Panama Hat Thread

[carouselvic]

Cuenca from ebay

 

[Kkaderly]

I posted this over the Art Fawcett section also!

Just got this one back ... Art did the ribbon for me on my PB Monti .... Dark Maroon is the color! Art didn't do the block as I liked it the way it was but the ribbon really added to it!!! I stole the color from Wineguy (at his permission) as I loved his hat before the "ink episode" ... thanks Wineguy!! The lighting isn't good but the color of the ribbon is correct .... the hat however is a little more of a butter color then what is showing up. Daizawaguy makes taking photos of hats look easy ... I should have just waited till in the morning to take the photos!!!

 

[Chinaski]

I'm sure you're pleased with it - it's a great looking panama, and I really like the Art ribbon. You did good!

 

[malacoda]

VERY nice Kkaderly, looks sharp.

 

[HungaryTom]

New Montecristi from Panama Bob.

By carouselvic at 2010-11-11

Victor,

This is wonderful - both the photo and the hat!!!!!!

Congratulations:

Tom

P.S. Just saw it now!!!

 

[carouselvic]

ebay rolled montecristi=finished optimo montecristi

 

[Lefty]

Equine-colado

 

[Engrishman]

There's something that's been tickling the back of my mind for some time. Does the name "Panama" apply to hats exclusively woven in Ecuador, regardless of style? Because I've noticed quite a variety of styles applicable to the hats themselves. If this is true, "imitation Panamas" woven in other countries (such as the cheap Chinese models) should not be referred to as such, no matter how close they resemble the original.

I guess my question really is: What makes an actual Panama? The choice of material? The place of origin?

 

[Lefty]

There's a lot of info on Brent Black's site.

 

[fmw]

Panamas are hats that are hand woven of paja toquilla, a type of straw that grows on the Equatorial West coast of South America. Most of the weaving is done in Ecuador although there is also a little bit of Panama weaving in Colombia and Peru, Ecuador's two adjoining countries North and South. Anything else isn't a Panama and shouldn't be called one. It should be called a straw hat or whatever type of straw hat it is - Milan (wheat straw), Shantung (paper) etc.

 

[monbla256]

There's something that's been tickling the back of my mind for some time. Does the name "Panama" apply to hats exclusively woven in Ecuador, regardless of style? Because I've noticed quite a variety of styles applicable to the hats themselves. If this is true, "imitation Panamas" woven in other countries (such as the cheap Chinese models) should not be referred to as such, no matter how close they resemble the original.

I guess my question really is: What makes an actual Panama? The choice of material? The place of origin?

The term "Panama Hat" refers to hats woven ONLY in Ecuador from the fibers of the Toquila Palm . They got their name from the fact that they were first exported out of Ecuador by Panamanian merchants and were sold around the word from Panama and as such were described as "Panama" hats. Panama Bob, from whom many of the folks here purchase their Panama's from, has a good site as well.
http://www.panamas.biz/index.html

Here's a pretty comprehensive history of what is a "Panama Hat"

http://www.panamahatline.com/history.html

 

[danofarlington]

There's something that's been tickling the back of my mind for some time. Does the name "Panama" apply to hats exclusively woven in Ecuador, regardless of style? Because I've noticed quite a variety of styles applicable to the hats themselves. If this is true, "imitation Panamas" woven in other countries (such as the cheap Chinese models) should not be referred to as such, no matter how close they resemble the original.

I guess my question really is: What makes an actual Panama? The choice of material? The place of origin?

I think that although strictly speaking, Panama hats are understood as written above, the term has some prestige (better than a "straw hat") and so is loosely used by marketeers to describe a hat in the Panama style. I see a lot of simple, coarse straw hats calld "Panama" both by the sellers and their owners. I don't use the word that way. Straw is straw and finer weave is finer weave. So your use of the term depends on whether you want to use the term strictly or loosely.

 

[monbla256]

I think that although strictly speaking, Panama hats are understood as written above, the term has some prestige (better than a "straw hat") and so is loosely used by marketeers to describe a hat in the Panama style. I see a lot of simple, coarse straw hats calld "Panama" both by the sellers and their owners. I don't use the word that way. Straw is straw and finer weave is finer weave. So your use of the term depends on whether you want to use the term strictly or loosely.

Along the lines of what you said above, I find it interesting that manufacturers even stretch the definition of the word "straw" to include woven paper fabric ! I.E. "Shantung Straw"
Definition of Straw :

•plant fiber used e.g. for making baskets and hats or as fodder
•chaff: material consisting of seed coverings and small pieces of stem or leaves that have been separated from the seeds
•cover or provide with or as if with straw; "cows were strawed to weather the snowstorm"
•pale yellow: a variable yellow tint; dull yellow, often diluted with white
•strew: spread by scattering ("straw" is archaic); "strew toys all over the carpet"
•a thin paper or plastic tube used to suck liquids into the mouth
•of a pale yellow color like straw; straw-colored

Remember the line from the song by Bertolt Brecht in the Three Penny Opera: " ... money makes the world go round "
All said and done, a Pananma hat is made in Ecuador ONLY from the fibers of the Toquila plant regardless of the crease style

as always, Onward thru the Fog

 

[Engrishman]

Thanks for the replies, folks. Do western hat companies make a habit of buying legitimate panamas from Ecuador and slapping their brand onto the hats? For example, this thread (http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?51266-FS-vintage-size-7-1-8-Portis-Panama) refers to a "Portis Panama", but I'm hesitant to take a stab at the offer because a) I'm not familiar with Portis and don't know where they get their hats b) can't find any information on the Portis line c) don't use paypal all that often.

The last thing I'd like to do is buy a panama-style hat advertised as a panama by a western corporation when it was woven someplace else with different materials.

 

[Lefty]

First, that's not a western. Portis hasn't been making hats in quite a while. When they did, they made some really stylish hats, and I'm not sure I've seen a single western Portis (maybe an OR, but not a western that I can recall. I look forward to the quotes of my own postings of western Portises. )

As to westerns, I don't know, but suspect that most aren't actual panamas. I'll let someone else chime on on that.

The seller is legit. He's a long time Lounger with many sales. As to whether or not that's a panama, I don't know. Try PMing Thunder. He may have found more info. about where the hat was made.

Panamas aren't the only good, woven hats. A number of weaves and materials, with a similar look (color), can be found all over the Lounge. Search for words like "baku" and "leghorn". They're not strictly panamas, but they're great hats.

 

[WineGuy]

I I stole the color from Wineguy (at his permission) as I loved his hat before the "ink episode" ... thanks Wineguy!!

Looks Great!!! Wear it with joy K! I've relegated my stained hat to "knock around" status and just put PB on notice that he has to come up with another killer hat for me on par or better.

Just remember these words of wisdom...never change the ink in your fountain pen within 50 feet of your Panama.

 

[monbla256]

Thanks for the replies, folks. Do western hat companies make a habit of buying legitimate panamas from Ecuador and slapping their brand onto the hats? For example, this thread (http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?51266-FS-vintage-size-7-1-8-Portis-Panama) refers to a "Portis Panama", but I'm hesitant to take a stab at the offer because a) I'm not familiar with Portis and don't know where they get their hats b) can't find any information on the Portis line c) don't use paypal all that often.

The last thing I'd like to do is buy a panama-style hat advertised as a panama by a western corporation when it was woven someplace else with different materials.

Your question is a bit confusing as it could be taken to be two questions. First, are you using the term "western" to refer to a style of hat made and sold by many reputable firms ? Or are you using it to refer to a domestic hat firm which sells Panama hats?
As for a "western" style of Panama hat ( one which is a true Panama ) there are not many sold by the major hat firms here in the US. Most folks who buy "western" styled hats like to have the hat be firm and hold it's shape both in crease as well as the brim curl. Many of these "western" style hats have a metal wire sewn in the brim to allow the brim curl to hold its shape.
Most real Panama's are a lot "softer" than the "western" straw hats especially in the brim and do not hold the prerequisate "western" style of curl. Many of the "western" style of straws are also heavily "shellacked" ( I use that word as a verb here, possibly misspelled ) ) to assist in their shape holding which a true Panama is not as such and therefore is much more maleable or "softer", though once blocked or creased, it does hold it's shape. The paper "straw" used in these "western" hats lends itself well to all this and it's cost is less so the retail price for a good one can be less.
There are some reputable sellers of Panama's who do sell a "western" styled hat such as the above refernced Brent Black and Panama Bob. Check them out especially Bob ( he sells some of the dollar value real Panama's and is well known and respected here on this Forum ).
Good luck and Onward thru the Fog

 

[Engrishman]

I should be shot for ambiguity. When I say "Western", I refer to companies located in the North american and European spheres of the Western hemisphere, as understood by economists. Just a note for clarification, really.

 

[monbla256]

I should be shot for ambiguity. When I say "Western", I refer to companies located in the North american and European spheres of the Western hemisphere, as understood by economists. Just a note for clarification, really.

Then, as referenced here previously, get in touch with Panama Bob (aka Robert Weber) @ http://www.panamas.biz/ and choose which of his sale hats you want for your first "real" Panama, and a lot of your questions will be answered. It will be the BEST $30.00 in hat expense you will make. If he's sold out of a style you want, pick another and join the true"in" crowd

 

[Engrishman]

Then, as referenced here previously, get in touch with Panama Bob (aka Robert Weber) @ http://www.panamas.biz/ and choose which of his sale hats you want for your first "real" Panama, and a lot of your questions will be answered. It will be the BEST $30.00 in hat expense you will make. If he's sold out of a style you want, pick another and join the true"in" crowd

Actually, I've already sent Panama Bob a purchase request for a specific on-sale hat last night. One of his selling points was his acquisition of legitimate hats from Ecuador, so it wasn't too difficult a choice to make.

My question posed was more a clarification as to whether other types of straw hats could legitimately be called Panamas or not. I guess the answer is no.