Question: Tipping in Restaurants, for Services, ??

[Dr Doran]

You both need to travel -- and Busterkat, I hereby retract my previous compliment to you.

 

[Dr Doran]

Ah, but Doran, nothing in this life is guaranteed. Life is indeed an uncertain proposition.

If you think our allegiance to every member of every waitstaff of every restaurant in the USA outweighs our allegiance to a subculture that we care about, and from whose members we expect a bit of respect, then I am confused by your set of allegiances. And by your definition of the word "allegiance."

 

[Dr Doran]

Yeah, that's not cool.

A bizarre and ridiculous comment that speaks only of your inexperience in the world. I hope you never find yourself in e.g. Thailand or a small Greek isle with only enough money for the check and not enough for the tip. You will starve.

 

[Viola]

Who said anything about allegiences? You proclaim loudly nobody has any right to expect good behavior from you, yet you also have the right to have nobody develop (or is it share?) their opinion of this behavior?

I have travelled? What's your point? You should behave well where you are, not search the globe for "its okay over there" - certainly not when its based on a totally different grounding, i.e. wage balance. The Aussies in this thread have already covered that.

 

[Viola]

A bizarre and ridiculous comment that speaks only of your inexperience in the world. I hope you never find yourself in e.g. Thailand or a small Greek isle with only enough money for the check and not enough for the tip. You will starve.

Then buy from a produce stand not a restaurant, it's not hard.

 

[Paisley]

We don't tip in Australia. We don't have to because people who work in the service industries get a decent hourly rate. No different for someone working in a supermarket, or department store ($15 to 20 an hour an up - more if you are a casual) etc. In fact, people can earn double time etc on Sundays etc.

The thing that gets me is why don't they just pay people a decent wage in the US? $2 an hour is criminal!! No one here would be allowed to do that as we have minimum wage standards. Hell, some people in Uni etc make a good money working bars because the rates are higher for the weekend.

You can tip here if you really liked the service - but tipping is not expected nor is it customary regardless of what service you get here. But it is because wages are decent. I can understand the necessity of tipping in the US and never mind doing it when I am there - because I know the wages are shite. But I do resent tipping when the service is bad.

I don't know about servers here, but wages here in Denver even for burger flippers have been above the minimum for years. You can make more than $2 an hour by babysitting.

 

[Dr Doran]

Who said anything about allegiences? You proclaim loudly nobody has any right to expect good behavior from you, yet you also have the right to have nobody develop (or is it share?) their opinion of this behavior?

I have travelled? What's your point? You should behave well where you are, not search the globe for "its okay over there" - certainly not when its based on a totally different grounding, i.e. wage balance. The Aussies in this thread have already covered that.

Amazingly rude, as well as ill-thought out.

I am, again, astonished.

I have never, at any point, claimed that anyone had no right to receive good behavior. This is a bizarre claim on your part that perhaps is a reflection of your own behavior on this thread -- and many others.

My claim was that poor treatment from restaurants would receive poor treatment from me in return.

The diner reacts to a total experience. I do behave well (extremely well) wherever I am.

Unless I am being clearly disrespected by the people at the restaurant. At such a point, all bets are off.

Every single waiter I know recognizes that, if the restaurant as a whole has screwed up, the waiter receives a smaller tip. This encourages the waiter to make sure that the restaurant gives a basic level of good service to the diners.

Without the diners, the restaurant cannot exist. The waiters who are good waiters recognize this basic fact. As does anyone with an IQ above about 89.

 

[Dr Doran]

Then buy from a produce stand not a restaurant, it's not hard.

You cannot always find one in every city at 8PM. Can you?

 

[Diamondback]

[voice=Rodney King]"Can't--can't we all just get along?"[/voice]

 

[Dr Doran]

[voice=Rodney King]"Can't--can't we all just get along?"[/voice]

When I stop being disrespected for not having tipped exactly twice in my life, both times of which I reacted to extreme disrespect, then I will have an easier time getting along.

I react to disrespect. I react hard. That is the way I am.

When I am given a basic level of respect, I am the most amusing, compliment-bestowing, happy fellow around.

Ask anyone who knows me in San Francisco, Los Angeles, Portland, or New York. At least 2 dozen Fedora Loungers will vouch for this.

 

[Dr Doran]

I am now going to discontinue my subscription to this thread. I am deeply disappointed in too many of its writers.

 

[Diamondback]

Doran, I'm kinda with you--I was just trying to point out that EVERYBODY has gotten a little heated, myself included. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to arrogate a BT role or try to act as one, I'm just suggesting a little step back and a couple deep breaths might do us all some good, as emotions tend to cloud judgment. It's kinda awkward, seeing two people I respect at each other's throats over what I believe to be a simple glitch in communication...

 

[Viola]

The diner reacts to a total experience. I do behave well (extremely well) wherever I am.

Unless I am being clearly disrespected by the people at the restaurant. At such a point, all bets are off.

Every single waiter I know recognizes that, if the restaurant as a whole has screwed up, the waiter receives a smaller tip. This encourages the waiter to make sure that the restaurant gives a basic level of good service to the diners.

You said nothing about anything the waiter did, and in fact said that the owner should step into the gap on the waiter's behalf - a gap of your creation.

Without the diners, the restaurant cannot exist. The waiters who are good waiters recognize this basic fact. As does anyone with an IQ above about 89.

I can see I am the one who is being rude, it all comes clear now.

 

[Diamondback]

Forget it, V, he's gone from this thread. I may be following soon, if my attempt to push the "Reset Button" doesn't work...

 

[Viola]

He left while I was replying, I wouldn't have posted after his dramatic exit.

 

[Slim Portly]

In the off chance that you read this Doran, I am not being rude, aggressive, or disrespectful. I questioned the effectiveness of your actions based only on your reporting, a fairly common occurrence on public forums.

And for the record, your assumptions could not be further from the mark, as I have dined in restaurants in over a dozen countries, and I labored in the hospitality and service industries for years as server, manager, and owner.

It's a pity that you chose to be offended by a simple exchange of opinions.

 

[dr greg]

tipping point

As has been pointed out, in this country people get paid properly for being waiters etc, so a tip given is ACTUALLY EARNED... my experience travelling around Europe and the US which are after all, supposedly the First World, is that tips are expected, if not demanded, every time you turn around, whether deserved or not, so really they are considered a right and not a TRUE gratuity; negating the point of them in my view...the frequently grasping manner of people doing menial tasks was something I found objectionable especially in France and the US, and made me wonder why these people didn't organise themselves and get a decent wage happening. If you don't want to work for crap money...go on strike for more.
NB: I am not referring to 3rd world hell-holes where the economy is destroyed, but "modern democracies".

 

[miss_elise]

despite people in Australia being paid real wages, I increasingly find that people expect tips anyway - regardless of service standards. A lot of waiters expect 10%, especially if they are in a nicer establishment. I'm often happy to tip, but only when the service is better than average.

 

[Slim Portly]

Here's a funny (well, to me anyway) story about me, poor service received, tipping, and Internet response.

One day I had lunch in a restaurant that I frequented regularly. My waitress was new and we did not know each other. As I am a vegetarian, I ordered a "green salad" and a glass of iced tea. The waitress returned with my salad, which I saw was piled high with chopped boiled eggs.

"Excuse me," I said, "I suppose I should have been more specific, but I wasn't expecting eggs on a green salad."

She responded in a very rude tone, saying "There isn't anything on the menu called a 'green salad.' "

By this time I noticed that the boiled eggs were hiding a pile of chopped bacon. "That may be true," I said, "but you didn't point that out when I ordered, and I definitely don't want bacon and eggs. Would you mind bringing me a garden salad with only greens and dressing, please?"

She walked off in a huff, returned with a salad as I had described, I ate, I tipped, and I left without complaining to the management about her very unprofessional behavior.

I reported this incident on another forum thinking that it might get a laugh, and I was assailed by a number of angry ex-waitresses who said things like "You are a waitress's worst nightmare" and "That's what you get for not ordering from the menu properly."

Just goes to show you, people might not respond the way you expect when you share stories.

 

[Smithy]

As has been pointed out, in this country people get paid properly for being waiters etc, so a tip given is ACTUALLY EARNED

I'm often happy to tip, but only when the service is better than average.

That's exactly my attitude when I'm in Oz, NZ or Scandinavia.

If I'm in the States or continental Europe then I'll tip always.

When in Rome do as the Romans do.