My Search for a Mate is Confined to my Sock Drawer

[jamespowers]

Yeah, who would want that? I want a man who bursts into tears during an emergency and/or stands on a chair screaming "don't kill it! don't kill it!"lol

-Viola

I suppose the Woody Allen and Alan Alda types don't do it for you then.

Regards,

J

 

[Viola]

I suppose the Woody Allen and Alan Alda types don't do it for you then.

Regards,

J

*spittake* EWWW!



-Viola

 

[jamespowers]

*spittake* EWWW!



-Viola

Just checking.

 

[pretty faythe]

Yeah, who would want that? I want a man who bursts into tears during an emergency and/or stands on a chair screaming "don't kill it! don't kill it!"lol

-Viola

lol That visual just reminded my of my best guy friend! He's scared to death of bugs, when I want to annoy him, I'll find a spider and wave it at him (at least when he is in town). Ahhhh, all that I am sure I am missing out with him and his kid since they live in Idaho.

 

[MrNewportCustom]

I asked her what I should do. She said, "Be a jerk, girls like that."

Heh! I've always been the "best friend" who listened to these women while they complained about their respective jerks. But did they once think to dump the guy and go out with a nice guy like me?


Lee
_________________________

It gets old.

 

[SpitfireXIV]

*rolls over bar, mixes martini and carries it to Ms. Spitfire*

thanks, i needed that.

 

[pretty faythe]

Heh! I've always been the "best friend" who listened to these women while they complained about their respective jerks. But did they once think to dump the guy and go out with a nice guy like me?


Lee
_________________________

It gets old.

Perhaps, just a thought, you should dawn the "jerk" hat for a moment and let the girls know that you dont want to be their "friends", that you wanna try to be their man for a moment, and see how that works.
Sometimes, we don't know that you guys are trying to work your way into being more than "friends" when you try to start out as friends as first. Do you know how annoying that can be? Sheesh. Then both of you get stuck in that roll and it can get a lil difficult to get out of it, even if both parties involved may have originally had feelings of a different nature to beging with. But the guy thought, hey I'm gonna act like her "friend" to get into her circle, and the girl thinks that the guy she was crushn on just wants to be friends so she moves on.
Did that make since?
Alrighty then.

 

[PastimeSteve]

Interesting thread

I'm married (13 years this December), so I feel awkward about jumping in to this discussion, but I thought I could contribute...

...because until I met my wife I was a dismal failure at dating and attracting the right women when I was single.

Please don't take any of this as me thinking I'm smarter than anyone else because I'm married -- I'm just trying to help. Marriage has taught me some things. My wife and I have had our fair share of struggles, and a lot of it has to do with my state of mind from my single days.

I think Sunny captured the essence of my advice to the single guys out there. Leadership and confidence are extremely powerful character traits for men (women too). Of course, to embrace "leadership" you have to know what it means to be a leader. There are books for that! You gents with life experience probably already have this one down better than I do.

When I was single and before I met my wife, it was obvious I wasn't comfortable in my own skin. I thought, "hey, I'm a nice guy, why don't women like me?" I was so worried about being "the nice guy" that I forgot what it meant to be a man; to be confident and a leader. And, I didn't recognize at the time that being confident and a leader wasn't dictated by women -- it was dictated by me and who I saw myself as.

I made up for all of this by flooding a woman with compliments and nice things too quickly -- flowers, nice dates, ya know, nice stuff. lol Rightfully so, women got freaked out and ran for the trees, or another guy, or the dreaded jerk.

Now, after years of dealing with my own confidence struggles, I can see a man who lacks confidence and "a comfort in his own skin" a mile away. If I can see it, I know women can.

The other advice I have for the guys is where are you looking for women? Is it a bar? There are better places to look, trust me. My apologies for those of you who met your life long mates at a bar...

Also, guys, be willing to befriend a woman with no strings attached. I believe the greatest romantic relationships spring from friendships. If you're the catch instead of the jerk your friend might be dating, your friend will eventually notice. Of course, she probably won't if you're complaining the whole time about your failures at dating -- something I did with female friends.

Women are amazing blessings and sometimes the best way to realize that is to be their friend instead of their boyfriend. And, if all you've ever been is a woman's friend, well, there could be worse things in life. Besides, women always have other female friends.

Steve

 

[Fletch]

When I was single and before I met my wife, it was obvious I wasn't comfortable in my own skin. I thought, "hey, I'm a nice guy, why don't women like me?" I was so worried about being "the nice guy" that I forgot what it meant to be a man; to be confident and a leader. And, I didn't recognize at the time that being confident and a leader wasn't dictated by women -- it was dictated by me and who I saw myself as.

You're lucky in that you're pretty traditional, and found a mate that shares those values. I'm assuming your ideas of confidence and leadership are pretty simple: a take-charge type. a doer not a talker, always obvious and direct.

Those of us with a more complicated ideal of masculinity (who want to be, say, calm reassuring consensus builders) have to deal with the fact that what a man is is mostly dictated by other men. That includes the definition of a man women will respect.

It's an earned title - you can't just call yourself a man and expect others to treat you thus, men OR women.

 

[PastimeSteve]

Those of us with a more individual idea of their masculinity have to deal with the fact that what a man is is mostly dictated by other men.

Edited for clarity...Well, that's largely true Fletch. But, you can't wait for someone to come along and ordain you a certain way. That seems like a recipe for endless frustration. It's not like men come up to me, as someone 5'6" and small, and say, "hey dude, you're a great man, a true leader."

For example, I'm the last guy who other men come up to and say, "hey, you wanna go hunting?" For some, that kind of invite is proof that they're a "man." That doesn't work for me.

It wasn't until I respected myself that other men (and women) began to show me some respect back. Even now, it's still a fight, but to let myself get fixated on what other people think, based on their own stereotypes, is just a doom and gloom scenario that I'll never win. In fact, no one can ever win that kind of game. However, confidence and leadership transcends this stuff, at least IMHO. In the end, words and artificial titles mean little, it's your actions that matter, and the impact of those actions on others.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you...if so, I offer my apologies.

Steve

 

[farnham54]

Steve,

EXCELLENT post. It always really bothers me to hear people say 'nice guys finish last' or 'girls only like jerks'. That is simply NOT TRUE.

Girls are intelligent. What intelligent creature would want to spend their life with a jerk? None. If the odd one does they are not intelligent.

What attracts a girl to a Jerk (and a guy to a less then kind woman) is CONFIDENCE. Like Steve said, comfort in your own skin. A solid idea of who you are--whether thats a Manly bush man who kills grizzleys with his belt or a city dwelling artist who enjoys fruity drinks--being comfortable with who YOU are, not who people EXPECT you to be, is what attracts people. And it works both ways, too!

So, next time you catch yourself saying "Girls only go for jerks"--Think about that. Why do you figure you feel that way? I'd be willing to guess it's because you got passed over for someone who, to you, seems like a jerk. If I may suggest, a little introspection to ones own insecurities can go a LONG way to getting you into the right frame of mind to find a partner.

Respect is not given, it is earned. You must learn to, and earn the, respect of yourself. Only then will you get that from others.

Cheers
Craig

 

[Samsa]

So, next time you catch yourself saying "Girls only go for jerks"--Think about that. Why do you figure you feel that way? I'd be willing to guess it's because you got passed over for someone who, to you, seems like a jerk. If I may suggest, a little introspection to ones own insecurities can go a LONG way to getting you into the right frame of mind to find a partner.

I think this is a little unfair. It's true that not all - or even a majority - of girls go for jerks. But the sentiment "girls only go for jerks" comes from the frustration inherent in seeing female friends repeatedly go for the wrong sort of guy. I have seen it happen too many times - some women have their own insecurities, which lead them to go for the wrong kind of guy. Or they have issues from their past and are looking for someone like their father (even if the father was abusive). Some women are selfish, or manipulative, or ungrateful, and are attracted to like minded guys....and don't understand why the relationship crashes and burns.

I also don't think it fair to tar every man who utters this phrase with the brush of "insecurity." I suspect the phrase is also uttered often by genuinely nice guys who have had rotten luck in dating. It's true that respect is earned, but this does not mean that every self-respecting guy is going to be free from the frustration of seeing women they are interested in pass them by for the wrong type. Sometimes the problem really is on the other end of the equation.

And please do not read into this a mistrust or dislike of women... most of the women I have met have not shared these characteristics, though some have. I guess I haven't seen it often enough to let this particular maxim pass my lips often, and because I am perfectly happy single - I have no problems being myself, by myself.

 

[GoldLeaf]

some women have their own insecurities, which lead them to go for the wrong kind of guy. Or they have issues from their past and are looking for someone like their father (even if the father was abusive). Some women are selfish, or manipulative, or ungrateful, and are attracted to like minded guys.

Geeze, sounds just like my post

 

[GoldLeaf]

Girls are intelligent. What intelligent creature would want to spend their life with a jerk? None. If the odd one does they are not intelligent.

That isn't true, either. I am a highly intelligent woman that was engaged to an abusive son-of-a-gun. I am lucky that I got out. My choosing to stay in that relationship and get engaged wasn't a measure of my intelligence. It was because I was scared, and had been ground down into the dirt often enough, by him and by other experiences, that I really believed that I didn't deserve better. I believed that if I left, I was so tainted and dirty that no one else would ever want me.

I was an insecure young woman that needed approval desperately when I entered the relationship. The verbal abuse started slowly, I didn't even notice it. By the time I realized something wasn't right, I really thought I deserved it all. Did that make me less smart? No, I was scared and my self esteem and self worth had been totally destroyed. There wasn't much to start with, so he didn't have to work too hard.

I tell this story not because I want sympathy from anyone, but because there are many, many reasons that a intelligent woman would make a poor choice. Don't judge someone so harshly. You have no idea what their background is, or what hell they have gone through.

 

[Viola]

there are many, many reasons that a intelligent woman would make a poor choice. Don't judge someone so harshly. You have no idea what their background is, or what hell they have gone through.

^That.

-Viola

 

[Samsa]

I tell this story not because I want sympathy from anyone, but because there are many, many reasons that a intelligent woman would make a poor choice. Don't judge someone so harshly. You have no idea what their background is, or what hell they have gone through.

Goldleaf has made my point better than I was able to. The stuff of relationships and what makes one person choose a certain mate is a lot more complex than we are probably able to understand, and certainly too complex to sum up in generalizations. The complexity of romance and relationships is what makes them both fun and frustrating.

That being said, it should not be forgotten that many men make the wrong decisions when it comes to their partners... plenty of us guys are guilty of choosing to be with someone for the wrong reasons. I wonder why you never hear women say "all guys go for jerks"? (Though I have heard women say "all the good ones are either married or gay.")

 

[cgab1]

I agree, intelligence has nothing to do with it. Many intelligent women pick the wrong guy (I know quite a few).

cgab

That isn't true, either. I am a highly intelligent woman that was engaged to an abusive son-of-a-gun. I am lucky that I got out. My choosing to stay in that relationship and get engaged wasn't a measure of my intelligence. It was because I was scared, and had been ground down into the dirt often enough, by him and by other experiences, that I really believed that I didn't deserve better. I believed that if I left, I was so tainted and dirty that no one else would ever want me.

I was an insecure young woman that needed approval desperately when I entered the relationship. The verbal abuse started slowly, I didn't even notice it. By the time I realized something wasn't right, I really thought I deserved it all. Did that make me less smart? No, I was scared and my self esteem and self worth had been totally destroyed. There wasn't much to start with, so he didn't have to work too hard.

I tell this story not because I want sympathy from anyone, but because there are many, many reasons that a intelligent woman would make a poor choice. Don't judge someone so harshly. You have no idea what their background is, or what hell they have gone through.

 

[farnham54]

Goldleaf,

My most sincere apologies: I didn't mean to seem to be insulting anyones intelligence. I think I was misunderstood.

You stayed in your relationship out of fear--You didn't necessarily want to be there. You had to.

I was referring to the concept of a girl saying to herself "Y'know, nothing would make my life more complete then to spend it with the biggest jerk I can find. Therefore, I'm conciously deciding to write off all the nice guys and find a jerk!"--No intelligent person would do this.

Many things keep people in a bad relationship (I think 'fear' and 'hope' are of equal strength; fear of what might happen, or hope that it'll get better). That is an unfortunate result of people changing, poor choices, or a plethora of other reasons. I myself was in a terribly abusive (emotionally) relationship; it was a living hell but I was convinced through my own fears and hopes that it was bliss. I've since moved on.

Again, please don't think I was saying "all folks who are in bad relationships are stupid"--that's not the case at all. Quite the opposite is true in many cases--a relationship that is bad really limits one's potential.

Samsa,

You have brought up good points--

But the sentiment "girls only go for jerks" comes from the frustration inherent in seeing female friends repeatedly go for the wrong sort of guy.

Absolutley; in some cases this is very true. But as you said, it's impossible to generalize (which I am aware I am guilty of!)--I think there are many cases, though, where a man scorned due to a lack of confidence becomes convinced that because he is a nice guy, he must finish last. I don't feel this is true at all. Nice guys do NOT always finish last; unconfident or insecure guys generally do. That was the point I was trying to make and I apologize if I offended.

Cheers
Craig

 

[GoldLeaf]

I was referring to the concept of a girl saying to herself "Y'know, nothing would make my life more complete then to spend it with the biggest jerk I can find. Therefore, I'm conciously deciding to write off all the nice guys and find a jerk!"--No intelligent person would do this.

lol

No problem

 

[Samsa]

I don't feel this is true at all. Nice guys do NOT always finish last; unconfident or insecure guys generally do. That was the point I was trying to make and I apologize if I offended.

Nah, no offense. Just putting my two cents in!