The Bowler or Derby Hat

[tridentine]

Jeff, Thanks! I have sold off some of these so not as bad as it looks. I am mostly interested in old German and Austrian Melone at this point. I don't wear mine often but I do look at them often. I am amazed by their beauty!

Probably some type of clerical hat (size 57.5cm). I couldn't find anything on ATEHA or H. C. & Co. and appears the store that sold it A. Spanke of Münster didn't survive WWII. It could have been custom made (modified?) and has elements of a Top Hat and Bowler. The silk finish, liner, rope and sweatband (hand stitched) are of very high quality. The under brim is fabric lined but not sure of the material. I am thinking early 1900s. It came with the original box and is in near mint condition.

Thrice Beautiful!
It looks like a clerical Saturno.

 

[mayserwegener]

P. & C. Habig Wien, Zink Gray Melone, Size Point 5, 130 grams, 1930

Rare to come across a gray Melone. Very nice felt and finish on this one. Very high quality which is expected for a P. & C. Habig Wien. The sweatband is date stamped October 16, 1930.

 

[alanfgag]

With a date stamp no less... Fantastic, Steve!

 

[Chasseur]

I picked up this nice vintage (probably 1930s) French bowler in Paris last year but it does not quite fit me so it'll be going in the classifieds.

 

[Mr. Speakeasy]

Here's the oldest Bowler hat I own, I have reason to believe it dates to the 1870-80s
I know a couple people here that might say "WISHFUL THINKING!", but hold on..

Here's me bowler

Side view

And here's one in the Metropolitan Museums collection they have dated to 1865

The crown shape and brim width are almost identical
but the rake on my bowlers brim is not as drastic as on theirs, I partly think it could be due to how it was stored that caused the brim to go a bit more flat, or its a slightly newer hat, though i wouldn't think more than 20 years but bowlers didn't change much so it's always hard to tell.
also mine didn't come with a sweatband as it had probably rotted out years ago, but there is a tag that says it was made in Philadelphia

 

[mayserwegener]

It's possible but it could also be early 1900s. Please post a photo of the paper tag. If it was made in Philadelphia it could be a Stetson. BTW great Derby. It's rare to come across one that isn't black.

 

[Mr. Speakeasy]

It's possible but it could also be early 1900s. Please post a photo of the paper tag. If it was made in Philadelphia it could be a Stetson. BTW great Derby. It's rare to come across one that isn't black.

Very true, it could well be turn of the century, but I like to think it's from the 1880's, i'm a hopeful kinda guy

 

[bowlerman]

Beautiful. anyone here get the similar one from eBay last week? it was a gorgeous knox. I don't know how to paste a link from my kindle but will edit this post from my desktop in a minute.

 

[Mr. Speakeasy]

Beautiful. anyone here get the similar one from eBay last week? it was a gorgeous knox. I don't know how to paste a link from my kindle but will edit this post from my desktop in a minute.

Do you mean this one?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-Vtg-Size-...h%2FnE8%2B0JXX0qQQQoA%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

Cause that is one beautiful bowler, I love the lining!

 

[mayserwegener]

Very true, it could well be turn of the century, but I like to think it's from the 1880's, i'm a hopeful kinda guy

Here is a thread with some info on Henry H. Roelofs & Co. Maybe Robert (RLK) or others will chime in. My focus is mostly on German and Austrian makers.

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?44020-Roelofs-Hats&

 

[bowlerman]

Do you mean this one?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-Vtg-Size-...h%2FnE8%2B0JXX0qQQQoA%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

Cause that is one beautiful bowler, I love the lining!

yes that one!

 

[mayserwegener]

Do you mean this one?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-Vtg-Size-...h%2FnE8%2B0JXX0qQQQoA%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

Cause that is one beautiful bowler, I love the lining!

Looking at it again maybe it's more the ribbon / binding material, application plus the great condition (assuming it's all original).

I found this one from the Novy Jicin collection that has similar ribbon and binding material and dated 1876.

The Knox Style

 

[Joshbru3]

Beautiful. anyone here get the similar one from eBay last week? it was a gorgeous knox. I don't know how to paste a link from my kindle but will edit this post from my desktop in a minute.

I'm not 100% sold that derby was an actual Knox. In the early editions of the American Hatter and Clothier & Furnisher from the 1880's and 1890's, many manufactures listed their hats as made in the "Knox Style" or "Dunlap Style." These hats were neither Knox nor Dunlap hats, but rather made in the Style of Knox and Dunlap hats at the time. I've seen logos from Knox Top hats that I am pretty sure date to the 1980's/1890's and not only did Knox usually stamp their sweatbands, but the logo was completely different.

The "KNOX STYLE" logo is reminiscent of 1880's/1890's script, so the derby may very well be old, but not a Knox.

 

[bowlerman]

Nice. Well that's sneaky. I do have a 1934 Mallory that I think has that same bow, however. I'll check on it.

 

[mayserwegener]

I edited my post. I found an old ( dated 1876) Melone with very similar ribbon material (although the application appears a bit more refined).

 

[Mr. Speakeasy]

Looking at it again maybe it's more the ribbon / binding material, application plus the great condition (assuming it's all original).

I found this one from the Novy Jicin collection that has similar ribbon and binding material and dated 1876.

That is an absolutely stunning hat, I have never seen a bowler with a plush finish to the felt!

 

[mayserwegener]

They have a few examples at the Novy Jicin Museum in Czech Republic (was Neutitschein, Austria prior WWI -> home of great Velour hat companies).

 

[ofcoursemyhorse]

Heres some of mine.

J. Moore and Sons- Made in England

 

[ofcoursemyhorse]

MasterFelt

Made in the US. Pre 1935? Its union sticker doesnt have Millinery workers on it.

Aside from the Christys Bowler I have, this one easily has the stiffest crown.

 

[ofcoursemyhorse]

Beaver Brand