The A-2 review

[Matt Deckard]

I'd still like to see an Eastman jacket in person.
From what I've been reading, they don't just copy jackets, they are thread counters that go into extreme detail when making their replicas.

The WWII reenactors I have spoken to say they are spot on--which reminds me, I've been talking to a woman who does plays a nurse with a local group of reenactors, I might be going to some of their events... I'll keep you posted.

 

[Michaelson]

The only Eastman I ever owned was a fairly uncomfortable one, as they do indeed cut them to the exact specs of the original, but with that said, most folks are a lot BIGGER than they were back in the 40's, so the one I had was a bit tight in areas that I move and flex. I ended up letting it go. I have to say, though, it was built like a tank. That horsehide they use would make a GREAT house siding material. Regards. Michaelson

 

[Matt Deckard]

They tan their leather to the old specs too according to their Catalog.
Some companies may make a better fitting or easier to wear product, but Eastman tries to make 'em just like they were made back in the old days.

 

[Michaelson]

Well, it's probably just me, but I have to say there is definitely SOMETHING different about their horsehide, as that was the heaviest jacket I have EVER owned in physical weight. Weighed a ton (or felt like it to me). For someone really wanting exact specs, I believe Eastman is definitely one for consideration. Not being one needing that kind of exact fit, finish, and corect detail, I opted for the looser, incorrectly spec'd civil A-2 lambskin of FS. Fits this old fat body just fine, thank you very much. Regards. Michaelson

 

[Imahomer]

Originally posted by patterson
Agreed. IMHO, "pre-distressing" is a no-win. The hide is usually distressed in all the wrong placed, and it is prone to excessive wear at the time when a traditional hide would begin to break-in. I've been of a mind to manually accelerate the process on a new jacket, via MK's methods. While it was an interesting experiment, in hindsight I would have preferred to allow the whole process to take it's natural course.

I still promote the practice of tumbling a jacket (no heat in a dryer) to accelerate the natural relaxing of the skins. That's pretty much where I draw the line these days...

Well, I'm on board. I'll give up the idea of buying a jacket that is already distressed. Thanks guys. I appreciate your input on this. You've probably saved me some disappointments down the road.
Mike

 

[Rundquist]

Keep in mind that Eastman makes many types of A-2's. I've heard that their contract jackets are still good, but their "generic" WW2 type A-2's are really lame. You need to look no further than the Pearl Harbor movie. The A-2's in that movie just didn't look right. Cheers

 

[The_Edge]

Over at COW there is some disconcerting comments about Flightsuits (Gibson & Barnes) being posted. This is news to me. Are they under new management or having financial difficulties? What's the deal?!

I was hoping to finally order a G-1 from them this year but if they are having problems I'd like to know. Please PM me if the situation is sensitive.

 

[SHARPETOYS]

I'm in the same boat i also wanted to buy another jacket from them. We need Rundquist on this issue. Come in Adam!

 

[Wild Root]

For me it?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s Eastman all the way! Some here may disagree with me, but I have seen photo after photo of AAF Pilots in A-2?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s and to me the Eastman A-2?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s are the closest to the original one can get. The quality is so very high that it makes me dizzy. I for one liked the ones used in Pearl Harbor. I felt that they looked correct. My only complaint is they wore them a size to big. Most every one I see wearing A-2?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s ware them too big. They are to fit the body and not have a baggy fit. If they had their true size, they would have looked spot on! I have friends that own original A-2?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s and the difference between Eastman and an original is that one is old and one is new. I have seen some others ware Eastman A-2?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s and I have mistaken them for an original. The way they treat their leather is like they did in the 40?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s. I don?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢t have the cash for an A-2 right now but if I did, it would be Eastman.


Cheers.

 

[patterson]

Eastman does not actually tan their own hides - they procure them. They ask for bids based on their specs.

Eastman quality has been a bit of a rollercoaster - recently its been better than average. I've owned between 6-10 of their jackets - various pattern A2's and USN jackets. Honestly, they are about on par with the veg tanned goatskin Flight Suits Historical A2. Be careful about buying too much of their own hype. All of the premium jacket makers do the stitch count-thing. Of their original pattern reproductions, the RW 1401P and the Star Sportswear are my favorites. I have to say, however, that my favorite Eastman A2 is their house pattern. Their Navy jackets are worth bragging over - and outshine the A2's IMHO.

Of the premium A2 jacket makers, the only one that deserves the hype given to Eastman is Real McCoy?¢‚Ǩ‚Ñ¢s. Their original pattern jackets far outshine the Eastman in authenticity.

Just a note when buying a used Eastman. A few years back they were caught selling steer hide jackets that were advertised as horsehide - there is a pretty big difference in price...

 

[Imahomer]

So is there any agreement among you "in the know" as to where to go for a GOOD A2? I understand when you say watch out for this and watch out for that, but when you don't know that much about a subject and you rely on others... You are pretty much at their mercy.

 

[STHill]

Imahomer,

Aero, Eastman and Real McCoy (New Zealand)--note the alphabetical order--all offer top-notch, extremely authentic, high quality a-2s. Problems you will run into with all three: each has different fit characteristics (sometimes different models from the same manufacturer fit differently!), and all three are overseas. So, trying on jackets is out of the question. And exchanges can be time-consuming and costly (shipping back and forth).

My first-hand advice:

1) no first-hand experience with Real McCoy (I have heard many good reports, however). By the way, the A-2s used in "Band of Brothers" were provided by Real McCoy.

2) Charlie at Eastman (or actually, the U.S. distributor for Eastman) is a wonderful guy to talk to. I called him up to ask a quick question (this was a couple of years ago) and we wound up shooting the breeze for over an hour. I did buy a Roughwear contract 1401P from Eastman. It fit fine and it is an excellent jacket. It took 4-6 weeks to arrive, but Charlie had told me in advance to expect that.

3) I also have an Aero "house" (no specific contract) jacket which I dearly love. The horsehide has a thin finish which "distresses" quicker than the typical thick finish (this is by design. You have to specific this finish--their normal finish is the more typical thicker one). Like the Eastman, the quality is excellent. Delivery time was 3 weeks.

Between the two, I have a slight preference for Aero. Here's the reason: customer service. I had previously owned a cheaper Aero before I bought the one referred to above. From that experience, I knew I wanted slightly shorter sleeves and a slightly trimmer fit in the waist. I discussed this with Mark Moye, the U.S. representative for Aero. He forwarded my questions to Ken, the owner of Aero. Ken immediately emailed me with his comments. After we discussed it, I decided on the specific alterations I wanted. The jacket arrived 3 weeks later exactly as I had specified, no additional charge for the custom fit.

Mark also keeps a few jackets in inventory in the U.S. (he's in Columbia, SC). He was more than happy to send me a couple for trying on. They weren't the model I was interested in, but for fit purposes, they worked just fine.

NOTE: all these experiences are a couple of years old. I know Mark left Aero for a spell, but has recently again become their U.S. representative.

It is my understanding that Eastman charges extra for alternations, although I have no personal experience.

And then there's Flight Suits. From my experience, their authenticity is a notch below the others (but I'm nit-picking here). They're "Historic" A-2 is quite good. It has a more modern, fuller fit (which may be a plus for some). It is less expensive than the others (even more so, lately, with current exchange rates). Exchanges are much simpler and cheaper, because they're U.S. manufactured. Caveat: my experiences with FS were also a few years ago, so whatever changes are currently going on may change everything.

Sorry, I got more long-winded than I intended. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions.

 

[Imahomer]

Now that is an answer to a question! Thank you very much for all the details. I don't know if anyone else is going to use that information, but I really appreciate it. I'd rather have too much information and peoples opinions than not enough. Thank you very much.

 

[Matt Deckard]

Good to know...

I'm more interested in authernticity... I want it to look and fit like an original. I've seen Flightsuits work, and If I hang out with some of the WWII reenactors I'll examine their Eastmans and flightsuits side by side.

 

[Imahomer]

I guess it boils down to:
Authenticity, quality, customer service and price.

 

[Captain Krunch]

I have 3 Flight Suit jackets, and I purchased a 4th for my dad. I have a lambskin Expedition, a modern goatskin G-1, and a historical horsehide A-2 with all the appropriate WWII insignia (I'm wearing it in my photo to the left). My dad's jacket is a modern goatskin A-2. All 4 jackets are very well made, and each is worth the price I paid for them. Quality of materials, contruction of the jackets; all are top-notch. I'm very happy with my Flight Suit jackets, and in fact am seriously considering getting another A-2, this time their historical goatskin, but without the various WWII insignia attached. I have no hesitation in recommending Flight Suits, if you choose to go with them (Their modern A-2 is $288, which is pretty damn good. My original A-2, an Avirex purchased in 1989, was $275).

As for authenticity, I would suggest that before you pursue a jacket that is the "best", you first decide if it's important to you or not. If you're planning on participating in a WWII reenactor's group, then I would perfectly understand getting the most accurate jacket around. But if you're getting a jacket to wear on a regular basis, then I would think that how well the jacket functions as a jacket would be a more important decision criteria (Although authenticity could still be a criteria, too). I have many highly-regarded books about WWII flight jackets, and I felt that the historical horsehide A-2 from Flight Suits was satisfactory for my needs: a very good jacket to wear, and close enough in design to the original jackets to pass muster with most everyone. Of course, your mileage may vary.

A few things you can do to help you decide:

1) I highly, highly recommend you go to History Preservation Associates (The US sellers of Eastman jackets) and order their "Golden Book of Authentic Vintage Flight Apparel" for $12.75. Although it's their product catalog, it's also a very good reference on specific design features of A-2 and G-1 jackets. For $13, you'd be silly to pass it up.

2) Probably more than you're willing to spend, but you could also purchase the book "American Flight Jackets, Airmen and Aircraft: A History of U.S. Flyers' Jackets from World War I to Desert Storm" by Jon A. Maguire. It's $48 at Amazon, but worth it in my opinion. I have all of his books, which all relate to Army Air Corp clothing from WWII, so he knows his stuff.

3) Leather-wise, don't hesitate to contact Flight Suits and ask for leather samples from them. Having actual samples to touch and see will help you to decide which leather type and coloring to go with.

I'd write more, but I've got to get back to work!

Good luck,
Krunch

 

[STHill]

I agree with everything Krunch said. I'll probably buy my next A-2 or G-1 from FS. The only real departure from aunthenticity in their "Historic" A-2, is the more modern fit (a little fuller). Since most of us are a little "fuller" than 20 year-olds in 1943, that may even be a good thing.

Plus, you gotta understand, the true A-2 gearheads at Acme Depot and the forums devoted to the subject are absolutely obsessed with detail and "authenticity." Nothing wrong with that, that's their passion. The authenticity argument, though, gets a little silly when you realize that there were many A-2 contractors, and each one's jacket was made with different details. Sometimes, the differences were significant. Just because those guys have never seen an original that had the exact details and fit of the FS replica doesn't mean (to me, anyway) that it's not authentic. They definitively have the basic specs right, and the WWII "vibe" is there.

 

[Michaelson]

The old Biblical phrase 'straining gnats, swallowing camels' comes to mind when discussing the big time details folks. Regards. Michaelson

 

[Matt Deckard]

I like the idea of a jacket being a direct copy of a WWII original, with all the details of an actual period jacket--but if it don't fit, it don't fit. Before I buy I like to do alot of research and procrastinating.

 

[Michaelson]

For a true collector, Matt, that's half the fun....the chase! I couldn't see YOU doing it any other way. Leave the snap decisions and purchases to folks like me. Whining about it later is something I enjoy. Regards. Michaelson