The Bowler or Derby Hat

[Dreispitz]

Looking at vintage derbies/bowlers, it seems they were nominally black in the UK, with some brown occasionally cropping up in the US. During the bowler's reign, were shades of brown simply not a popular suit color for men, or was it seen as acceptable to match a black derby with a brown outfit?

We had this topic of black vs. light a few times, here. Speaking for Europe, black was definately predominant in bowlers and formal hats.

The general rule for suits and hats still is: light colours are fine during the day. After five they have to pave way for black, dark and subdued accessoir schemes. Only exeption: white dinner jacket in summer.

Coming back to brown. Brown was certinly around, but considered a day colour.

By the way, I do not know if you still experience this on the other side of the pond. One major reason for being properly dressed when going out certinly was, that one was not admitted access to restaurants, grand hotels, and other "style premises" without adequate dress.

 

[jamespowers]

By the way, I do not know if you still experience this on the other side of the pond. One major reason for being properly dressed when going out certinly was, that one was not admitted access to restaurants, grand hotels, and other "style premises" without adequate dress.

Geez, I wish it was still that way. :eusa_doh:

 

[Philip K Nelson]

My Photos

Thanks for the tip Brad, I'll try to do better next time. Meanwhile if anyone wants a larger view of my images, they are welcome to e-mail me at pakanelson@comcast.net and I will reply with an attachment
Philip K Nelson MD

 

[Brad Bowers]

Thanks for the tip Brad, I'll try to do better next time. Meanwhile if anyone wants a larger view of my images, they are welcome to e-mail me at pakanelson@comcast.net and I will reply with an attachment
Philip K Nelson MD

You did fine, Mr. Nelson! Here, I've just edited out the thumbnail prefix, and it loads the full-size image. I didn't do that before, just in case you didn't want the larger images posted.

Brad

 

[Tiller]

If I recall correctly, Suchet's Poirot always wore a homberg; Churchill I'm sure wore both hombergs and bowlers, so that's probably where the confusion comes from. At a certain angle, you wouldn't be able to tell the difference.

I know this is a bit old, but Suchet's Poirot does wear a Bowler in "The Choclate Box". It's set when Poirot is an officer in the Belguim Police who is about to retire, and become a private investigator. During flashbacks to his youth (when Poirot was also skinny lol) Poirot wears a bowler. I'm not sure exactly when it was set, but I think it would be around 1910-15? I believe Suchet's Poirot also wears a Bowler in The Mysterious Affair at Styles which is set in 1916 after he has left his beloved Belguim.

With that all said I do love the bowler, it's just hard to pull off at times. I'd love to get a vintage bowler.

 

[Nick D]

I recieved my Dunn bowler today. It sits higher on my head than I expected, but I'm not sure if it looks better higher or if it should be sitting around my ears. I saw pictures of William and Harry with bowlers sitting low, but Prince Charles was wearing one high at the same event. I'll take pictures tomorrow.

Cheers,
Nick

 

[Nick D]

Here's some pictures of my new bowler. I apologize for the blurry images and the blurry me, these were taken quickly in a morning rush. I love the shape of the hat, but I'm not sure about the fit. That being said, as it's my first bowler I'm not sure exactly how they should sit.

 

[jonbuilder]

Nice looking hat nick but I have to say it does ride high on your head. I have no experience stretching a Bowler. I just purchase my first Bowler myself, which fits spot on and has a relatively soft crown that most likely I could stretch although I would be concerned which distorting the brim if I did attempt a stretch. Perhaps some of the more experience Bowler owners can advise.

 

[Dreispitz]

Here's some pictures of my new bowler. I apologize for the blurry images and the blurry me, these were taken quickly in a morning rush. I love the shape of the hat, but I'm not sure about the fit. That being said, as it's my first bowler I'm not sure exactly how they should sit.

Who´s ye maker of thy lid, Squire Nick?

 

[Brad Bowers]

It does sit high, which means it's slightly too small for you, but it doesn't look that funny, so you could get by with it. At one point in history, this look was the accepted norm.

Brad

 

[Torpedo]

It does sit high, which means it's slightly too small for you, but it doesn't look that funny, so you could get by with it. At one point in history, this look was the accepted norm.

Brad

I second that. Also, take into account that stretching a bowler will most probably result in some distortion and it will not look good. Maybe you should consider selling/exchanging it and acquiring a larger one.

 

[Nick D]

It's the Dunn & Co. hat I mentioned earlier, it's a fine hat, with a union tag in the sweatband. I'll be on the lookout for a better fitting one, it's quite disappointing because the description said it was 22.5" in diameter, but I've measured it twice and it's barely 22". That's one of the reasons I almost never buy hats online.

Cheers,
Nick

 

[billyspew]

It's the Dunn & Co. hat I mentioned earlier, it's a fine hat, with a union tag in the sweatband. I'll be on the lookout for a better fitting one, it's quite disappointing because the description said it was 22.5" in diameter, but I've measured it twice and it's barely 22". That's one of the reasons I almost never buy hats online.

Cheers,
Nick

I personally don't think it looks too bad... to the trained eye here on the lounge it may look slightly off but to everyone else you probably come into contact with, they wouldn't know the difference.

 

[Ephraim Tutt]

It's the Dunn & Co. hat I mentioned earlier, it's a fine hat, with a union tag in the sweatband. I'll be on the lookout for a better fitting one, it's quite disappointing because the description said it was 22.5" in diameter, but I've measured it twice and it's barely 22". That's one of the reasons I almost never buy hats online.

Cheers,
Nick

I think it looks fine.

 

[Ephraim Tutt]

I've been reading a novel lately set in New York during WWII in which one of the characters is described as wearing a 'square derby'.

What on earth is that?

 

[David Conwill]

I imagine a pork pie. Perhaps as described by an older person.

-Dave

 

[Wolfmanjack]

It's the Dunn & Co. hat I mentioned earlier, it's a fine hat, with a union tag in the sweatband. I'll be on the lookout for a better fitting one, it's quite disappointing because the description said it was 22.5" in diameter, but I've measured it twice and it's barely 22". That's one of the reasons I almost never buy hats online.

Cheers,
Nick

I agree with the others, Nick. It looks OK as is, but it would look far better if it were a little larger so it would ride a little lower. Recognizing all the hazards involved, if it were mine, I'd stretch it. Taking the circumference from 22" to 22.5" is a fairly easy stretch, equivalent to going up about 1/8 (plus a little more) in hat size.

What will happen to the brim? Worst case scenario, you will enhance the curl on the sides of the brim a bit.

If you have access to one of these beauties, the Garvé Hat Stretcher, it would be a breeze.

That being said, there are always risks in stretching, it's up to you.

 

[mayserwegener]

Johann Hückel´s Söhne Flexible Bowler

Just got this rare Hückel Bowler back from Optimo. I had them put in a liner. Not sure if it had one originally. It has to be least the 1930s but a good possibility earlier. It fits like a 6 but label states 6 1/2.

 

[dhermann1]

I've been reading a novel lately set in New York during WWII in which one of the characters is described as wearing a 'square derby'.
What on earth is that?

One of the websites that sells bowlers in England had some images showing a more squared off crown, which is what we see most of the time nowadays, and a different type with a higher more rounded crown. They said the rounded one was for city wearing, and the squared of was for country. You'd recognize the rounded style immediately if you saw it in one of those circa 1900 pics. The square top seems a lot jauntier. The round top seems to need a high wheeled bicycle and handlebar mustache underneath it.

 

[Ephraim Tutt]

One of the websites that sells bowlers in England had some images showing a more squared off crown, which is what we see most of the time nowadays, and a different type with a higher more rounded crown. They said the rounded one was for city wearing, and the squared of was for country. You'd recognize the rounded style immediately if you saw it in one of those circa 1900 pics. The square top seems a lot jauntier. The round top seems to need a high wheeled bicycle and handlebar mustache underneath it.

Thanks for that Dhermann. Since posting the above question I stumbled upon an old WWII newsreport which described Winston Churchill wearing his 'square bowler' - so, it was obviously a common term, and style, back then. Now I just need a photo!