Questions About the United States Navy Peacoat

[Spoonbelly]

greetings from Greece and I wish a happy new year for all Fedora members.
Dear Peacoat , I have finally found a size 46 Kersey peacoat , but I need your help regarding its date.
You can find attached the tag.
According to your thorough research this must be a late 40s, early 50s peacoat.
Am I correct View attachment 42194 ?

Wow. a '49 in size 46. That is one beautiful coat. It takes quite a while to find one of those as I am a size 46 or preferably a 46 Long.

 

[dleak77]

I was wondering if anyone has ever treated their peacoat with any type of waterproofing? My wife said she would like to spray hers with a spray waterproofer (I think the specific one she was looking at was called "Camp Dry" or something like that). We have used it to waterproof some cheap wool cowboy hats & that sort of thing in the past & it worked fine without any discoloration or making the wool feel or look like it had been shellacked... but being a bit of a traditionalist when it comes to anything vintage I am very hesitant to start spraying anything on these great old peacoats for fear of messing them up. Just wondering if anyone has had good or bad results or if it is sacrilege even to consider doing something like this. Thanks in advance for the replies.

 

[Peacoat]

While I have never used Camp Dry on a peacoat, I have used it on other articles of clothing without ill effects. It actually provided some water resistance. I believe it relies on silicone to provide the water barrier. You could try it on the peacoat, and if you didn't like the result, send it to the dry cleaners.

Peacoats are naturally water resistant for a while in a light rain. After a period of time, or if it becomes more than a light rain, the water will find its way inside. I usually wear chrome tanned leather if I am going out when it is raining as I don't like wet wool.

 

[jake hoss]

I recently bought a peacoat in an antique store. It seems to fit the user peacoat's description of a ww2 era coat but this is my first one and i am not sure. Any insight would be much appreciated. The coat is a very dark blue but appears black in some of the photos i will include. Thanks again for any help.
cant seem to upload my photos but below is a link to an imgur album.
http://imgur.com/a/2ZZgo

 

[Peacoat]

Even though the buttons appear to be brand new (probably replaced) and there is no tag, I pronounce it the real thing--a WWII peacoat. The lining shows good wear, the blank space where the tag was, is the right size and the issued owner's name is stenciled on the lining in the correct places. Congratulations on a good find.

BTW, welcome to the Lounge. PC.

 

[jake hoss]

Even though the buttons appear to be brand new (probably replaced) and there is no tag, I pronounce it the real thing--a WWII peacoat. The lining shows good wear, the blank space where the tag was, is the right size and the issued owner's name is stenciled on the lining in the correct place. Congratulations on a good find.

BTW, welcome to the Lounge. PC.

Thank you very much for the great info and kind welcome! Found it in an antique shop on Boulder City NV and it fit me well so i payed a whopping $40 for it! The buttons are in very good shape. They might have been replaced but i expext it was a long time ago as the thread looks very worn and one of the buttons is actually hanging off by its last thread. I was thinking about having the liner patched and the button reattached when i thought maybe it was from the 70's or 80's but now I definitely wont patch it and im leary of even messing with the loose button!

 

[Peacoat]

Go ahead and fix the button and repair the lining so there is no further degradation. The coat will button left over right, the way it is started in the last pic.

The guy in the antique shop didn't know what he had.

 

[Richard Screech]

Hi,

Other than being Dark Midnight Blue in colour does anyone know if the Melton wool material used for the 1970's peacoats differs from that used for those coats produced from 1980 onwards ?

From what I've seen in photo's the Melton coats from the 70's do not have the lower padded or insulated layer found on the inside of the later coats (i.e. the part that can pill badly)

Does this mean that the quality/weight of material for the 70's peacoats was superior or was the insulation layer a necessary addition to the 1980's coats when experience had shown that Melton wool didn't have the same thermal properties as Kersey ?

 

[Peacoat]

Hi,

Other than being Dark Midnight Blue in colour does anyone know if the Melton wool material used for the 1970's peacoats differs from that used for those coats produced from 1980 onwards ?

From what I've seen in photo's the Melton coats from the 70's do not have the lower padded or insulated layer found on the inside of the later coats (i.e. the part that can pill badly)

Does this mean that the quality/weight of material for the 70's peacoats was superior or was the insulation layer a necessary addition to the 1980's coats when experience had shown that Melton wool didn't have the same thermal properties as Kersey ?

With questions such as this, it is obvious you have an interest in the peacoat. Fortunately for you I have already done the research and written a guide on the subject. Go to the first post by Dinerman in this section, and you will find my guide.

Now, to answer your questions. The soft luxurious shell, called Kersey, was used until 1980. There are exceptions, but that is the general rule. Then the Navy switched to what it called a Melton fabric. The Melton is rougher and thinner than the Kersey, and the first coats were not nearly as warm. Complaints were received, and the Navy quickly added a liner to the coats. Reports I have received from guys who have both say that they are about equal in warmth. My experience is similar, but I think in cold and windy conditions, such as Chicago, the Kersey blocks the wind better than the Melton/insulation combination.

Welcome to the Lounge. If you have anymore questions after reading my guide, ask away. PC.

 

[Doctor Damage]

Buzz Rickson WW2 repro peacoat (click for larger pics). These don't make much sense since originals are still relatively plentiful.

 

[Peacoat]

WW II originals are becoming increasingly difficult to find. But this really isn't a WW II repro. It is a cross between a WWI and a WWII peacoat. Notice the buttons. They are the pre WWII style. The handwarmer pockets are placed higher on the coat than the WWII peacoat. I would expect to see cargo pockets below the handwarmers with these buttons and the high placement of the pockets (WW I style), but they are not there. Also, the tag is very similar to a 1945 tag. I would call this a WWI/WWII hybrid. Neither one nor the other. It would be interesting to know what type of wool shell is used--Kersey or Melton?

 

[Spoonbelly]

WW II originals are becoming increasingly difficult to find. But this really isn't a WW II repro. It is a cross between a WWI and a WWII peacoat. Notice the buttons. They are the pre WWII style. The handwarmer pockets are placed higher on the coat than the WWII peacoat. I would expect to see cargo pockets below the handwarmers with these buttons and the high placement of the pockets (WW I style), but they are not there. Also, the tag is very similar to a 1945 tag. I would call this a WWI/WWII hybrid. Neither one nor the other. It would be interesting to know what type of wool shell is used--Kersey or Melton?

Peacoat,
Most Kersey coats are getting fewer and far between. Sizes 36-40 are still much more common then larger sizes however. Prices have also been going up. I'm real glad I got my stock of 46s when I did. They (46s) don't pop up on ebay any where as often as they used to. Peacoats were pretty quite on the FL this past season. I certainly didn't wear mine as much as the previous two winters.

 

[Peacoat]

I know it was colder where you are than where I am, but we didn't have much cold weather. I wore my Sheene most of the time, and my Thunder Bay only a time or two. Same for the peacoats. Maybe we will have better luck next year. PC

 

[Phil4]

I have a 1966 navy issue peacoat, a 38 but it fits bigger. Too long for me. Did they make a short size?

 

[Peacoat]

I have a 1966 navy issue peacoat, a 38 but it fits bigger. Too long for me. Did they make a short size?

In the current issue peacoats there are options for short and long, but not sure these options were available in vintage coats. Don't know that I have ever seen a short in vintage, but then I never looked for one.

If it is only an inch or so too long for you, the sleeves and hem can be taken up without compromising the proportions of the coat.

 

[Phil4]

"If it is only an inch or so too long for you, the sleeves and hem can be taken up without compromising the proportions of the coat."

It's awkwardly sized for me in other ways, with tight shoulders, otherwise I'd have it altered. It has really nice wool, unlike the newer ones I've seen.

I should pass it on to a member here. It's great that there's such a passionate group.

 

[Spoonbelly]

I have a 1966 navy issue peacoat, a 38 but it fits bigger. Too long for me. Did they make a short size?

I remember reading not too long ago one of the posters here stated that longs (xxL) were made starting in 1962. I'm assuming that they also started making shorts (xxS) along with long sizes starting in 1962? He also stated that starting in 1962 regular length coats were sized (xxR) as in 38R and not just 38. I do however own a 1965 coat and it is sized 46, and not 46R. I used to scour ebay everyday for peacoats for 2 or 3 winter seasons and had never found any short sizes in the dark blue Kersey coats. However, they are available in S, R, L and XL in the later black Melton coats. The oldest I've seen in longs has been from 1969. This doesn't mean that they were not made before this. If shorts are available in Kersey coats they must be pretty rare as are long sizes.

 

[EarlGrey]

Yes, Kersey vintage peacoats are made in 38 Short! It took me half a year of waiting, but I was able to snatch one up from VintageTrends. There was a second one that same week, but has long since disappeared. None have appeared since.

Some appear on eBay, but the conditions are often less than desired or mislabeled Melton coats.

 

[Atticus Finch]

I remember reading not too long ago one of the posters here stated that longs (xxL) were made starting in 1962. I'm assuming that they also started making shorts (xxS) along with long sizes starting in 1962? He also stated that starting in 1962 regular length coats were sized (xxR) as in 38R and not just 38. I do however own a 1965 coat and it is sized 46, and not 46R. I used to scour ebay everyday for peacoats for 2 or 3 winter seasons and had never found any short sizes in the dark blue Kersey coats. However, they are available in S, R, L and XL in the later black Melton coats. The oldest I've seen in longs has been from 1969. This doesn't mean that they were not made before this. If shorts are available in Kersey coats they must be pretty rare as are long sizes.

I may have been that poster. I certainly don't claim to be a peacoat expert. I like them quite a bit, but they're just an offshoot from my longtime interest in flight jacket collecting.

Last year, I did quite a bit of research trying to date a couple of Kersey coats I found. Both of them were in big-boy size 50 and were tagged 50, not 50R. The earliest peacoat tag that I could find that included long and short sizes was from 1962. This, combined with my jacket's spec tag's formats, and the fact that my jackets were tagged with DA numbers...as opposed to DSA numbers...plus the general characteristics of the jackets, led me to believe that my pea coats were made before 1962.

But...while I would say I now know a bit about my pea coats, I'd also say I know very little about pea coats in general.

AF

 

[Peacoat]

So, post pics of your tags and let's see what you have. It will only add to the overall understanding of the dating of vintage peacoats.