Quality of manufacture for leather coats?

[Smithy]

For what you are looking for you might want to consider something like a 20s/30s style half length motoring/flying coat. You could wear it year round so long as it is sufficiently sized to wear a decent jumper underneath in winter.

Eastman do the Brooklands motoring coat which is popular with the vintage car crowd, good looking coat as well. And Aero offer a number of similar half length coats.

Just an option to consider.

I personally have been surviving winter in Norway in an Eastman 1940 Pattern Irvin flying jacket which was perfect for a cold winter. If you are after a pure winter jacket, they are damn good and warm. Plus the girls seem to like them as well!

 

[Flitcraft]

Check out Wested Leather- they have an Ebay storefront now- their quality is good and their price reasonable. I've always found them great to deal with...

 

[Naphtali]

While I'm not close to a final combination of production quality with design wanted, I'm much clearer on design and materials facets.

I'm not enthusiastic about sheepskin lining where cuffs have unwoven wool overflowing the cuff, as occurs with B-3. These cuffs wear relatively quickly while picking up all kinds of "stuff."

Lost World's B-2 jacket is vegetable tanned horsehide with wool lining, the most desirable combination of materials.
***
Cirrus' 2Plus2 is chrome tanned sheepskin, but has the feature/design closest to what I want.

Here is text of Cirrus' reply to my query. Empahsis added.
***start reply***
Thank you for your enquiry.

Firstly I must explain that we make the different styles up in either of the 2 sheepskins which we have in stock at present as they are the best quality we can get. There is either hurricane sheepskin which has a distressed brown outer leather finish, and the wool inside is in 2 lengths; either 25mm or 17mm can be ordered. The colour is a chestnut brown colour. Or, there is spitfire sheepskin which has a mat black outer leather finish, and this has a 25mm chestnut wool inside.

Regarding the lengths of the 2 + 2 and the B3 pilot, as with all our jackets we make them to order for you to fit. Generally on a 6' man the length of the 2 + 2 is around 32" from top of spine to the hem, and on the B3 pilot around 30". If you want extra length - or less - we can accommodate this. However if it is considerably longer then we will have to make a small extra charge.

The hides are chrome tanned. I have looked into veggie taning, it is a sound idea, but so far the tannery have not been enthusiastic about getting the wonderful finish we have on our skins with the veg method.

Both the jackets have a storm flap underneath the zip front.

The collar on the 2 +2 is identical to the Irvin collar so yes it stands up in the same way. The B3 has a slightly smaller collar that is not backed with leather to give the extra rigidity.

The zips of the sleeves are sufficient to do up over the top of gauntlets .

THE UNDERARM GUSSETS ARE PLAIN LEATHER AND QUITE DIFFERENT FROM ACTION BACK WHICH IS ONLY INCORPORATED ON THE G1 jacket. They give a little bit of extra movement in the sheepskin jackets when worn.

You may order elbow patches on our jackets, but of course you do not need them on the B3pilot jacket. These will be charged at £35.00. Inside pockets are £12.50 each and outer pockets are depending on the style.

I do not have a special system to prevent the riding up of the jacket when you sit. If the jacket is long then I would recommend a 2 way zip so it can be unzipped from bottom, Extra cost of £10.00.

Re the sizes I require your chest, height, weight, waist in trousers, and tummy size if relevant. Then follow our size chart and measure up for me please. The more measurements the better, then I look at them and may come back to you and ask again to ensure we get it right. I need to know what you wear when measured, and how many layers you want the jacket to accommodate.

I hope that this has helped a bit, and we look forward to making up a jacket for you.

With kind regards,
Sally MacKinnon.
***end reply***
A little longer, with additional outside pockets and, perhaps tailored with a form of twin vents that are closer to perpendicular to zipper and spine to minimize ride-up when sitting -- this will do me.

Another jacket that is relatively close to my wants is Flightjacket.com's M444. From the graphic it appears to be less coat than Cirrus'. From its description it would require more non-standard work.

Basic price difference between 2Plus2 and M444 is enormous. On a one-time purchase, price becomes less relevant.

I know very little about Cirrus. Apparently, it is a smaller UK manufacturer than Aero and Eastman, probably much smaller than Flightjacket.com.

 

[Flitcraft]

Flightjacket.com is a pretty good company. They seem to be relatively easy to work with if you have questions or want to get something customized. Quality is pretty good. Prices are usually reasonable.

 

[Naphtali]

Cirrus (UK)???

Okay, I'm reduced to a single question that is, so far, without reply on this thread.

Those who have experience with Cirrus (UK) leather coats, please describe quality of materials and assembly. A slightly modified 2Plus2 is the design that meets my needs. But I know nothing of Cirrus' quality.

 

[Graemsay]

There are a few posts discussing Cirrus in this forum, and the search function will bring them up. Starting a new thread would also attract attention.

You've probably already seen it, but Aero do a shearling lined version of the Barnstormer:

http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?p=999&gid=17176229&uid=142228

Aero can customise jackets really heavily (for example, my upcoming Cossack is going to be completely non-standard. ), and they could probably do you a Long Half-Belt or Hercules with a shearling liner and M422A / AN6552 style collar if you asked them.

 

[Naphtali]

You've probably already seen it, but Aero do a shearling lined version of the Barnstormer:

Aero can customise jackets really heavily (for example, my upcoming Cossack is going to be completely non-standard. ), and they could probably do you a Long Half-Belt or Hercules with a shearling liner and M422A / AN6552 style collar if you asked them.

Not only had I not seen this, I was unaware it existed -- or that Aero has coats of similar design to the 2Plus2. Wandering Aero's web site did not show me anything such as your graphic or ideas.

The technical phrase to describe what you've done to rattle my brain is, "Oh, sh*t!" I now need to have a detailed conversation with Aero's support staff.
***
From the information within my previous postings on this thread, in your opinion can I still expect the price to be under USD1400 (£700) from Aero?

 

[Graemsay]

It's my job to make your life difficult! lol

Aero's shearling lined Barnstormer is 530 pounds on their website:

http://www.aeroleatherclothing.com/webapp/aeroleather/servlet/AeroViewPage?page=displayproduct&subcatid=38&prodid=704

Their website isn't the best, and it's probably worth taking a look at Mark Moye's site, which has better pictures on it:

http://www.picturetrail.com/aeroleatherusa

Aero don't charge a huge amount for their customisation work. My Cossack is going to have a button-up front, a different half-belt style, added inside pockets, and extra length added. That's costing me 25 or 30 pounds extra on top of the standard price. So I'd guess that a custom shearling lined jacket would be under 600 pounds.

It's probably worth dropping either Mark (Aero USA) or Amanda (in Scotland) an email. Amanda is very friendly, and has put up with me asking too many questions in an attempt to decide upon a jacket.

 

[MJCR]

There are a few posts discussing Cirrus in this forum, and the search function will bring them up. Starting a new thread would also attract attention.

You've probably already seen it, but Aero do a shearling lined version of the Barnstormer:

http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?p=999&gid=17176229&uid=142228

Aero can customise jackets really heavily (for example, my upcoming Cossack is going to be completely non-standard. ), and they could probably do you a Long Half-Belt or Hercules with a shearling liner and M422A / AN6552 style collar if you asked them.

Wow, mine is warm in the UK with just the cotton drill lining, this one should be very warm!

 

[Naphtali]

Wow, mine is warm in the UK with just the cotton drill lining, this one should be very warm!

Where I live, I suspect, the six-month winters are exponentially more severe than UK. (Most summer nights' low temperatures hover in the middle 30s Fahrenheit, i.e. 1-2 degrees Celsius.) What I seek is what I can snowshoe and woods wander in as well as go "oot-na-boot" evenings. These are among the reasons for preferring a longer garment body while avoiding [what I think of as] unfinished cuffs.

Experience has shown me that parkas with integral hoods are unacceptable. You cannot move your head naturally/normally without losing insulative value or blinding yourself. Pelzm?ºtze or trapper styles with a stand-up wrap around collar is a superior solution that also yields more insulative flexibility.

 

[HDRnR]

You might want to consider the ANJ-4 also, http://www.lostworldsinc.com/ANJ-4SheepskinLeatherFlightJacket.htm

no wool coming out the sleeve. There are a few other manufacturers of this jacket also. I have two of these, an old Willis & Geiger and one made in the 90's, they are great jackets. Lost Worlds quality can be amazing only downside is dealing with Stuart if he woke up on the wrong side of the bed that day.

BTW- To add my two cents I think Hermes ties are a complete joke, people pay up for the label and the pattern but for the money they are crap. I have a few given to me as gifts and after a few wearings they started to become all discombobulated. As far as quality of construction I'll take a Kiton anyday.

 

[johnnyjohnny]

USwings flies so-so regarding quality

i've gotten a number of uswings jackets, and it's a mixed bag...the best way i can explain it is to post below the letter i wrote directly to sgt. hack, the owner of uswings...wrote about a week ago, haven't heard anything back:

"i've read some really nice things people have had to say about you personally when they've had problems with uswings merchandise and then contacted you, and you took care of the problem...well, here's the problem with an a-2 signature milspec jacket i bought from uswings in december

i wear a 44 civilian, and a 46 military size...so i ordered the 46 from you, but unfortunately i think you cut your jackets extra roomy, even your mil sizes, so the jacket fits like a 48

i've kept it this long because i didn't think that would be enough reason to return it, though it is about a full size larger than military size 46's i've gotten from cockpit usa (their a-2s)

why i'm writing now is that another problem has surfaced, and that is the stretch cloth cuffs and bottom of the jacket (the several inches at the bottom of the jacket that are brown stretch cloth material)...

i've worn the jacket about 20 times since purchase from you in december, and usually for about an hour or two upon each wearing, and the cuffs and jacket bottom are piling quite a bit (the cloth balling up, fuzzing, etc.)...i have cockpit usa a-2 jackets that are at least a year old, and have been worn at least three to four times as much, and they have only the slightest piling on them...they are very clearly of much better quality, an example being that the cuffs on my uswings jacket have not only piled, but stretched out so they do not tighten around the wrist anymore...this has not happened with cockpit usa jackets that, again, are over a year old and have been worn 3-4 times as much

the leather and cut on your jacket is excellent, except for it being one size too large, however there are also about three areas on the jacket, pocket seams and panel or arm seams, where thread is left just sticking out from the seam about 1/8 to 1/4 inch, untied off..."

i forgot to mention to sgt. hack that aLL a-2s i've purchased on ebay, all at least 20 years old and used, had nowhere near the piling as on his jacket cuffs and bottom, or the stretch out...that includes willis and geiger, cooper, spiewak and sons...oddly, a uswings g-1 i purchased 5 years ago also doesn't have the piling/stretch problem, however, when i wore it recently i noticed it had a dual label, it was made by cooper but tagged uswings as the seller...

it seems the cuff and bottom material are really inferior, at least on the uswings jacket i bought recently...i'd like to think this is an aberration and not a uswings quality problem, however sgt. hack hasn't responded, so i'm not given much to contradict this defect

johnnyjohnny