see that in the pictures, but seems to me to be the usual for wool.

 

[Redwoodjedi]

Looks like pretty good work to me. Is the brim folded over and sewn? I can't see that in the pictures, but seems to me to be the usual for wool.

Thanks for the kindness donnc!

Nope. The brim is raw edged. No cavanagh treatment or binding. Just the cut edge. It was a four inch brim trimmed or slashed rather to a 2 3/4" brim.

Thanks again. Most kind of you.

RJ

 

[gtdean48]

... The brim is raw edged. No cavanagh treatment or binding. Just the cut edge. It was a four inch brim trimmed or slashed rather to a 2 3/4" brim.

Looks like the brim could use some flattening or it could be just the angle of the photos. I mist the felt with distilled water, cover with a handkerchief & use a steam iron to work the brim. JMHO...

 

[Redwoodjedi]

Looks like the brim could use some flattening or it could be just the angle of the photos. I mist the felt with distilled water, cover with a handkerchief & use a steam iron to work the brim. JMHO...

Good advice GT, however, I was trying to emulate the gentle rounded slope that you see on some of the bashes, i.e. Mario's, that one sees on the edge bound models. I really like that look where the felt seems to slightly bubble a little above the edge binding. There are no crooked lines on the brim's edge, as the edge follows a gentle and symmetrical path the entire circumference of the hat. It's probably just a poor pic quality. I'm using my phone cam which is 3 megapixel. It's all I've got for now as far as picture taking is concerned. I'll buy another hat before I invest in a camera.

Thanks again for the wonderful advice and I will certainly put it to good if not immediate use on some of my current "project" hats.

Also, this is, just as a reminder, a wool hat. The wool seems to behave quite differently than the beaver or rabbit felt.

Cheers and kind regards,

RJ

 

[gtdean48]

.... I really like that look where the felt seems to slightly bubble a little above the edge binding....

That is the effect of the binding giving a good snap brim.

 

[Redwoodjedi]

Thanks for that GT. I will get to see that in person soon when my first "real" fedora comes in some time this week. I've got a Scala, but 1) it has no edge binding and 2) I don't consider it a "real" fedora. A cheap knock off maybe but not a fine mens hat.

Can't wait!

Cheers,

RJ