Phoenix Hat Company

[Rmccamey]

Correct, Regan. I know exactly what felt color I want and I can live with almost any "shade" but matching ribbon color and felt color is a huge challenge (problem) for me. Ask Rick, I think I changed my mind 40 times. My wife finally made the decision for me!!!

Yes, lighting and different computers make a big difference, as does the way modern cameras "adjust" the colors and light balance when the picture is taken. I've bought several pieces of vintage grosgrain ribbon that look nothing like I expected, and now will only buy if the seller is willing to send me a small "swatch" sample first. And how many times have you seen someone's description of the hat say something like, "It is more brown than it appears in the picture"?

But even then, our eyes "adjust" what we see depending on the background; a small piece of a certain color looked great, but then the whole ribbon just doesn't look the same color when it's wrapped around the hat. And then there's colors like, say, granite felt that depend on ribbon color or even surroundings for their "hue" that day, never mind the difference between indoor and outdoor light. And this granite batch is a slightly different shade than the last one the manufacturer sent... (I have granite on the brain since my next hat from Rick will be granite, but it is a tough color to pin down so I thought it would be a good example.)

And then, as you say, there's always the subjective factor - "That's not black, that's dark blue!" Or, "Is this more blue or green?"

Lots of challenges, indeed, that all hat makers and buyers face. I will say, though, that almost always, even if the colors are somewhat (or a lot different), the hats look better in person than they do in pictures!

Have a good day,
Regan

 

[deadlyhandsome]

Yes, lighting and different computers make a big difference, as does the way modern cameras "adjust" the colors and light balance when the picture is taken. I've bought several pieces of vintage grosgrain ribbon that look nothing like I expected, and now will only buy if the seller is willing to send me a small "swatch" sample first. And how many times have you seen someone's description of the hat say something like, "It is more brown than it appears in the picture"?

But even then, our eyes "adjust" what we see depending on the background; a small piece of a certain color looked great, but then the whole ribbon just doesn't look the same color when it's wrapped around the hat. And then there's colors like, say, granite felt that depend on ribbon color or even surroundings for their "hue" that day, never mind the difference between indoor and outdoor light. And this granite batch is a slightly different shade than the last one the manufacturer sent... (I have granite on the brain since my next hat from Rick will be granite, but it is a tough color to pin down so I thought it would be a good example.)

And then, as you say, there's always the subjective factor - "That's not black, that's dark blue!" Or, "Is this more blue or green?"

Lots of challenges, indeed, that all hat makers and buyers face. I will say, though, that almost always, even if the colors are somewhat (or a lot different), the hats look better in person than they do in pictures!

Have a good day,
Regan

My next Phoenix is a granite too. Rick has been reluctant to take my money until he figures out the ribbon color for it. It’s simple when you’re looking for charcoal or black or some agreed upon staple. When you venture out you have to be willing to assume the risk.

I think that getting photos in natural sunlight can minimize the problems. We also need to be able to deal with disappointments. I’m looking for ribbon locally to send as an exemplar (I can used cheap ribbon not suitable for a hat but depicting the right color).


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[Just A Hat Rack]

I have a granite in with Rick as well. Based on the discussion of late, I'm really hoping it doesn't appear too brown, but I'm not overly worried about it. Most granites that I've seen look to be the gray that I expect it to be. The trouble I'm having is with the ribbon color. I'm trying to get an Ohio State themed color combination going. Their colors are scarlet and gray. I know a scarlet colored ribbon would be too bright, and as Rick put it, a bit garish. I'm trying to find a suitable red to go with the granite. Rick has burgundy in stock, but I'm having trouble getting a true feel of the color through photos. I'm afraid it will be too dark/purple/brown. The darkness of the color wouldn't bother me so much if I was sure it had a nice red dominance to it.

 

[ruvort]

Perhaps Rick would be willing to send customers a small cut of the ribbon so they can see the color in person? Or put together a little pamphlet of the color swatches for people to choose from so both Rick and the customer have the same example to work off of.

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[belfastboy]

I have a granite in with Rick as well. Based on the discussion of late, I'm really hoping it doesn't appear too brown, but I'm not overly worried about it. Most granites that I've seen look to be the gray that I expect it to be. The trouble I'm having is with the ribbon color. I'm trying to get an Ohio State themed color combination going. Their colors are scarlet and gray. I know a scarlet colored ribbon would be too bright, and as Rick put it, a bit garish. I'm trying to find a suitable red to go with the granite. Rick has burgundy in stock, but I'm having trouble getting a true feel of the color through photos. I'm afraid it will be too dark/purple/brown. The darkness of the color wouldn't bother me so much if I was sure it had a nice red dominance to it.

I have a Winchester Granite in the rabbit felt and to my eye it has a very distinct brown tone to it. I was disappointed as I thought it would be a grey hat. I have a Winchester Granite in a western weight beaver felt and it is a much truer grey tone.

 

[Just A Hat Rack]

I have a Winchester Granite in the rabbit felt and to my eye it has a very distinct brown tone to it. I was disappointed as I thought it would be a grey hat. I have a Winchester Granite in a western weight beaver felt and it is a much truer grey tone.

I probably should have specified, the granite I will be getting is a dress weight beaver. I've read numerous times that the granite is generally gray but can sometimes appear with brownish tones to it under certain lighting. In photos I've gotten from Rick I have seen both of these effects.

 

[belfastboy]

I probably should have specified, the granite I will be getting is a dress weight beaver. I've read numerous times that the granite is generally gray but can sometimes appear with brownish tones to it under certain lighting. In photos I've gotten from Rick I have seen both of these effects.

The beaver Granite I have I would describe as a grey hat with some brown undertones. The rabbit I would say is the reverse....a brown hat with slight grey undertones

 

[deadlyhandsome]

Perhaps Rick would be willing to send customers a small cut of the ribbon so they can see the color in person? Or put together a little pamphlet of the color swatches for people to choose from so both Rick and the customer have the same example to work off of.

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While Rick has a large supply of ribbon he also sources ribbon just for a project. I’m sure he would be willing to send a swatch if you are uncertain. While I still have the dark moss hat I’m taking it to a fabric store and draping different ribbon colors until I find what I’m after. I plan on sending a few different ones back with the hat.



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[deadlyhandsome]

I probably should have specified, the granite I will be getting is a dress weight beaver. I've read numerous times that the granite is generally gray but can sometimes appear with brownish tones to it under certain lighting. In photos I've gotten from Rick I have seen both of these effects.

I have a beaver granite from Gannon. At first I was disappointed as it wasn’t the grey I was expecting from looking at Eric’s hat tree and associated photos. The brown tones are pretty strong. After my initial response, I’ve come to like the color; enough to order another from Rick. I’m looking for a muted low contrast ribbon to mimic some vintage hats I admire. I’ll also take my Gannon granite to the fabric store to look at ribbon options.


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[Just A Hat Rack]

For me it's not a matter of liking the color. All the colors that I've seen from Rick are nice, and the work that he's shown me thus far looks superb. It just comes down to getting the color combos that I was looking for when the hat arrives. Right now I am really stuck on the ribbon. The only suitable "red" that he has in stock is burgundy, and I'm really twisting my brain about it. All of these color discussions are of course no fault of Rick's. I've probably overwhelmed him with apologies for me being persnickety.

 

[Rmccamey]

My Gannon Granite is a solid medium gray (darker in low light or indoors) however, to me, it also moves with the ribbon color. With my Slate ribbon, the hat seems to have a slight purple cast. Rick sent me photos of a handful of ribbons of interest against a dark brown body he is working on for me. If nothing else, it helped me decide which ribbon colors I did NOT want.

Perhaps Rick would be willing to send customers a small cut of the ribbon so they can see the color in person? Or put together a little pamphlet of the color swatches for people to choose from so both Rick and the customer have the same example to work off of.

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While Rick has a large supply of ribbon he also sources ribbon just for a project. I’m sure he would be willing to send a swatch if you are uncertain. While I still have the dark moss hat I’m taking it to a fabric store and draping different ribbon colors until I find what I’m after. I plan on sending a few different ones back with the hat.



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[humanshoes]

True to his word, my hat tool customer in Columbia sent me these straw hat body samples. On the left is the Brisa grade, on the right is the Fino grade, and in the middle is what I consider to be a masterpiece of the weaver's art, the Super Fino. It's great to finally have a reliable source for straw bodies and all of these grades will eventually have their place in my lineup. Unfortunately, I have no time to play with these right now, but the day will come.

 

[deadlyhandsome]

True to his word, my hat tool customer in Columbia sent me these straw hat body samples. On the left is the Brisa grade, on the right is the Fino grade, and in the middle is what I consider to be a masterpiece of the weaver's art, the Super Fino. It's great to finally have a reliable source for straw bodies and all of these grades will eventually have their place in my lineup. Unfortunately, I have no time to play with these right now, but the day will come.
View attachment 161594

You are a mean man. Looks like I’ll have to push my retirement date back another year.


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[humanshoes]

You are a mean man. Looks like I’ll have to push my retirement date back another year.


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Sorry about that Brent, but you're not in any danger just yet.

 

[deadlyhandsome]

Sorry about that Brent, but you're not in any danger just yet.

I’m already thinking of a Havana crown, 2 5/8” brim, and all built on a Super Fino body. Hmmm.

 

[belfastboy]

You are a mean man. Looks like I’ll have to push my retirement date back another year.


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That was close to my first thought but am already retire so it was just....."oh crap, and another!!"

 

[jonesy86]

Well, I am almost a year in retirement and not broke from buying hats quite yet. I wonder which straw hat body would hold up best on this wet rock in the middle of the Pacific Ocean?


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[deadlyhandsome]

Well, I am almost a year in retirement and not broke from buying hats quite yet. I wonder which straw hat body would hold up best on this wet rock in the middle of the Pacific Ocean?


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The “wet” part is some cause for concern. Panamas don’t do well in the rain.

Retirement is beckoning me, but I do t get my full pension for six more years.


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[humanshoes]

All this talk of retirement is killing me. I'm a year away from my own "semi-retirement" and I should have more time to devote to my other pursuits. I have a mobile hat shop on the drawing board and still want to find the ideal space for a working hat studio. Hey, a fella can dream can't he?

 

[humanshoes]

Well, I am almost a year in retirement and not broke from buying hats quite yet. I wonder which straw hat body would hold up best on this wet rock in the middle of the Pacific Ocean?


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I'm thinking Milan straw for you Jonesy. Should be much more durable in the wet climate.