Some Basic Questions about Watches.

[Worf]

I've been here for some time. I've got my jackets just about covered, I'm starting to get into hats and caps and the boots I've had down since I was first issued a pair by Uncle Sugar. Watches however are almost a total mystery to me. I know that you've Rolex on one end and Timex on the other but I'm looking at something in-between. So I've a list of questions I'd like you kind folks to help me with. I did do a search and read many posts about watches here so it's not that I'm lazy.

1. Brands - I've been looking at Omegas and some of the Japanese marks. Any brands in mid-pack I should be looking at in particular?

2. Pawn shop vs. Ebay - I've bought my fair share of gear on the bay over the years so I've no hesitation about going there. However, there are advantages to trying on stuff. Which is preferable for jewelry?

3. Vintage vs. Modern Fake Vintage - The eternal conundrum. As a musician I own some pretty old and valuable instruments ('68 Fender Jazz, '68 Gibson Recording Bass, 72 Plexi Renaissance) the question is do you play it and risk destroying it or devaluing it OR do you make it a "hanger queen" and play lesser instruments? Same thing with a watch I suppose. Wear a vintage, valuable piece of gear and risk losing or destroying it vs. going fakey and wear a lesser piece of kit?

Thanks in advance for you answers.

Worf

 

[esteban68]

I've got almost all of my 40+ collection from car boots and Ebay, rarely paid nore than a tenner(UK), I got an Omega seamaster from Freecycle...honestly and it IS genuine!!!
I have a few 'retro' quartz which almost get the look right but most are wind up or automatics, beware of older watches claiming to be waterproof they are not! resistant possibly but not proof for that you'll need one with a screw down crown and no other pusher buttons.
Vintage and retro Russian and Chinese watches from the 50's to the 80's are a good bet and usually cheap and also very reliable, don't believe much of the hype out there against them and in favour of Swiss stuff I have it all and truthfully there's little difference, my late 60's 18k Omega Constellation keeps time no better than my mid 60's Russian Poljot.
60's Seiko's are good but can be pricey as can British makes like Smiths et al.

Take a look at this forum they will help you in all honesty I think it's the best watch forum online as there's little if any BS on it!
Omegas give quite a bit of bang for your buck, look out for stainless ones you can pick late 60's seamasters etc up off the bay from reputable sellers for around £250 upwards
http://www.thewatchforum.co.uk/index.php?act=idx

 

[karhu21]

As far as the guitar issue goes Worf, Buddy Guy had an old Strat with which he made his name with. As the guitar was somewhat
beat up and valuable he decided not to take it out on the road and one night while he was away touring the guitar was stolen!
He advised Walter Trout (who has a similar guitar) to keep playing them!!
You could of course alternate with the vintage and the new therefore getting the best of both worlds.
As for the issue of the watches I can´t help you there but our comrades sure will!

Cheers!

 

[HudsonHawk]

A couple of thoughts...

1. I don't think Rolex and Timex are the two bookends, though they certainly represent vastly different price points. Still, lots of good things in between. You mentioned Omega, and they make fine watches. Are you loooking for a dress watch or a sport watch? In regards to the latter, I think TAG Heuer and Tissot make some nice sport watches in the "in between" price range, thought they are certainly more "modern".

2. I do not buy clothes, hats, watches, or things I have to try on via the internet. I find them too personal of choices to make site unseen. It would be like buying a guitar without playing it first. Just my little quirk.

3. I'm not much into the vintage thing. If that's what you're going for, I would try to find a true vintage piece. You'll likely find it more to your taste and the quality will likely be as good, if not better. On a side note, where would you be wearing a watch that you risk destroying it?

 

[Worf]

To HH - Although I'm set to retire in 10 months I work inspecting electric and gas line construction, not the piddly run a gas line to mum's distribution lines but LARGE cross-country transmission lines. It can be nasty, sweaty, dangerous work. I don't head out as often as I used to I've little, yellow minions for that (I wish) but I am bouncing about on the Right of Way or walking on foot so the watch has to be able to "take it"!

Worf

 

[esteban68]

well Worf to be honest then I'd look for an all stainless two dollar quartz Accurist or it's American equivalent from a car boot /yard sale...that's what I did and I've had mine for around 6 or so years taken everything I've thrown at it from rock climbing, mountain and road biking, gardening decorating etc, etc..
HH is right Tissot do make some fine watches they also do a VERY nice homage to their own 1950's Visodate for around £300, then there's the Seastars in both stainless and 9ct gold from the 60's and 70's for between £250-£400...I'd get a cheapie for work and a decent 'do it all' vintage when you retire, a divers watch from the 60's 70's would be a good bet as they are generally watertight and shockproof/resistant.

 

[tonypaj]

Ollech & Wajs. Based on ETA movements, mostly. Start from there... They range from very simple stuff to collectibles.

 

[Tomasso]

Omega makes some great watches, every bit as good as Rolex but without the hype. They are both second tier watchmakers but with Rolex you pay top tier prices .

 

[handymike]

Worf,
I'll echo the Omega fans...
You can get some fine vintage ones that don't cost nearly as much as their Rolex counterparts.
I have an old Bulgarian guy who works on my watches once in a while, and he wears a '64 omega...
Swears by them.
On the other hand, I've had a Tag Heuer 2000 Professional that I've worn almost every day for 16 years. It's taken a beating and come out fine. It came with a lifetime battery replacement plan, and that's the only servicing I've had done to it.

 

[Foxer55]

Worf,

1. Brands - I've been looking at Omegas and some of the Japanese marks. Any brands in mid-pack I should be looking at in particular?

2. Pawn shop vs. Ebay - I've bought my fair share of gear on the bay over the years so I've no hesitation about going there. However, there are advantages to trying on stuff. Which is preferable for jewelry?

3. Vintage vs. Modern Fake Vintage - The eternal conundrum. As a musician I own some pretty old and valuable instruments ('68 Fender Jazz, '68 Gibson Recording Bass, 72 Plexi Renaissance) the question is do you play it and risk destroying it or devaluing it OR do you make it a "hanger queen" and play lesser instruments? Same thing with a watch I suppose. Wear a vintage, valuable piece of gear and risk losing or destroying it vs. going fakey and wear a lesser piece of kit?

I'm going to answer all your question with one watch: Tudor. Tudor was at one time a Rolex watch, their second shelf brand and it was a doozy. It emulated Rolex in many ways, was just as durable, the original Tudors are just as valuable as Rolex, and is a distinctive watch. They were half the price of a Rolex. And still are in many cases. Buying a used Tudor shows a lot of discrimination in watches. A used one will cost you anywhere from $500 up into the thousands. There are several sites on the web to get them, I bought one from eBay and another from Torneau. Stop by Torneau, they have excellent used watches in their inventory. Get to know some watch dealers by talking to them before buying.

Unfortunately, Tudor spilt off from Rolex some years ago and has become its own brand carried in this country by Torneau. I would NOT buy a new Tudor, I'm unimpressed with their knew style and they no longer have the Rolex cache or value. Get a used Tudor from the time before their exit from Rolex.

Some Tudor watches below. The third one is a beautiful 1949 model that now commands a price of about $1000 USD and would be an excellent dress watch.

 

[Worf]

Thanks for the love fellahs you've given me a lot to look at and chew over. You folks are the greatest!

Worf

 

[Edward]

With the caveat that I don't hold myself out as an expert, but I am most certainly opinionated, and, hey, this is the interwebz...

1. Brands - I've been looking at Omegas and some of the Japanese marks. Any brands in mid-pack I should be looking at in particular?

Hamilton look great to me. Roamer also seem to do really nice watches, but I've never tried one.

2. Pawn shop vs. Ebay - I've bought my fair share of gear on the bay over the years so I've no hesitation about going there. However, there are advantages to trying on stuff. Which is preferable for jewelry?

I'd stick with the shop (unless you're getting a deal that's crazy good, but not so crazy good as to be suspicious), myself. You can try it on, get a feel for it, closer inspection for any cosmetic flaws... and it's a whole lot easier to go back and bang a real-world salesdesk if it turns out they've sold you something off.

3. Vintage vs. Modern Fake Vintage - The eternal conundrum. As a musician I own some pretty old and valuable instruments ('68 Fender Jazz, '68 Gibson Recording Bass, 72 Plexi Renaissance) the question is do you play it and risk destroying it or devaluing it OR do you make it a "hanger queen" and play lesser instruments? Same thing with a watch I suppose. Wear a vintage, valuable piece of gear and risk losing or destroying it vs. going fakey and wear a lesser piece of kit?

I hear you entirely on this one. For me, vintage stuff does have a certain appeal, but I', also firmly of the belief that Fender are building better, more consistently, of those old designs (i.e. 57RI, et cetera) now than ever they did pre-CBS. My answer to this is threefold... By all means, have that irreplaceable, high-end vintage piece you really, really want, but have a modern reproduction (or as near as dammit) for more regular wear. For the day to day onsites, I'd suggest one of those Russian options, like a Vostok, or a Seiko Military Automatic 5. Something that's a good, solid watch but isn't the end of the world to replace if needsbe. Used Sekondas can be good for that, in my experience.

I've got almost all of my 40+ collection from car boots and Ebay, rarely paid nore than a tenner(UK), I got an Omega seamaster from Freecycle...honestly and it IS genuine!!!

Jinkies... that's a score. I'd love to be in a position to be able to think about just giving away something so valuable!

I have a few 'retro' quartz which almost get the look right but most are wind up or automatics, beware of older watches claiming to be waterproof they are not! resistant possibly but not proof for that you'll need one with a screw down crown and no other pusher buttons.
Vintage and retro Russian and Chinese watches from the 50's to the 80's are a good bet and usually cheap and also very reliable, don't believe much of the hype out there against them and in favour of Swiss stuff I have it all and truthfully there's little difference, my late 60's 18k Omega Constellation keeps time no better than my mid 60's Russian Poljot.

Absolutely agree on the Russian watches front. I've got a couple of the Vostok military type (one automatic, one hand-winding). Cracking watches. I wouldn't bother looking at anything else, hardly, just for a utilitarian day to day timepiece.

A half-decent Quartz, of course, will always keep better time than even the very most expensive mechanical, but... eh. I don't claim it to be at all rational, but I much prefer to have something mechanical on my arm that requires no other powersource. (Also cheaper in the long run - if you want to have more than one or two watches, the cost of batteries in a lump every couple of years soon shoots up... and years ago I had a nice dress watch that happened to be quartz - left it forgotten for a couple of years when it went flat, and the battery had somehow leaked, killing the movement). If I have to put up with my main day to day wear watch of the last couple of years (a Pulsar Automatic - Pulsar is Japanese made, by Seiko) gaining five minutes a week, so be it - I'm all the more on time by Friday. ;-) I should also add that every watch I have ever worn runs a few minutes fast after a week or two, so it may be me...

As far as the guitar issue goes Worf, Buddy Guy had an old Strat with which he made his name with. As the guitar was somewhat
beat up and valuable he decided not to take it out on the road and one night while he was away touring the guitar was stolen!

Ha! That's not a story I've heard before! Funny. I know fear of it being stolen in the end was a key reason why Gary Moore sold the Peter Green LP.

Omega makes some great watches, every bit as good as Rolex but without the hype. They are both second tier watchmakers but with Rolex you pay top tier prices .

I agree. Rolexes just haven't especially been my thing design wise, but the brand itself is a big turn off for me - such a cliche. Again, I don't claim this to be a rational decision, but the slightly subtler note of Omega being just a little bit less of a 'look at this!' brand would affect me. [huh]

 

[Shangas]

1. Brands - I've been looking at Omegas and some of the Japanese marks. Any brands in mid-pack I should be looking at in particular?

2. Pawn shop vs. Ebay - I've bought my fair share of gear on the bay over the years so I've no hesitation about going there. However, there are advantages to trying on stuff. Which is preferable for jewelry?

3. Vintage vs. Modern Fake Vintage - The eternal conundrum. As a musician I own some pretty old and valuable instruments ('68 Fender Jazz, '68 Gibson Recording Bass, 72 Plexi Renaissance) the question is do you play it and risk destroying it or devaluing it OR do you make it a "hanger queen" and play lesser instruments? Same thing with a watch I suppose. Wear a vintage, valuable piece of gear and risk losing or destroying it vs. going fakey and wear a lesser piece of kit?

1. There are loads of good-quality brands, but quality is never cheap. Omega is certainly one of them. Then there are loads of others. Ball is also well-respected. As is Tissot, and a whole bundle of European manufacturers. I daresay Patek, Philippe & Co. is the MOST expensive, not Rolex. PP&C could run rings around the stuff Rolex produces.

2. It's up to you. Yes, there are advantages to 'try-before-buy', but this is really personal thing, in my opinion.

3. I'm a FIRM believer in not buying paperweights. I refuse to buy something that I won't use at least four times a year. If all you're gonna do with your watch is put it in a glass case - then don't buy it. You're wasting your money.

 

[karhu21]

Edward,
On the guitar issue Buddy stated in Guitar Player some years back whilst talking about the Fender Buddy Guy Strats that the sunburst did indeed
get nicked. As for Gary Moore (RIP) selling the ´Greeny´ Les Paul its hard to blame the guy.
I agree that the quality of Fender products is way ahead nowadays and saves you from taking a vintage piece out on the road.
I agree with your opinion on the watch issue.

 

[handymike]

If you are looking for a watch that can take a couple of hits here and there, I'd recommend one with a Sapphire crystal. Most vintage watches (I don't know until when) have plexi or plastic crystals which scratch and crack easily. I have
a few
very cool vintage watches but I'm afraid to wear them on the job for this very reason.

 

[Worf]

I see a LOT of watches are being sold on the bay from behind the former Iron Curtain and Hong Kong... Can these folks be trusted?

Worf

 

[handymike]

Be careful to read the fine print!
There are certain things I see a lot of that devalue the watch like re-dials. Which is replacing the dial or completely repainting it. Also, make sure the hands are correct. Lots of "restored" watches are pieced together with whatever parts are on hand...
I think there are reputable sellers all over the world, but many crooks as well....

 

[HudsonHawk]

I see a LOT of watches are being sold on the bay from behind the former Iron Curtain and Hong Kong... Can these folks be trusted?

Worf

Just remember...if it sounds too good to be true, it probably isn't.

 

[Tomasso]

The watch forums (Timezone, Watchuseek, ThePurist, etc..) all have a sales corner where you can generally get preowned watches in very good condition at a fair price. A good many are hardly worn newer pieces.

 

[Short Balding Guy]

Worf; I suggest looking into a local watch dealer who carries used watches that will offer some warrenties on them.

I am no watch expert other than knowing my purchases. The watches brands and models I have purchased the majority of the info on came from my own looking. I have purchased new and used from a local dealer. I have purchased from the internet sites, internet retail sites and ebay. My experience has shown that purchasing from a local dealer who carries used and will offer warrenties ROCK. From this particular local dealer I have purchased vtg Tudor, Omega and Patek watches. Since I knew very little about them going thru the dealer was a wise idea. Even better a couple of the watches had been serviced at the request of the dealer. The replaced gaskets and a spring perhaps would have failded and cost me tons. I have no problems wearing a "used watch." In my eye, watches can be like an auto were when you buy a new car and drive off the car lot the value slips a notch right away. As to purchasing new, over 20 years ago I had purchased some Rolex watches (Explorer and Datejust) and they have been workhorse watches for me. Today they could sell for more than I paid for them.

The watches I have purchased are aquired to wear and because I like them. I am not collecting and have not owned more than a handfull at a time. Buying watches are not a hobby and I while I have tried to do dillegence by gathering info, I long ago decided to trust a local expert for the bigger purchases.

Worf, I hope the reflections of my experiences offers some assistance.

Best, Eric -