Smoking in England banned from July 1st...

[warbird]

Are you saying that we cannot trust people so the government should make the decisions for us?! Trotsky would be proud. :eusa_doh:
The people who smoke nowadays and even as far back as the inception of smoking for that matter, knew it was bad for them. The only thing worse we could do is package them in small coffins with the brand name Death on it.
You left out the simple decision that people can just walk away from the smoke if they don't want to be exposed to it. That is the most logical. I just wouldn't go to places where they smoke like chimneys if it bothered me. [huh]
All of those crimes you mentioned are in fact already outlawed. There is already a penalty. Though I wonder why you would put a murderer, rapist and thief in the same category as a smoker. :eusa_doh: Smoking is legal and so is tobacco.
I suppose Animal Farm and 1984 are just around the corner with this kind of attitude. Some people are just more equal than others.
I judge our society based on how we treat those that are in the minority of opinion and action. Smokers are as such by your statistics. They sure are being treated badly in this proposed action. Not a good sign. :eusa_doh:

Regards,

J

Very well stated. It is sad when people no longer care about freedoms of others.

 

[moustache]

Isn't this fun!!!

I love debate.

JD

 

[moustache]

You left out the simple decision that people can just walk away from the smoke if they don't want to be exposed to it.


Regards,

J

The smoke follows you

Glad we can debate without causing offense.Shows maturity.

JD

 

[warbird]

The smoke follows you

Glad we can debate without causing offense.Shows maturity.

JD

LOL lol The smoke follows you. Classic.

 

[Edward]

I'm a great believer in smokers having the freedom to make the informed choice to damage their own health. There is a lot to be said for what they do to clog up the NHS, but on the other hand so much of the cost of a packet of fags is tax, they probably balance it out, in fairness. They make the choice to smoke themselves, they know the risks. The only time I would let the stage "force" them to give up would be if they need medical treatment that is unlikely to succeed or will be substantially hindered if they don't give up. Then it's just about sensible use of limited resources.

I do beleive the ban is reasonable - nobody is forcing them to give up smoking, their freedom is merely being limited in an entirely reasonable way in order to prevent it from impniging upon the freedom of others to be able to go out for the night and not breathe in the second hand smoke, which does do significant harm. Absolutely I agree that we also need to deal with fumes from cars and other potentially harmful issues, but why do nothing about one harm just because they're not rushing to do something about others?

If smoking were not unavoidably damaging to health, expensive, and smelly, I might take it up. It does look cool as heck, you are never alone with a Strand, and it's so very, very noir.... but frankly, the downsides just aren't worth it for me. for some costume looks (see my avatar) i do use fakes, heh.

I'm really looking forward to going out for the night and not having to launder otherwise perfectly clean clothes the next day because they smell like an ashtray, not having stinging eyes, not having to work around my glasses for a look because it's too smokey to wear contacts.... for those arguably selfish reasons, I can't wait. I do honestly believe it's one of those things that will make a big fuss for ten minutes, then be accepted. And hey, if it means that more of the smokers I know and care about give it up, so much the better - I'd like for people I like not to be doing that to their health!

 

[jamespowers]

The smoke follows you

Glad we can debate without causing offense.Shows maturity.

JD

Is that like Smoke Gets in Your Eyes?

Regards,

J

 

[JazzBaby]

Smokers in Ireland have spent the last 2 years getting used to this. At first people were completely against it and it was THE topic of conversation between smokers hanging around the front and back doors. This summer I've noticed that people don't have a thing to say about it any more, in fact a lot of smokers are happy to oblige and I've heard comments that being forced outside has created an entirely new way to meet people. I find that I've met more people outside having a fag than I sometimes do on the inside of a noisey, crowded pub.

No one likes change and people will moan about it until something new to moan about comes along. Even as a smoker I prefer the no smoking law. There's nothing that ruins your appetite faster than the sour rancid smell of old smoke.

The only annoying thing is the weather. I'm ashamed to say I would withstand the pouring rain and blistering cold just for a fag

 

[moustache]

Is that like Smoke Gets in Your Eyes?

Regards,

J

Most of the time it does.Then i cry lol lol

JD

 

[Tomasso]

I would withstand the pouring rain and blistering cold just for a fag

JB, would you brave this for a few puffs?

 

[moustache]

JB, would you brave this for a few puffs?

lol lol

JD

 

[Helen Troy]

I'm a smoker. Norway has had a anti-smoking law since 2004 , and I love it! I don't have to stink coming home from town, and I now only smoke the cigarettes that I want (because I have to step outside the bar,) and not just absent-mindedly smoking 20 in a night.

And it makes sense to me that I have no right to contribute to long cancer for the people working in bars.

Before the smoking-law was effected in Norway, it caused a HUGE debate: Smokers was in outrage, bar-owners complained that they would lose business, because nobody would go out anymore, etc. Then, when all smoking in bars, restaurants and cafes got banned, it was no trouble at all. Everybody is happy, there is no protest anymore, no problem at all!

 

[Fleur De Guerre]

The main worry for me comes from reports from places where the smoking ban was recently introduced, during the period after the ban, but before pub/club owners have forked out for refurbishment, you realise what the smoke smell is disguising. Other disgusting smells that stem from nights of drinking and excess!

 

[MrPumpernickel]

Smoking has been banned here in Sweden in bars and restaurants too for a while now.

What I don't get though is that the ban also is active for cigar clubs, so if those guys want to have a cigar testing, perhaps with a good brandy and relaxing piano tunes they can't. You can drink and listen to music, but don't you dare light that cigar inside...even though everyone there surely is a smoker.

Even though I'm not a smoker (of cigarettes anyway) and even though I like going to smoke free venues I do think it should be upto either the property owner or the club/bar etc owner to dictate the rules that go in that perticular venue. If they have smoking allowed, and is rather smoky, they may lose by business but may very well gain someone elses.

I haven't seen any signs that people stop smoking here in Sweden anyway, the only thing which has been cut down is the chain smoking in bars and clubs, since one now has to go outside to light a fag. Other than that people smoke just as much or as little as before.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

JB, would you brave this for a few puffs?

Ah, the old Aberta Clipper. how I miss 'em

bk

 

[RedPop4]

It is shocking how, as scotrace mentioned back on page 1, that there is almost no middle ground on this issue. I mean we have smokers on this thread thanking Nanny State for helping them cut back, as well as saying "my smoke is OK, but others' is not....."

But anyway, I find it interesting that the politicians have caved so far on this issue. I'm with those on this thread who believes it's up to the owners of private establishments to decide. But the polis have caved completely on this issue. I rarely if ever hear of a middle position being advocated. Why not simply permit or license smoking? If the owner doesn't want to shell out thousands or more, depending upon location to renovate a building, why not let them by a smoking permit for their establishment? There's revenue to be made there, much like liquor licensing.

Oh, and it's been my understanding that food service/hospitality employees smoke more than almost any other group or profession. But I don't have those numbers at my fingertips.

Singer Joe Jackson has written a fairly detailed and empassioned piece concerning smoking bans.

Read it Here

 

[Baron Kurtz]

This smoking ban was VOTED in by the people.Not the state government.
And they spoke clearly.Thats democracy is it not??

JD

That's interesting. That's how it should be . . . have a vote. Fairest way round the issue. Of course then you get into "tyranny of the majority" territory. (Territory which can fairly be described as choppy waters on your side of the Atlantic. i don't recall even hearing the term elsewhere).

Interesting that this part of your response has been glossed over.

bk

 

[warbird]

This smoking ban was VOTED in by the people.Not the state government.
And they spoke clearly.Thats democracy is it not??

JD

The US of A is NOT a democracy.

 

[The Wingnut]

Indeed, it is a democratic republic. But try explaining that to people who can't name our first president, the year the Declaration of Independence was signed, how many stripes are in the flag and what colors the top and bottom stripes are without looking at a picture, and can't tell the difference between 'freedom' and 'liberty'.

 

[Ben]

The one thing I miss about having smoking in restaurants is that it was often a de facto child-free section. I think kids are great, but there have been times when you go to a place there are a lot of them running amok. But parents wanting to keep their kids away from second hand smoke would avoid the smoking section.

Many times if you were some place early enough in the day, which is when kids were more likely to be there, you didn't have smokers or kids to deal with.

 

[anabolina]

Yeah Dallas banned smoking in bars and resturants too and from what I understand from working in a hotel, its definitely reduced the number of conventions happening in Dallas. What I like about the smoking section is its much easier to get a table in it during busy times. A couple months ago I took my brother to breakfast at IHop, not noticing it was during Mesquite's spring break. We though we'd have to wait forever for a sat since the parking lot was full and we had to park on the street, but no, we were seated right away in the smoking section, vs having to wait with the dozen or so other people for a non-smoking table.

Frnkly I think its people's choice to smoke and if I don't want to inhale smoke, I can eat elsewhere and there are a lot of eating establishments and employees that mind the smoking can work at those that don't allow smoking too.

I think you're right Redpop4, I've worked in hotel and restaurants, and most of my coworkers in those jobs have been smokers.

Laters