Stetson Quality Experiment "Think Tank"

[HarpPlayerGene]

The logo thing isn't exactly what this thread began as but I'm glad it has entered in since I've always been very curious about that.

It's unlikely - to me - that a real ranking of quality can be achieved bottom-to-top based on the marketing names over the years, but I've often suspected that there is a real order in which they used different logos over the years and if I could understand that it'd help a lot to 'date' the hats.

Or not.

[huh]

 

[GWD]

I'm fairly confident about the "Logo/Crest" dates.

But you're right. I don't even know if my "Premier" has any beaver content whatsoever!

I think I've even found a few "Transition" logos between decades.

This one between the 30's and 40's

And this one between the 40's and 50's

Dated 1949

 

[Lefty]

When I saw this 1909 letterhead, it immediately made me think of the photos you posts of Douglas and feltfan's hats. I think it's just the way that "Fine Felt Hats" arches that drew my attention to it.

Here's what it looked like in 1911.

 

[GWD]

*When all else fails, look to a primary source.*
Debbie Henderson isn't a primary source, but she's got a few included within Hat Talk. In the appendix, on page 139, she has reproduced a portion of a 1922 Stetson wholesale catalog, where retailers can order hats by the dozen. Of the twenty some hats that are listed, most are available in only 3 to 4 qualities. The "Hi-5", however, is available in all but 1 of the 10 qualities, with prices per dozen as follows:

Select Quality: $54
Excellent Quality(new to me): $63
No. 1 Quality: (unavailable for this hat)
Extra Quality: $72
Nutria Quality: $84
Real Nutria Quality: $96
3x Beaver Quality: $120
4x Beaver Quality: $144
5x Beaver Quality: $240
7x Beaver Quality: $288

Unfortunately, Henderson doesn't reproduce the entire catalog. However, from the hats shown, it is clear that it's not solely a western catalog. Derbies, soft homburgs, fedoras and westerns are included in the few pages of the catalog that are reproduced. The Hi-5 model is not shown on those pages.

I just stumbled across this. Excellent Quality Liner.

 

[Colby Jack]

I'll need to get some pics of the liner in my odd ball Whippet to post here...

 

[Lefty]

Nice. I think it's the only example of that quality level on the Lounge, and the logos are great.

Using my amazing powers (I also have not-so-amazing powers, such as using a can opener), I can deduce that the liner shown is from a size 7 1/2 size hat.

I just stumbled across this. Excellent Quality Liner.

 

[DOUGLAS]

I'm fairly confident about the "Logo/Crest" dates.

But you're right. I don't even know if my "Premier" has any beaver content whatsoever!

I think I've even found a few "Transition" logos between decades.

This one between the 30's and 40's

One of the two of this type I have is a zypher weight with a mode edge. The sweat is also folded back on its self. This type of hat has been very difficult for me to find. The felt is supurb and seems to have started the " Royal Stetson " name as a model and not a quality designation.

 

[DOUGLAS]

Some more logos- stolen from another thread. There are so many different logos Stetson used, and so many subtle variations within the same logo over the years, it's amazing. I'll try to put different logos and quality designations up as I find them.

Look at the different stitching used on the sweatbands here. I don't know which is older, I just think it's interesting.

One's IIIIIIIIIII
One's VVVVVV

On the non Clear Nutria model it also has these markings

It also has an actual reed in the sweat.

 

[Levallois]

Where does this logo fit in?

 

[Lefty]

It looks just like this one to me, and I'd also venture to guess that it goes with a black, size 7 hat.

 

[randooch]

Sovereign

I have one on the way, and wonder in terms of its age when Stetson stopped making that model. Lots to research here in Hatworld, and some of you might consider collaborating on a book. A search for the topic on Abebooks.com netted zero.

 

[Lefty]

The sovereign is a bit of a confusing hat. Sometimes it's a model, sometimes it's a quality designation. Check out this thread.

 

[Levallois]

It looks just like this one to me, and I'd also venture to guess that it goes with a black, size 7 hat.

Lefty - is does and since we can't list current ebay auctions I can't tell the group which one. I had just never seen it on the leather band before.

John

 

[Lefty]

I wasn't criticizing, I just failed to include one of these guys . The leather is new to me as well. That's only the second time I've seen the excellent quality designation, which seems a bit odd, as it's on the lower end of that 1922 price list. Both select (one lower) and no. 1 (one higher) are pretty common by comparison. Maybe Excellent was replaced by Standard, but who knows?

 

[Levallois]

Lefty,

No problem - I didn't take it that way. Interesting observation about the "Excellent Quality" hats - the designations that were used really don't make much sense to me.

John

 

[Lefty]

Special fell between 3x and 4x based upon the prices in this 1932 ad.

 

[jimmy the lid]

That's a great find, Lefty. :eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap

What's also interesting to me is that the pre-war prices were pretty darn close to where things wound up around 1945. It appears that there was a significant price drop during the 1940-1945 timeframe (perhaps it started even earlier -- late 30s?).

Cheers,
JtL

 

[GWD]

Thanks Lefty! That's a greatly informative ad!

Compared from 1922

Select Quality
Excellent Quality
No. 1 Quality
Extra Quality
Nutria Quality
Real Nutria Quality
3x Beaver Quality
4x Beaver Quality
5x Beaver Quality
7x Beaver Quality

to 1932

Excellent Quality
Nutria Quality
Real Nutria Quality
3x Beaver Quality
Stetson Special Quality
4x Beaver Quality
5x Beaver Quality
7x Beaver Quality

I also have a Superior Quality Straw Boater from the 30's and a Standard Quality Derby from the 30's

 

[Justdog]

No open road or clear beaver designations

Does anyone here have a Stetson "Fifteen, Twenty, Twenty-Five, Fifty or One Hundred that isn't a Clear Beaver or Open Road?

I'm working on a theory.

Yes, A (15 3x) a 20 Sovereign and a 100

 

[carter]

I have a Twenty Soverign Mode Edge.