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Mother makes child hold sign at roadside...

IndianaGuybrush

One of the Regulars
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232
My parents disciplined me and my brothers when we were growing up. All of us got hit and none of us regret it. Before you read on thinking "ok, here's another case of an older generation not being in touch with the times..." I'm 23, and my brothers are 20 and 17. My parents aren't what I would call conservative by any stretch of the imagination either. However, they raised us with a firm but fair hand, and the rules were simple:

No backtalk. What mom or dad says goes. If you talked back, you got spanked and then sent to your room.
When they told us to do something, we listened. "Put that down!" didn't mean "honey, when you're done playing with that, if it's ok, could you put it down?" it meant put it down, period. When we were called we came. If we didn't come right away we got the 1,2,3 rule. My parents would count out, slowly to 3. If we hadn't come by 3, they came after us, and they were not happy.
Disobedience to any authority figure such as teachers, policemen, camp counselors, relatives, etc. was treated as harshly as disobedience to my parents.

Those were the abbreviated rules in our house. I don't smoke, do drugs, and I've never been arrested (or broken any law sever enough to call for arrest), and the same goes for my brothers. We appreciate everything our parents have done and continue to do for us, and none of us regret a moment of it.

For comparison's sake, and just to show you that I don't think it's necessary perse, to hit your kids: My little sister is 10 years old now, and she has NEVER been spanked in her life. While she is a bit spoiled (first girl after 3 boys.. come on!) she is by no means a brat. She is incredibly well behaved, and in a lot of ways extremely mature. Now, that might be because she had 5 people watching her every move since she was born (hard to get away with anything when you've got that many eyes on you) but whatever the reason, I think we can say that she is doing fine. Again, take from this what you will.

I think time-outs and standing the in the corner and non-physical punishments are all well and good, but they won't do the job alone. The reason my brothers and I behaved, and the reason we tried hard in school, and the reason that we tried at anything at all until we got old enough to want to do things for ourselves, was because we were afraid of disappointing our parents if we did otherwise. Sure, it hurt to get spanked, but it hurt a lot more seeing the look on my dad's face when I got sent home with bad news. I would cry before he even said anything, and I wasn't crying because I was about to get hit, I was crying because I knew he was disappointed. In fact, many times, getting hit stopped the crying. At that point I had payed for my crime, and I kenw I would be forgiven. Some of the worst memories I have were from things that I did where I didn't get hit. My dad was so disgusted he just told me to get out of his sight. Those were the nights that I would stay awake for hours feeling sick about what I had done, eaten away by guilt. In other words, your kids have to care about how you feel. They have to not WANT to disappoint you, and in order for that to happen, there has to be a solid foundation of trust, love, and yes a little fear. A little fear is good in a child, because a child without fear is a menace.

I got a lot more involved than I originally intended to, but I guess it's a topic that I feel very strongly about. I love the person I am today, and I give my parents full credit for creating and molding that person. My one hope is that I can someday approach being as good a parent as the ones I was blessed with.
 

Andykev

I'll Lock Up
Bartender
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It may work

The only "dicipline" of this type I have used on my son, is to remind him that if he continues to "blow off" or ignore his studies, the only job he will have is in some fast food restaurant. No offense to anyone in that industry, but there is nothing wrong with showing the young man the realities of life. Work hard, make something of yourself, and you will achieve a good standard of living. That with some luck these days I guess. I have also casually mentioned to him as we drive thru various neighborhoods, some ok, some wealthy, some poor..that he alone can choose what he wants in life. It is up to him after all. Plus I have expectations. Never hit the kid, maybe lectured a bit. Oh, and take aways...TV, going out, restrictions on the internet sort of thing. There has to be consequences. So, was that woman wrong. Not really. Better than physically beating the kid. Hold em accountable, not hold still for a beating!
 
D

Deleted member 259

Guest
Well, just for the record - I was never spanked as a child, and I'd like to think that I turned out just fine.

My Grandfather hit me, twice that I remember for "talking back"- and while it was nothing to constitute abuse or real violence, it didn't teach me to avoid that behavior, it just taught me to avoid my grandfather.

Everyone has their own methods, and some children won't respond to certian methods - for example, when I was a child, grounding my would have been useless because I would have been out the door before you could blink.

But just as IndianaGuybrush said, the real kicker was the look of dissapointment on my mom's face.
 

BellyTank

I'll Lock Up
The beating of children is not a measured thing- if it was that would be more cruel and premeditated. As it is, it's an irrational adult response- lashing out- taking out your frustration on yer kids and calling it discipline. In retrospect it's discipline but at the time, it was most likely something the parent regretted, unless the parent is a psychopath. How can an adult say to a kid "...do that and I'll beat you"...? it's crazy. Or the adult thinks to himself "...if he does that again, I'll hit him twice..."- premeditated violence, not measured discipline.

The result of faulty, inconsistent and careless parenting I would say.

I was never beaten either and it seems strange that others actually defend their parents for such behaviour...

I guess if you didn't get beaten by yer folks, you end up as a liberal..eh (?);)

B
T
 

IndianaGuybrush

One of the Regulars
Messages
232
There is a line between disciplining your kids and beating them, and it's not a particularly fine line either. If my dad came up to my room and smacked my behind with a belt for calling my mom "stupid" and then told me to think about what I had done and stay in my room until dinner, thats discipline. If my dad backhands me in the face for talking back, thats beating.
The effectiveness of physical discipline lies mostly in it's symbolic meaning. After all, how much does it really hurt to get spanked? Not all that much, most kids get hurt a lot worse climbing trees or running around a playground. I've never been spanked to the point of not being able to sit down or any other similar injury. In fact, the most common physical discipline in my house was called, by all of us, a 'Pow'. A pow was usually a smack on the back of the hand. If you did something bad my mom would reach out, grab your hand, and give you a 'pow' while saying 'no!' or something like that. The pow just served to punctuate, it didn't actually hurt, but it was physical discipline. I can probably count the times I've been spanked on 1 hand, maybe with a tiny little help from hand number 2.
BT - I agree that the beating of children isn't a premeditated thing, but the physical disciplining of children is. My parents have told me that they would discuss each and every instance that my brothers and I were hit before they happened. Both parents had to agree that what we did was deserving of getting spanked, and it wasn't an easy decision. Also, it bears noting that there really is an age limit on spanking. It doesn't really work to spank an 13 year old when he comes home for getting in a fight. I'm pretty sure the age that my brothers and I stopped getting spanked was around 8. After that the punishments tapered off to the removal of priveleges like going out or watching TV.
I guess it's impossible to paint everyone with the same brush. No matter how we'd like to believe that there is a set formula for how to raise good kids, I think what really counts is having parents who PAY ATTENTION. Pay attention to their kids, to what works, to what doesn't. Parents who love their kids will pay attention, and parents who pay attention will raise good kids... most of the time.

PS - I said pay attention, not lavish with attention. There is a difference.
 

BellyTank

I'll Lock Up
I guess there's a major difference in reasoning and opinion between those that DID and those who DIDN'T get spanked/beaten. That was only my opinion but I can't see beating kids as doing any good at all. I can see that it will make those who were beaten have a tendency to want to do the same to their own kids.

They're just kids for Pete's sake!
Pick on someone yer own size and mentality I say!:)

B
T
 

IndianaGuybrush

One of the Regulars
Messages
232
I guess it just comes down to a difference of opinion. I don't think spanking and beating are the same thing. Maybe it's semantic, maybe it's just a difference in perception.

I don't consider myself either particularly left or right, I'd say a nice even mix, with a slight liberal favor.
 

Andykev

I'll Lock Up
Bartender
Messages
4,119
Location
The Beautiful Diablo Valley
Its all about motivation

Reminds me of an old Irish Joke:

A man buys a mule from a farmer. The farmer promises that this is the best mule ever born. The mule will do anything you ask, if treated with kindness.

The man takes the mule home, and hitches it to the plow. It won't budge. Not a bit.

The man strokes the mule, sings to it, scratches it's ear. Nothing. Won't even take food as incentive.

The man is furious, he's been rooked.

Back he goes to the farmer, demanding his money back, " YOU'VE CHEATED ME! THE DAMN MULE WON'T BUDGE!"

The farmer, with a twinkle in his eye, says to the man "You've done someting wrong, as that is the best mule in all of Ireland!"

Says the man. " Oh, you've robbed me! I've sung, coaxed, petted, pulled, I've even danced for the bloody stupid mule, but he won't budge!!"

Says the farmer, "Ok, I'll just come down to have a look."

So the farmer follows the man back to the mule to see for himself. As they arrive, the mule still stands hitched to the plow, not having moved an inch!

"See! Just as I've told you, he's not moved a bit. I want me money back!"

So the farmer goes over, picks up a big log, and wacks the mule right between the eyes! The mule starts to plow.

"What are you doing!?!?!??!?" I thought you said to treat him with kindness!

"That I did. But first, you have to get his attention".;)
 

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