Sam Walker Highway Man

[Johnny Deadlifts]

Hey Folks, I just acquired this Sam Walker Highway Man a couple of days ago. I've read most of the threads on this forum about these jackets and their checkered past. I'm struggling to determine if it's steer or horse hide. It weighs in at 5.8lbs and feels very stiff but not to the point were it's uncomfortable to wear. It's my first jacket of this caliber so I don't have a point of reference. Any thoughts? And also what colour would this be? Thanks for your time.

 

[AeroFan_07]

Interesting jacket. I think this thread discusess it in more detail:

What's the real deal with Sam Walker jackets?

For about a year and a half I've been looking to Sam Walker jackets as a less expensive alternate to Aero. But one just sold for $600!!! So, apart from the politics of whatever happened years back between the two businesses (Aero/Sam Walker)- Can anyone here speak to the details of the jackets...

www.thefedoralounge.com

 

[handymike]

I had one just like this and I’m certain it was cow not horse, but yes it was pretty stiff. The color is brown- nothing fancy unless you want to call it “seal”.

 

[yellowfever]

TL/DR It’s a nice decent quality mid-brown jacket. It will almost certainly be cowhide or steerhide leather. Enjoy it and don’t get too worried about the cult of horsehide…. it’s not the be all and end all…

I think that, short of professional DNA or microscopic analysis by a professional lab, there is only one reasonably accurate way to determine if a garment is made from horsehide leather: it clearly says so on the label.

From time to time on this website people post close up shots of various leathers asking people to guess what type of leather they are. It’s a fun game, but even given the level of knowledge of people on here, it is essentially a guessing game. Sure, some leather, like goat leather, has a type of grain that is pretty obvious. But horse vs steer or cow? I’m not sure anyone does better than chance in the long run when trying to tell these apart…

If there‘s a label present and it doesn’t explicitly say it’s horsehide, it almost certainly is not (regardless of the nonsense unscrupulous second hand jacket sellers all too often write, hoping to increase the selling price). Horsehide tends to attract a premium and did so even years back when horses (and hence horsehide leather) were more common. Hence makers were (and are) keen to point it out if it’s made of horsehide via labels to help sell jackets at a higher price.

Of course if there’s no label at all in the jacket anymore (or it never had one in the first place eg some old USA jackets made for the police) and it’s an old vintage jacket (maybe <1960 - hardware and jacket design can offer clues to help date jackets) then there’s a chance maybe it’s horsehide, but you’ll never really know for sure, short of taking it to a lab. It could just as well be steerhide or cowhide.

So if it doesn’t say “horsehide’ then assume it isn’t and pay accordingly. But also don’t get too hung up on the horsehide cult. There’s nothing especially magical about horsehide in and of itself. Horsehide leather can be amazing but it can also be underwhelming. Tanning, hide selection, finishing and various other factors make a big difference to the appearance, handle/drape and evolution of leather too, not just the base animal it came from. Not to mention personal preferences on what you like! Some people think smooth grained leather looks plasticy, others that wrinkled or heavily grained leather is defective and shouldn’t have passed quality control! It’s horses for courses

Lots of super impressive jackets are made from other leathers. Vanson’s competition weight cowhide leather (especially from back in the day) is justly revered (and importantly it works in a motorbike crash - I’ve personally tested it in a 100mph track day off). And some of the most amazing vintage jackets with fantastic graining and patina you’ll see on this website are clearly labelled steerhide. No doubt that horsehide jackets can be really amazing too, but there are also plenty of horsehide jackets that are stiff, uncomfortable and/or uninspiring or bland and plastic looking…. Being constructed from horsehide leather is no guarantee of an amazing jacket.

So my advice is that if you like a jacket and the look and feel of the leather it’s made from and the price, buy it and wear it and enjoy it and don’t obsess too much about which animal the hide came from. I think the Sam Walker jacket you‘ve got is a very decent jacket regardless of the leather it’s made from. It’s certainly far superior to the cheap lamb skin mall jackets that most people wear (if they wear leather jackets at all).

As to the specifics of Sam Walker, there are varied views as you‘ve read. For whatever it’s worth, I personally think it is plausible that they were made by aero at least for a time and the quality of the Sam Walker jackets I’ve personally seen is good (I own 3 plus a pair of Sam Walker leather jeans). I’ve got:

1) A size 40 knee length 3 button single breasted slim cut trench/gangster type jacket in lovely good quality heavy grained black leather with a nylon lining. It has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it. In my opinion it’s a well constructed and patterned piece. it’s a bit meaningless to guess the leather given what I’ve said about the difficulties in determining the leather type used without using a lab. But If I was having a guess for the hell of it, I’d say it was steerhide. It weighs in at 2120g, so despite having a tlightweight lining it is fairly heavy. Of course that’s partly because it’s a longer length jacket. But for comparison my similar length but double breasted and heavy wool blanket lined Pegasus trench coat made from horsehide is 2910g

2) A size 38, hip length blazer style jacket in lovely characterful dark reddish brown leather with a lightweight nylon lining. Has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it. Again the quality of materials and. construction is good, albeit it was well used when I got it second hand so it has some ‘patina’ (which for me adds to its charms). It weighs in at 1560g, so it is one of my lightest jackets. Again, just for fun, I’d guess cowhide or maybe steerhide.

3) A size 40 in the classic aero ‘highwayman’ style (sadly including the notorious aero oversize sizing - this is more like a 44/46! - so it doesn’t fit me, but I’ve not yet got around to selling it on). It has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it, but it also has a second small label with “all wool lining” “hand crafted in Great Britain“ and “the finest leather jackets in the world” written on it. It’s a tartan wool lined black leather jacket with internal knit storm cuffs, size 10 heavy talon brass main zip and other quality brass hardware.. it looks very similar to yours barring the different lining/leather colour. This one weighs in at 2780g so just a tad heavier than yours.. The leather on this has that lovely fine grain with slight waxiness that I tend to associate with horsehide (maybe because it has a similar appearance and feel to my horsehide Pegasus jacket) but then the yoke has lovely deep wrinkled grains that I often associate with steerhide (albeit a vanson horsehide jacket I own has a heavily grained and wrinkled panel that looks like this too). Of course, once again, all this is just foolish unfounded speculation on my part… given the label doesn’t mention horsehide I’d say it’s steerhide or cowhide.

As I said, I also own a pair of Sam Walker leather jeans. Interestingly these were advertised as ‘horsehide’ and I was all set to email the seller asking on what basis he was claiming them to be horsehide. Most immediately crumble on being called on their unsupported speculation. But then I noticed with surprise that the Sam Walker Flying togs label in the photos clearly stated “Genuine horsehide” in the part where it normally said “genuine quality hide”!

This clearly supports my earlier contention that if it’s horsehide the label will clearly say so! Hence the view that all my Sam Walker jackets are steerhide or cowhide, given there’s clear evidence Sam Walker at least sometimes mentioned horsehide on its label when it’s made with horsehide leather.

Despite the horsehide label I actually managed to get these jeans for a great price (I guess jeans are more niche) and the leather is wonderful fine grained mid-weight horsehide very comfortable and perfect for jeans. They weigh 1470g. Interestingly I also own some aero leathers steerhide jeans which are of very similar design, feel thicker and heavier weight, but actually weigh almost exactly the same at 1490g!

Well I got rather carried away there! But I hope it was nonetheless of interest. I would say this given I own a few, but overall I think Sam Walker generally offers a decent quality/price proposition, so they are certainly worthy of consideration.

 

[Marc mndt]

TL/DR It’s a nice decent quality mid-brown jacket. It will almost certainly be cowhide or steerhide leather. Enjoy it and don’t get too worried about the cult of horsehide…. it’s not the be all and end all…

I think that, short of professional DNA or microscopic analysis by a professional lab, there is only one reasonably accurate way to determine if a garment is made from horsehide leather: it clearly says so on the label.

From time to time on this website people post close up shots of various leathers asking people to guess what type of leather they are. It’s a fun game, but even given the level of knowledge of people on here, it is essentially a guessing game. Sure, some leather, like goat leather, has a type of grain that is pretty obvious. But horse vs steer or cow? I’m not sure anyone does better than chance in the long run when trying to tell these apart…

If there‘s a label present and it doesn’t explicitly say it’s horsehide, it almost certainly is not (regardless of the nonsense unscrupulous second hand jacket sellers all too often write, hoping to increase the selling price). Horsehide tends to attract a premium and did so even years back when horses (and hence horsehide leather) were more common. Hence makers were (and are) keen to point it out if it’s made of horsehide via labels to help sell jackets at a higher price.

Of course if there’s no label at all in the jacket anymore (or it never had one in the first place eg some old USA jackets made for the police) and it’s an old vintage jacket (maybe <1960 - hardware and jacket design can offer clues to help date jackets) then there’s a chance maybe it’s horsehide, but you’ll never really know for sure, short of taking it to a lab. It could just as well be steerhide or cowhide.

So if it doesn’t say “horsehide’ then assume it isn’t and pay accordingly. But also don’t get too hung up on the horsehide cult. There’s nothing especially magical about horsehide in and of itself. Horsehide leather can be amazing but it can also be underwhelming. Tanning, hide selection, finishing and various other factors make a big difference to the appearance, handle/drape and evolution of leather too, not just the base animal it came from. Not to mention personal preferences on what you like! Some people think smooth grained leather looks plasticy, others that wrinkled or heavily grained leather is defective and shouldn’t have passed quality control! It’s horses for courses

Lots of super impressive jackets are made from other leathers. Vanson’s competition weight cowhide leather (especially from back in the day) is justly revered (and importantly it works in a motorbike crash - I’ve personally tested it in a 100mph track day off). And some of the most amazing vintage jackets with fantastic graining and patina you’ll see on this website are clearly labelled steerhide. No doubt that horsehide jackets can be really amazing too, but there are also plenty of horsehide jackets that are stiff, uncomfortable and/or uninspiring or bland and plastic looking…. Being constructed from horsehide leather is no guarantee of an amazing jacket.

So my advice is that if you like a jacket and the look and feel of the leather it’s made from and the price, buy it and wear it and enjoy it and don’t obsess too much about which animal the hide came from. I think the Sam Walker jacket you‘ve got is a very decent jacket regardless of the leather it’s made from. It’s certainly far superior to the cheap lamb skin mall jackets that most people wear (if they wear leather jackets at all).

As to the specifics of Sam Walker, there are varied views as you‘ve read. For whatever it’s worth, I personally think it is plausible that they were made by aero at least for a time and the quality of the Sam Walker jackets I’ve personally seen is good (I own 3 plus a pair of Sam Walker leather jeans). I’ve got:

1) A size 40 knee length 3 button single breasted slim cut trench/gangster type jacket in lovely good quality heavy grained black leather with a nylon lining. It has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it. In my opinion it’s a well constructed and patterned piece. it’s a bit meaningless to guess the leather given what I’ve said about the difficulties in determining the leather type used without using a lab. But If I was having a guess for the hell of it, I’d say it was steerhide. It weighs in at 2120g, so despite having a tlightweight lining it is fairly heavy. Of course that’s partly because it’s a longer length jacket. But for comparison my similar length but double breasted and heavy wool blanket lined Pegasus trench coat made from horsehide is 2910g

2) A size 38, hip length blazer style jacket in lovely characterful dark reddish brown leather with a lightweight nylon lining. Has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it. Again the quality of materials and. construction is good, albeit it was well used when I got it second hand so it has some ‘patina’ (which for me adds to its charms). It weighs in at 1560g, so it is one of my lightest jackets. Again, just for fun, I’d guess cowhide or maybe steerhide.

3) A size 40 in the classic aero ‘highwayman’ style (sadly including the notorious aero oversize sizing - this is more like a 44/46! - so it doesn’t fit me, but I’ve not yet got around to selling it on). It has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it, but it also has a second small label with “all wool lining” “hand crafted in Great Britain“ and “the finest leather jackets in the world” written on it. It’s a tartan wool lined black leather jacket with internal knit storm cuffs, size 10 heavy talon brass main zip and other quality brass hardware.. it looks very similar to yours barring the different lining/leather colour. This one weighs in at 2780g so just a tad heavier than yours.. The leather on this has that lovely fine grain with slight waxiness that I tend to associate with horsehide (maybe because it has a similar appearance and feel to my horsehide Pegasus jacket) but then the yoke has lovely deep wrinkled grains that I often associate with steerhide (albeit a vanson horsehide jacket I own has a heavily grained and wrinkled panel that looks like this too). Of course, once again, all this is just foolish unfounded speculation on my part… given the label doesn’t mention horsehide I’d say it’s steerhide or cowhide.

As I said, I also own a pair of Sam Walker leather jeans. Interestingly these were advertised as ‘horsehide’ and I was all set to email the seller asking on what basis he was claiming them to be horsehide. Most immediately crumble on being called on their unsupported speculation. But then I noticed with surprise that the Sam Walker Flying togs label in the photos clearly stated “Genuine horsehide” in the part where it normally said “genuine quality hide”!

This clearly supports my earlier contention that if it’s horsehide the label will clearly say so! Hence the view that all my Sam Walker jackets are steerhide or cowhide, given there’s clear evidence Sam Walker at least sometimes mentioned horsehide on its label when it’s made with horsehide leather.

Despite the horsehide label I actually managed to get these jeans for a great price (I guess jeans are more niche) and the leather is wonderful fine grained mid-weight horsehide very comfortable and perfect for jeans. They weigh 1470g. Interestingly I also own some aero leathers steerhide jeans which are of very similar design, feel thicker and heavier weight, but actually weigh almost exactly the same at 1490g!

Well I got rather carried away there! But I hope it was nonetheless of interest. I would say this given I own a few, but overall I think Sam Walker generally offers a decent quality/price proposition, so they are certainly worthy of consideration.

Great post.

 

[yellowfever]

And for those who prefer images to words black gangster coat

 

[yellowfever]

Reddish brown blazer

 

[yellowfever]

black wool lined ‘highwayman’ style

 

[yellowfever]

And the horsehide jeans - with label stating they’re horsehide.

 

[Johnny Deadlifts]

Interesting jacket. I think this thread discusess it in more detail:

What's the real deal with Sam Walker jackets?

For about a year and a half I've been looking to Sam Walker jackets as a less expensive alternate to Aero. But one just sold for $600!!! So, apart from the politics of whatever happened years back between the two businesses (Aero/Sam Walker)- Can anyone here speak to the details of the jackets...

www.thefedoralounge.com

Thanks,

Interesting jacket. I think this thread discusess it in more detail:

What's the real deal with Sam Walker jackets?

For about a year and a half I've been looking to Sam Walker jackets as a less expensive alternate to Aero. But one just sold for $600!!! So, apart from the politics of whatever happened years back between the two businesses (Aero/Sam Walker)- Can anyone here speak to the details of the jackets...

www.thefedoralounge.com

Thank you, like many items from the past there's always a multitude of versions of a story that are told; makes owning and pursuing these items that much more enjoyable.

 

[Johnny Deadlifts]

TL/DR It’s a nice decent quality mid-brown jacket. It will almost certainly be cowhide or steerhide leather. Enjoy it and don’t get too worried about the cult of horsehide…. it’s not the be all and end all…

I think that, short of professional DNA or microscopic analysis by a professional lab, there is only one reasonably accurate way to determine if a garment is made from horsehide leather: it clearly says so on the label.

From time to time on this website people post close up shots of various leathers asking people to guess what type of leather they are. It’s a fun game, but even given the level of knowledge of people on here, it is essentially a guessing game. Sure, some leather, like goat leather, has a type of grain that is pretty obvious. But horse vs steer or cow? I’m not sure anyone does better than chance in the long run when trying to tell these apart…

If there‘s a label present and it doesn’t explicitly say it’s horsehide, it almost certainly is not (regardless of the nonsense unscrupulous second hand jacket sellers all too often write, hoping to increase the selling price). Horsehide tends to attract a premium and did so even years back when horses (and hence horsehide leather) were more common. Hence makers were (and are) keen to point it out if it’s made of horsehide via labels to help sell jackets at a higher price.

Of course if there’s no label at all in the jacket anymore (or it never had one in the first place eg some old USA jackets made for the police) and it’s an old vintage jacket (maybe <1960 - hardware and jacket design can offer clues to help date jackets) then there’s a chance maybe it’s horsehide, but you’ll never really know for sure, short of taking it to a lab. It could just as well be steerhide or cowhide.

So if it doesn’t say “horsehide’ then assume it isn’t and pay accordingly. But also don’t get too hung up on the horsehide cult. There’s nothing especially magical about horsehide in and of itself. Horsehide leather can be amazing but it can also be underwhelming. Tanning, hide selection, finishing and various other factors make a big difference to the appearance, handle/drape and evolution of leather too, not just the base animal it came from. Not to mention personal preferences on what you like! Some people think smooth grained leather looks plasticy, others that wrinkled or heavily grained leather is defective and shouldn’t have passed quality control! It’s horses for courses

Lots of super impressive jackets are made from other leathers. Vanson’s competition weight cowhide leather (especially from back in the day) is justly revered (and importantly it works in a motorbike crash - I’ve personally tested it in a 100mph track day off). And some of the most amazing vintage jackets with fantastic graining and patina you’ll see on this website are clearly labelled steerhide. No doubt that horsehide jackets can be really amazing too, but there are also plenty of horsehide jackets that are stiff, uncomfortable and/or uninspiring or bland and plastic looking…. Being constructed from horsehide leather is no guarantee of an amazing jacket.

So my advice is that if you like a jacket and the look and feel of the leather it’s made from and the price, buy it and wear it and enjoy it and don’t obsess too much about which animal the hide came from. I think the Sam Walker jacket you‘ve got is a very decent jacket regardless of the leather it’s made from. It’s certainly far superior to the cheap lamb skin mall jackets that most people wear (if they wear leather jackets at all).

As to the specifics of Sam Walker, there are varied views as you‘ve read. For whatever it’s worth, I personally think it is plausible that they were made by aero at least for a time and the quality of the Sam Walker jackets I’ve personally seen is good (I own 3 plus a pair of Sam Walker leather jeans). I’ve got:

1) A size 40 knee length 3 button single breasted slim cut trench/gangster type jacket in lovely good quality heavy grained black leather with a nylon lining. It has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it. In my opinion it’s a well constructed and patterned piece. it’s a bit meaningless to guess the leather given what I’ve said about the difficulties in determining the leather type used without using a lab. But If I was having a guess for the hell of it, I’d say it was steerhide. It weighs in at 2120g, so despite having a tlightweight lining it is fairly heavy. Of course that’s partly because it’s a longer length jacket. But for comparison my similar length but double breasted and heavy wool blanket lined Pegasus trench coat made from horsehide is 2910g

2) A size 38, hip length blazer style jacket in lovely characterful dark reddish brown leather with a lightweight nylon lining. Has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it. Again the quality of materials and. construction is good, albeit it was well used when I got it second hand so it has some ‘patina’ (which for me adds to its charms). It weighs in at 1560g, so it is one of my lightest jackets. Again, just for fun, I’d guess cowhide or maybe steerhide.

3) A size 40 in the classic aero ‘highwayman’ style (sadly including the notorious aero oversize sizing - this is more like a 44/46! - so it doesn’t fit me, but I’ve not yet got around to selling it on). It has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it, but it also has a second small label with “all wool lining” “hand crafted in Great Britain“ and “the finest leather jackets in the world” written on it. It’s a tartan wool lined black leather jacket with internal knit storm cuffs, size 10 heavy talon brass main zip and other quality brass hardware.. it looks very similar to yours barring the different lining/leather colour. This one weighs in at 2780g so just a tad heavier than yours.. The leather on this has that lovely fine grain with slight waxiness that I tend to associate with horsehide (maybe because it has a similar appearance and feel to my horsehide Pegasus jacket) but then the yoke has lovely deep wrinkled grains that I often associate with steerhide (albeit a vanson horsehide jacket I own has a heavily grained and wrinkled panel that looks like this too). Of course, once again, all this is just foolish unfounded speculation on my part… given the label doesn’t mention horsehide I’d say it’s steerhide or cowhide.

As I said, I also own a pair of Sam Walker leather jeans. Interestingly these were advertised as ‘horsehide’ and I was all set to email the seller asking on what basis he was claiming them to be horsehide. Most immediately crumble on being called on their unsupported speculation. But then I noticed with surprise that the Sam Walker Flying togs label in the photos clearly stated “Genuine horsehide” in the part where it normally said “genuine quality hide”!

This clearly supports my earlier contention that if it’s horsehide the label will clearly say so! Hence the view that all my Sam Walker jackets are steerhide or cowhide, given there’s clear evidence Sam Walker at least sometimes mentioned horsehide on its label when it’s made with horsehide leather.

Despite the horsehide label I actually managed to get these jeans for a great price (I guess jeans are more niche) and the leather is wonderful fine grained mid-weight horsehide very comfortable and perfect for jeans. They weigh 1470g. Interestingly I also own some aero leathers steerhide jeans which are of very similar design, feel thicker and heavier weight, but actually weigh almost exactly the same at 1490g!

Well I got rather carried away there! But I hope it was nonetheless of interest. I would say this given I own a few, but overall I think Sam Walker generally offers a decent quality/price proposition, so they are certainly worthy of consideration.

Thank you very much for the time and effort you put into your reply. I find I do get caught up in the " Horse Hide" mania at times but you are correct that the look and feel matter way more. Thanks again for the insight.

 

[red devil]

TL/DR It’s a nice decent quality mid-brown jacket. It will almost certainly be cowhide or steerhide leather. Enjoy it and don’t get too worried about the cult of horsehide…. it’s not the be all and end all…

I think that, short of professional DNA or microscopic analysis by a professional lab, there is only one reasonably accurate way to determine if a garment is made from horsehide leather: it clearly says so on the label.

From time to time on this website people post close up shots of various leathers asking people to guess what type of leather they are. It’s a fun game, but even given the level of knowledge of people on here, it is essentially a guessing game. Sure, some leather, like goat leather, has a type of grain that is pretty obvious. But horse vs steer or cow? I’m not sure anyone does better than chance in the long run when trying to tell these apart…

If there‘s a label present and it doesn’t explicitly say it’s horsehide, it almost certainly is not (regardless of the nonsense unscrupulous second hand jacket sellers all too often write, hoping to increase the selling price). Horsehide tends to attract a premium and did so even years back when horses (and hence horsehide leather) were more common. Hence makers were (and are) keen to point it out if it’s made of horsehide via labels to help sell jackets at a higher price.

Of course if there’s no label at all in the jacket anymore (or it never had one in the first place eg some old USA jackets made for the police) and it’s an old vintage jacket (maybe <1960 - hardware and jacket design can offer clues to help date jackets) then there’s a chance maybe it’s horsehide, but you’ll never really know for sure, short of taking it to a lab. It could just as well be steerhide or cowhide.

So if it doesn’t say “horsehide’ then assume it isn’t and pay accordingly. But also don’t get too hung up on the horsehide cult. There’s nothing especially magical about horsehide in and of itself. Horsehide leather can be amazing but it can also be underwhelming. Tanning, hide selection, finishing and various other factors make a big difference to the appearance, handle/drape and evolution of leather too, not just the base animal it came from. Not to mention personal preferences on what you like! Some people think smooth grained leather looks plasticy, others that wrinkled or heavily grained leather is defective and shouldn’t have passed quality control! It’s horses for courses

Lots of super impressive jackets are made from other leathers. Vanson’s competition weight cowhide leather (especially from back in the day) is justly revered (and importantly it works in a motorbike crash - I’ve personally tested it in a 100mph track day off). And some of the most amazing vintage jackets with fantastic graining and patina you’ll see on this website are clearly labelled steerhide. No doubt that horsehide jackets can be really amazing too, but there are also plenty of horsehide jackets that are stiff, uncomfortable and/or uninspiring or bland and plastic looking…. Being constructed from horsehide leather is no guarantee of an amazing jacket.

So my advice is that if you like a jacket and the look and feel of the leather it’s made from and the price, buy it and wear it and enjoy it and don’t obsess too much about which animal the hide came from. I think the Sam Walker jacket you‘ve got is a very decent jacket regardless of the leather it’s made from. It’s certainly far superior to the cheap lamb skin mall jackets that most people wear (if they wear leather jackets at all).

As to the specifics of Sam Walker, there are varied views as you‘ve read. For whatever it’s worth, I personally think it is plausible that they were made by aero at least for a time and the quality of the Sam Walker jackets I’ve personally seen is good (I own 3 plus a pair of Sam Walker leather jeans). I’ve got:

1) A size 40 knee length 3 button single breasted slim cut trench/gangster type jacket in lovely good quality heavy grained black leather with a nylon lining. It has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it. In my opinion it’s a well constructed and patterned piece. it’s a bit meaningless to guess the leather given what I’ve said about the difficulties in determining the leather type used without using a lab. But If I was having a guess for the hell of it, I’d say it was steerhide. It weighs in at 2120g, so despite having a tlightweight lining it is fairly heavy. Of course that’s partly because it’s a longer length jacket. But for comparison my similar length but double breasted and heavy wool blanket lined Pegasus trench coat made from horsehide is 2910g

2) A size 38, hip length blazer style jacket in lovely characterful dark reddish brown leather with a lightweight nylon lining. Has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it. Again the quality of materials and. construction is good, albeit it was well used when I got it second hand so it has some ‘patina’ (which for me adds to its charms). It weighs in at 1560g, so it is one of my lightest jackets. Again, just for fun, I’d guess cowhide or maybe steerhide.

3) A size 40 in the classic aero ‘highwayman’ style (sadly including the notorious aero oversize sizing - this is more like a 44/46! - so it doesn’t fit me, but I’ve not yet got around to selling it on). It has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it, but it also has a second small label with “all wool lining” “hand crafted in Great Britain“ and “the finest leather jackets in the world” written on it. It’s a tartan wool lined black leather jacket with internal knit storm cuffs, size 10 heavy talon brass main zip and other quality brass hardware.. it looks very similar to yours barring the different lining/leather colour. This one weighs in at 2780g so just a tad heavier than yours.. The leather on this has that lovely fine grain with slight waxiness that I tend to associate with horsehide (maybe because it has a similar appearance and feel to my horsehide Pegasus jacket) but then the yoke has lovely deep wrinkled grains that I often associate with steerhide (albeit a vanson horsehide jacket I own has a heavily grained and wrinkled panel that looks like this too). Of course, once again, all this is just foolish unfounded speculation on my part… given the label doesn’t mention horsehide I’d say it’s steerhide or cowhide.

As I said, I also own a pair of Sam Walker leather jeans. Interestingly these were advertised as ‘horsehide’ and I was all set to email the seller asking on what basis he was claiming them to be horsehide. Most immediately crumble on being called on their unsupported speculation. But then I noticed with surprise that the Sam Walker Flying togs label in the photos clearly stated “Genuine horsehide” in the part where it normally said “genuine quality hide”!

This clearly supports my earlier contention that if it’s horsehide the label will clearly say so! Hence the view that all my Sam Walker jackets are steerhide or cowhide, given there’s clear evidence Sam Walker at least sometimes mentioned horsehide on its label when it’s made with horsehide leather.

Despite the horsehide label I actually managed to get these jeans for a great price (I guess jeans are more niche) and the leather is wonderful fine grained mid-weight horsehide very comfortable and perfect for jeans. They weigh 1470g. Interestingly I also own some aero leathers steerhide jeans which are of very similar design, feel thicker and heavier weight, but actually weigh almost exactly the same at 1490g!

Well I got rather carried away there! But I hope it was nonetheless of interest. I would say this given I own a few, but overall I think Sam Walker generally offers a decent quality/price proposition, so they are certainly worthy of consideration.

That is spot on! Short of a label you can trust, there is no way to differentiate between cowhide and horsehide and sometimes other animals...

 

[jonesy86]

TL/DR It’s a nice decent quality mid-brown jacket. It will almost certainly be cowhide or steerhide leather. Enjoy it and don’t get too worried about the cult of horsehide…. it’s not the be all and end all…

I think that, short of professional DNA or microscopic analysis by a professional lab, there is only one reasonably accurate way to determine if a garment is made from horsehide leather: it clearly says so on the label.

From time to time on this website people post close up shots of various leathers asking people to guess what type of leather they are. It’s a fun game, but even given the level of knowledge of people on here, it is essentially a guessing game. Sure, some leather, like goat leather, has a type of grain that is pretty obvious. But horse vs steer or cow? I’m not sure anyone does better than chance in the long run when trying to tell these apart…

If there‘s a label present and it doesn’t explicitly say it’s horsehide, it almost certainly is not (regardless of the nonsense unscrupulous second hand jacket sellers all too often write, hoping to increase the selling price). Horsehide tends to attract a premium and did so even years back when horses (and hence horsehide leather) were more common. Hence makers were (and are) keen to point it out if it’s made of horsehide via labels to help sell jackets at a higher price.

Of course if there’s no label at all in the jacket anymore (or it never had one in the first place eg some old USA jackets made for the police) and it’s an old vintage jacket (maybe <1960 - hardware and jacket design can offer clues to help date jackets) then there’s a chance maybe it’s horsehide, but you’ll never really know for sure, short of taking it to a lab. It could just as well be steerhide or cowhide.

So if it doesn’t say “horsehide’ then assume it isn’t and pay accordingly. But also don’t get too hung up on the horsehide cult. There’s nothing especially magical about horsehide in and of itself. Horsehide leather can be amazing but it can also be underwhelming. Tanning, hide selection, finishing and various other factors make a big difference to the appearance, handle/drape and evolution of leather too, not just the base animal it came from. Not to mention personal preferences on what you like! Some people think smooth grained leather looks plasticy, others that wrinkled or heavily grained leather is defective and shouldn’t have passed quality control! It’s horses for courses

Lots of super impressive jackets are made from other leathers. Vanson’s competition weight cowhide leather (especially from back in the day) is justly revered (and importantly it works in a motorbike crash - I’ve personally tested it in a 100mph track day off). And some of the most amazing vintage jackets with fantastic graining and patina you’ll see on this website are clearly labelled steerhide. No doubt that horsehide jackets can be really amazing too, but there are also plenty of horsehide jackets that are stiff, uncomfortable and/or uninspiring or bland and plastic looking…. Being constructed from horsehide leather is no guarantee of an amazing jacket.

So my advice is that if you like a jacket and the look and feel of the leather it’s made from and the price, buy it and wear it and enjoy it and don’t obsess too much about which animal the hide came from. I think the Sam Walker jacket you‘ve got is a very decent jacket regardless of the leather it’s made from. It’s certainly far superior to the cheap lamb skin mall jackets that most people wear (if they wear leather jackets at all).

As to the specifics of Sam Walker, there are varied views as you‘ve read. For whatever it’s worth, I personally think it is plausible that they were made by aero at least for a time and the quality of the Sam Walker jackets I’ve personally seen is good (I own 3 plus a pair of Sam Walker leather jeans). I’ve got:

1) A size 40 knee length 3 button single breasted slim cut trench/gangster type jacket in lovely good quality heavy grained black leather with a nylon lining. It has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it. In my opinion it’s a well constructed and patterned piece. it’s a bit meaningless to guess the leather given what I’ve said about the difficulties in determining the leather type used without using a lab. But If I was having a guess for the hell of it, I’d say it was steerhide. It weighs in at 2120g, so despite having a tlightweight lining it is fairly heavy. Of course that’s partly because it’s a longer length jacket. But for comparison my similar length but double breasted and heavy wool blanket lined Pegasus trench coat made from horsehide is 2910g

2) A size 38, hip length blazer style jacket in lovely characterful dark reddish brown leather with a lightweight nylon lining. Has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it. Again the quality of materials and. construction is good, albeit it was well used when I got it second hand so it has some ‘patina’ (which for me adds to its charms). It weighs in at 1560g, so it is one of my lightest jackets. Again, just for fun, I’d guess cowhide or maybe steerhide.

3) A size 40 in the classic aero ‘highwayman’ style (sadly including the notorious aero oversize sizing - this is more like a 44/46! - so it doesn’t fit me, but I’ve not yet got around to selling it on). It has the “Sam Walker flying togs genuine quality hide” label in it, but it also has a second small label with “all wool lining” “hand crafted in Great Britain“ and “the finest leather jackets in the world” written on it. It’s a tartan wool lined black leather jacket with internal knit storm cuffs, size 10 heavy talon brass main zip and other quality brass hardware.. it looks very similar to yours barring the different lining/leather colour. This one weighs in at 2780g so just a tad heavier than yours.. The leather on this has that lovely fine grain with slight waxiness that I tend to associate with horsehide (maybe because it has a similar appearance and feel to my horsehide Pegasus jacket) but then the yoke has lovely deep wrinkled grains that I often associate with steerhide (albeit a vanson horsehide jacket I own has a heavily grained and wrinkled panel that looks like this too). Of course, once again, all this is just foolish unfounded speculation on my part… given the label doesn’t mention horsehide I’d say it’s steerhide or cowhide.

As I said, I also own a pair of Sam Walker leather jeans. Interestingly these were advertised as ‘horsehide’ and I was all set to email the seller asking on what basis he was claiming them to be horsehide. Most immediately crumble on being called on their unsupported speculation. But then I noticed with surprise that the Sam Walker Flying togs label in the photos clearly stated “Genuine horsehide” in the part where it normally said “genuine quality hide”!

This clearly supports my earlier contention that if it’s horsehide the label will clearly say so! Hence the view that all my Sam Walker jackets are steerhide or cowhide, given there’s clear evidence Sam Walker at least sometimes mentioned horsehide on its label when it’s made with horsehide leather.

Despite the horsehide label I actually managed to get these jeans for a great price (I guess jeans are more niche) and the leather is wonderful fine grained mid-weight horsehide very comfortable and perfect for jeans. They weigh 1470g. Interestingly I also own some aero leathers steerhide jeans which are of very similar design, feel thicker and heavier weight, but actually weigh almost exactly the same at 1490g!

Well I got rather carried away there! But I hope it was nonetheless of interest. I would say this given I own a few, but overall I think Sam Walker generally offers a decent quality/price proposition, so they are certainly worthy of consideration.

Good read, thanks.